Betel Nuts

[RoboCop]

Anyone have any experience on these? I bought some betel nut chew packets from an online source is there any method that you are supposed to use for chewing these? It comes already mixed and rdy to chew but I was wondering if there is anythign I should know about them. I only chewed one so far with no real effects, are you supposed to swallow the liquid that build up while chewing or swallow it? Any sites that explain the method of use well? because erowid doesn't.

[BA]

Here's something at erowid


http://www.erowid.org/experiences/su...etel_Nut.shtml

[BA]

Betel quid chewing has been claimed to produce a sense of well-being, euphoria, warm sensation of the body, sweating, salivation, palpitation, heightened alertness and increased capacity to work. These effects suggest that betel quid chewing affects predominantly the central and autonomic nervous systems. Several studies have been conducted to elucidate the central and autonomic effects of betel quid chewing. The results are: (1) betel quid chewing increased the heart rate with onset within 2 minutes, maximal effect within 4-6 minutes and an average duration of 16.8 minutes. The cardio-acceleratory response was more prominent for fresh and occasional chewers than for habitual chewers; (2) betel quid chewing increased the skin temperature with onset and duration similar to a cardio-acceleratory response. The hyperthermic effect was abolished by atropine and partly inhibited by propranolol. (3) Betel quid chewing had no effect on simple reaction time but shortened the choice reaction time. (4) Betel quid chewing produced widespread cortical desynchronization of EEG. (5) Chewing of one or two betel quids attenuated the sympathetic skin response while continued consumption of more than two betel quids affected the RR interval variation. (6) Plasma concentrations of noradrenaline and adrenaline were elevated during betel quid chewing. These studies have confirmed several effects claimed by betel quid users. The effects of betel quid chewing appeared to be habit-related and dose-dependent. Although arecoline has been thought to be responsible for several effects of betel quid chewing, the present data suggest a role also played by sympathetic activation.

[RoboCop]

Yea erowid experiences is the first palce I went but I could never find a guide to doing it, What I got are called parag sopari chews or something like that, there is no leaf or anythign just smal red 'rocks' Im sure since they sell this as chew I don't need to add anythign to it like when you order only betel nuts am I correct? Are you supposed to spit like tobacco chew?

[jarka]

I've been thinking about betel nuts lately but I haven't seen them anywhere yet. I'll do some searching soon..

[thydarkprevails]

pop em in your cheek by your gums...and whenever you start swallowing a lot of juice..chew as ya please.

[OneDiaDem]

Alrightythen. I have a whole bag of these and had no idea what they were for. I forgot I even had them in my apothecary chest until I saw this post, lol. I would like to hear more about experiences with these. The ones I have have been sliced into very thin wafers. Pretty cool looking too. Hard as rocks tho, lol.</font>

[Turricaine]

SWIM recently made a drug when he combined arecoline with dichlorophenyl group in 1,4-conjugate fashion. It is a potent inhibitor but is not fun in the classical sense.

[OneDiaDem]

Heres a picture of the sliced betel nuts I have.</font>

[Turricaine]

Yes SWIM picked up some betal nuts at an Indian Grocer. He got 100g of 'Whole Supari' for 1 GBP. They are hard as rock though!

[Snow White]

its a very common thing in India - you get them flavoured with mint ...some are softer. they just taste nice.


the hard ones - i never ate so many of them to notice a difference!

[OneDiaDem]

Ok, broke down and tried the quid with a big wad in my cheek, nadda, nothin, zip. Didnt feel worth the time I kept them in my mouth.</font>

[Dr_H]

My ex girlfriend is from Guam and it is pretty common to chew betel nuts there. I asked her to bring me some when she visited and she did. I got 7 that still had the husk on. The husk is kinda like a cocunut husk about an 1"thick and super fiberous. It took me about 20 min to get into the 1st one. I bought powdered lime at an Asian mart near my house. This is i believe just powdered limestone with water added until it had a playdough consistency. I am a plant collector and have quite a collection and one is the betel leaf plant. It is related to the pepper plant and is a vine. The leaves have these little clear dots that turn black. The little dots exude out of the leaf and turn black as it oxidates (does not taste hardly at all). The leaf by it self tastes just like raw hotdogs for the fisrt min(I am not kidding) and then takes a spicey turn simmilar to black pepper.


So now I have all my ingreadients and I set out for my experiment. I lay a leaf on the table and put some of the lime paste in it (too much i find out later) and sprinkle the nut pieces (I smashed the nut between pieces of newspaper with a sledge hammer) Then I roll up the leaf and put it in my cheek. At first i just taste the raw hotdog flavor from the leaf and then it turns spicey. The spicey bit becomes pretty intense and starts to hurt so I move the quid to the other cheek for awhile. I swallowed some of the juice and found out later that people in Guam spit and do not swallow the juices. It starts to hurt again so i move it back to the 1st cheek. The whole time I have this grimmace on my face that my roommate finds amusing. After an hour I have moved and chewed the quid enough that is now tough to keep together. I can take no more of the pain so I spit it all out and notice that I may have a tiny buzz but I think it may actually be endorphins released from grimmacing so long. My cheek and gum had chemical burns from the lime that lasted for three days and was extreemly painful. I found out that in Guam they use the ash from a plant they burnfor the lime. I also found out that the lime i used should have been mixed with more water to form a watery paste and not put in the leaf as chunks of playdough. I have since tried it again and watered down the lime and did not notice much in the way of effects. So I check this one off the list . . .Next.

[aMorphius]

The latest issue of "Science News" (January 15 Vol.167, no.3) Has an
article reporting on several medical research articles that have linked
betel nut chewing to an "Asian epidemic of oral cancer"! Sounds like
chewing tobaco as far as the health risks are concerned.

[Dr_H]

I just read the article that aMorphius was talking abouthttp://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20050115/bob10.aspand this is one point in it that I think is not the nut but the lime.


"Of greatest concern, however, is a condition called oral submucous fibrosis, which frequently leads to mouth cancer. Oral submucous fibrosis causes permanent cell changes in mouth tissues. Eventually, "the skin of the cheek becomes hard as a brick," and people with the condition become unable to open their mouths, says Sylvie-Louise Avon of Laval University in Quebec City. She described betel-related oral lesions in the April 2004 Journal of the Canadian Dental Association after observing a growing incidence of such cases among Asian immigrants in Toronto. "


I had pretty severe chemical burns from the lime to my cheek and gum and I'm willing to bet that it is the continued chemical burns that would probably cause this condidion.


I sent my suggestion to the editor of the article above and will post their comment if they respond.

[Dr_H]

Here is a copy of the letter to the editor.


My name is Sean H. and I live in northern California. I tried chewing betel nut last year and my experience may shed some light on the situation. I have a Piper betle plant and I procured a few betel nuts from a Guamanian friend. I purchased lime in an asian market. The lime was pink with a playdough consistency and I believe it was just powdered limestone with water added. I placed a few small chunks of the lime on the leaf and then added pieces of nut which I had crushed with a hammer. I then rolled up the leaf and stuck it in my cheek.
I should mention that a small piece of the betel leaf tastes just like a piece of raw hotdog (no I am not kidding) at first and then a few moments later it takes on a spicey pepper flavor.
At first the quid tasted like hotdog and then the peppery quality emerged and grew stronger until it was actually painful. At this point I am thinking that the people that usually chew this probably have some high tollerence to spice, because it it really starting to hurt by now, but mostly like a strong pepper would. I switched cheeks a few times and after about an hour I had to take it out thinking that I am just a whimp when it comes to spicey foods. I did get a bit warmer but mostly I think I just got an endorphin rush from the constant grimmace on my face. Afterwards I noticed that I had some pretty strong chemical burns on my cheek and gum where the quid had rested and it was pretty soar for about 3days. I believe this was due to the high ph of the lime.
The article said "Oral submucous fibrosis causes permanent cell changes in mouth tissues. Eventually, "the skin of the cheek becomes hard as a brick." I think that this may actually be a result of the lime used to "activate" the betel nut. I think that with constant chemical burns to the cheek it would possibly develope into "Oral submucous fibrosis". Maybe a study could be conducted on the various limes used. I hope that this helps.
Sean


If they respond I will post it here.

[aMorphius]

Dr H, I appreciate your research on this subject. I think you definitely
have a point! Lime is pretty caustic and definitely can cause the burns you
describe. On the other hand, Coca eaters of Peru also use lime in their
chewing. I wonder if they experience some of the same problems?

[Dr_H]

I found this on the net on a site about coca.


The leavesmust be chewed with a little bit of the chemical "lime" (in English). This is not "lime juice," of course, but the chemical lime, also known as calcium oxide. It is sold in the marketplace, alongside the coca leaves, in the form of little stones. The stones come in varying shapes (usually like a miniature cigar / turd), a small ball, or a spiral), & varing shades of light grey to dark grey to charcoal black. They make the stones by burning plants (banana tree leaves), then mixing the ashes with water & solidifying them.

The lime / calcium oxide is called "cal" in Spanish. The native Quechua- and Aymará-speaking Indians call it by three different names (at least in and between Cuzco and La
Paz): "llijta," "llipta," and "llupta". So take your pick.

Anyway, what you do is put a little bundle of the leaves into your mouth (about 6 at a time), chew them a bit & wait until they are completely wet with saliva, and then nibble off a tiny bit of llipta with your front teeth. (Just a tiny bit!!! If you injest too much you'll get nauseated & vomit.) The llipta/llijta/llupta activates the small amounts of cocaine in the leaves. Lime-rich materials such as burnt seashells or a cereal are used to promote the separation of the leaf's active alkaloid.



So there are a few choices of lime to use and I think the important thing about it is it's ph.

[Bodhisattva500]

does anyone know how many nuts or grams is standard for a dose?

[9-thc4me]

Sapari is the name for a blend of mints and sweets in southeast asia, all the ones I ran into there have about half betel nut in them. Usually a few seeds is enough for a feeling of stimulation. As for a standard dose, I don't really think there is one for these.

[42itis]

It is safer to make a tea from the nuts, but dont drink a lot of it. My experience with it was similar to others first time got a noticeable effect after that just digestive problems. The prepared soft chews are probably better but this entheogen can only take you so far, it has a lot of health risks for the amount of buzz it gives.

[loveleaf]

I'm pretty sure that you always need lime to make it work, but dont use too much! I mixed a 50/50 lime/betel powder combination and put that in my cheek, and after a while it started to tingle a little, and a little while later i took it out, and realized that the tingling was it burning the inside of my mouth. it was very sore for 2 days afterwards.Edited by: loveleaf

[Bodhisattva500]

what kind of lime is best to get and how many nuts?

[genaro]

yep I ate some 4-5g (note that dose around 8-10g can be lethal)crushed betel nuts once (normally you have to chew them for 30min with lime and then split out but I couldn't because of the awful taste)...so I didn't really experiencedgood effects (I think the right method is to chew them, eating them wasn't really stimulating)...it would feel more like some cefeine overdose.


I felt like if my body temperature had rise, I was somewhat stimulated for 15 minutes maybe but not in a pleasurable way, better say I was nervous rather than stimulated, and then I would feel some lack of energy, some tachycardia too if I remember well, and no ophoria.Edited by: genaro

[Benga]

ok this answer is way late but Pan Parag is a ready made pan massala mix, usually with a little tobacco, the kind of chewing gum version of the "PAN" which is a mix of spice betel nut and what not rolled in a fresh betel leaf.


Pan Parag I used to chew in india, well you don't actually chew it rather place it your mouth and let the mucosa absob, spitting out the red juice everyonce in a while. Very mild stimulant. Fresh betel is stronger.