Opinions - The Anti_american Alliance and 9/11

[Trebor]

On a website where one asks a question and answers one, I was met with this;

The anti-American alliance is made up of self-loathing liberals who blame the Americans for every ill in the Third World, and conservatives suffering from power-envy, bitter that the world's only superpower can do what it likes without having to ask permission. The truth is that America has behaved with enormous restraint since September 11. Remember, remember. Remember the gut-wrenching tapes of weeping men phoning their wives to say, "I love you," before they were burned alive. Remember those people leaping to their deaths from the top of burning skyscrapers. Remember the hundreds of firemen buried alive. Remember the smiling face of that beautiful little girl who was on one of the planes with her mother. Remember, remember - and realise that America has never retaliated for 9/11 in anything like the way it could have. So a few al-Qaeda tourists got locked without a trial in Camp X-ray? Pass the Kleenex. So some Afghan wedding receptions were shot up after they merrily fired their semi-automatics in a sky full of American planes? A shame, but maybe next time they should stick to confetti. I love America, yet America is hated. America is hated because it is what every country wants to be - rich, free, strong, open, optimistic. Or do you really think the USA is the root of all evil? Tell it to the loved ones of the men and women who leaped to their death from the burning towers. Tell it to the nursing mothers whose husbands died on one of the hijacked planes, or were ripped apart in a collapsing skyscraper. And tell it to the hundreds of young widows whose husbands worked for the New York Fire Department. To our shame, George Bush gets a worse press than Saddam Hussein. Remember, remember, September 11. One of the greatest atrocities in human history was committed against America! No, do more than remember. Never forget.


I replied with;

hahahahahahha, America? Free? What about the Patriot Act? You know, the one that allows the Federal Government to invade your rights. Your rights which are guarnenteed to you by your Conbstitution. The same constitution that you people try to enforce on the rest of the world. Also, are you aware that Bush is now able to declare Martial Law and no one can stop him? All he needs is the smell of a possible attack at some point in the future, even if it's a hundred years from now he can do it. That means he is capable of stopping an election from happening until he sees fit.

And yes, I do feel sorry for those who lost their lives. I really do. A friend of my parents lost their duaghter, their only child. And then you have the nerve to say I don't care? Fuck you1 Fuck your fascisyt country! and Fuck those who bomb it!


Opinions and thoughts are welcome.

[~lostgurl~]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...q=loose+change

This is the link to Loose Change.... The true story of 911 that the media hid from many for so long. it is over an hour long but is a MUST SEE by anyone interested in politcs or 911. There are so many evidence based facts crammed into this documentry that the mind boggles.......

[Allez]

No, no it's not. Loose Change has been debunked more times then...... Saddam's WMD's (oh, topical).

So a few al-Qaeda tourists got locked without a trial in Camp X-ray? Pass the Kleenex. So some Afghan wedding receptions were shot up after they merrily fired their semi-automatics in a sky full of American planes?

The conservative estimate for civilian casualties in Iraq is round about 50,000. Strange to see an American twisting the facts.

As much as I despise wacko conspiricy theorists, and dear God to I despise them, I'm really starting to consider that this war really was for profit. Even if they did believe Iraq had nuclear weapons, we know North Korea do, and that guy is a fucking psycho. He makes Saddam look like..... Betty Ford (two in a row). And chances are Iran are on their way there too. And if Iran get a nuclear bomb, I'm confident that'll be the end of the world as we know it.

[BeetleJuice]

I hope iran DOES get the A-bomb, for no other reason then to stick it to the real facists and tyrants. The US has funked with nearly all the nations in the mid east,i reacon its time for over 100 years of payback

Reputation Comments on this post:

ignorant irony

[Pinkavvy]

Originally Posted by BeetleJuice

I hope iran DOES get the A-bomb, for no other reason then to stick it to the real facists and tyrants. The US has funked with nearly all the nations in the mid east,i reacon its time for over 100 years of payback

Now, those are stupid words. Advocation of innocent life being lost because of the actions of the government .... makes you as bad as the government you hate.

[Riconoen {UGC}]

I agree, beetlejuice that was way out of line, I understand that you dont like what the us has done in the middle east and niether do I, but to wish death upon millions is a terrible thing to say.

[BeetleJuice]

I dont wish death upon anyone,all i ment was kind of a karma thing.you get what you give, if you know what i mean.

[BeetleJuice]

I dont agree with anyones death, all i ment it as was a karma type of thing, if karma truly exists, then its inevitable. also about the "stick it to em" statement i ment it as if iran does get a nuke, then they can say, haha we got the A bomb, whatcha gonna do about it, oviusly nothing, since N korea has em n noone is doing anything about that situation.
I consider myself a realist buddist so every life from a redneck american to an enraged terrorist is sacred. (cept for damn spiders and bees)

Sorry for the double post, was ment to be in one but something happened with firefox.


-EDIT--I got some negitive feedback for my comments ,which is cool since i dident explain the motive behind of my comments.
Hope next time people chill out and wait for an explanation if somthing i say offends others.

Also sorry if i did offend people but it was a misconstrude opinion.
Peace

[darawk]

The anti-American alliance is made up of self-loathing liberals who blame the Americans for every ill in the Third World, and conservatives suffering from power-envy, bitter that the world's only superpower can do what it likes without having to ask permission. The truth is that America has behaved with enormous restraint since September 11. Remember, remember. Remember the gut-wrenching tapes of weeping men phoning their wives to say, "I love you," before they were burned alive. Remember those people leaping to their deaths from the top of burning skyscrapers. Remember the hundreds of firemen buried alive. Remember the smiling face of that beautiful little girl who was on one of the planes with her mother. Remember, remember - and realise that America has never retaliated for 9/11 in anything like the way it could have. So a few al-Qaeda tourists got locked without a trial in Camp X-ray? Pass the Kleenex. So some Afghan wedding receptions were shot up after they merrily fired their semi-automatics in a sky full of American planes? A shame, but maybe next time they should stick to confetti. I love America, yet America is hated. America is hated because it is what every country wants to be - rich, free, strong, open, optimistic. Or do you really think the USA is the root of all evil? Tell it to the loved ones of the men and women who leaped to their death from the burning towers. Tell it to the nursing mothers whose husbands died on one of the hijacked planes, or were ripped apart in a collapsing skyscraper. And tell it to the hundreds of young widows whose husbands worked for the New York Fire Department. To our shame, George Bush gets a worse press than Saddam Hussein. Remember, remember, September 11. One of the greatest atrocities in human history was committed against America! No, do more than remember. Never forget.

Greatest atrocities in human history? Who is he kidding? There is a reason Bin Laden attacked us, and its because we have on numerous occasions oppressed his people using violence, or supporting other states in their use of violence against him.

If anything, it's the "terrorists" that have shown restraint. The U.S. only has not retaliated per se, because we can't fucking find anyone that was actually connected to the attacks, so we attack a country that is more or less innocent, Iraq. And sure Sadaam Hussein wasn't exactly a saint, he did some very bad stuff indeed....in the 80's....when he was...U.S. supported...but only now do we actually hear about his mass genocides, torture, etc...Which he, for the most part, stopped doing 20 years ago.

The Iraq war was for profit, there is no other explanation for it. Afghanistan may not have been - but Iraq certainly was.

[Allez]

All things considered, Iraq was a good example of a Middle Eastern society. Something the US should want to see in Iran and Syria. Shame they fucked it up.

I got some negitive feedback for my comments

Read the rule's. There's no arguing an opinion opposed by the powers that be. Next time you'll be disappeared, commie. /sarcasm

[BeetleJuice]

"Read the rule's. There's no arguing an opinion opposed by the powers that be. Next time you'll be disappeared, commie. /sarcasm"
I dont get your sarcasm.
Wtf did i say that was so wrong? Most smart people would have had an idea of what i was saying.Did i say iran should use their nukes to kill people? if iran does get a nuke its THEIR nuclear deterrent from a seeminly more likely invasion\attack. and ild rather be a commie then a capitalist.

[El Calico Loco]

Iran has every reason to be angry. The Persians have a racial memory of their humiliation at Thermopylae. America (ie the CIA) overthrew their democratically elected government and installed a brutal dictator (the Shah) in the fifties.

At the same time, those responsible for 9/11 (whether you believe it was Arab terrorists or our own government) deserve scorn. They punished innocents for the action of governments. They should be ashamed.

Nothing will improve in this world until all people everywhere understand the conclusion arrived by all the oldest religions (Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Buddhism, Confucianism, Daoism, Hinduism): Love Thy Neighbor. Hatred cannot be defeated by further hatred and vengeance. Love is the law.


ECL

[El Calico Loco]

Originally Posted by BeetleJuice

ild rather be a commie then a capitalist.

I wouldn't. The two most murderous regimes in the history of the world were communist. They proved, once and for all, that rationalism and atheism is no panacea for the evils done my men. The problem is not religion, but ideology. The communists murdered almost as many people in the twentieth century as the Inquisition managed in its entire 700-year history.

Capitalists and communists make the same error in economics: they treat land (ie natural resources) as if it were just another form of capital. It's not. It makes more sense to combine labor and capital than land and capital.

Economics in Six Minutes


ECL

[Allez]

Originally Posted by Allez

Read the rule's. There's no arguing an opinion opposed by the powers that be. Next time you'll be disappeared, commie. /sarcasm

I got a negative report for this. Ah, sweet irony.

[BeetleJuice]

you also gave a negitive report.

[Nature Boy]

Originally Posted by Allez

I got a negative report for this. Ah, sweet irony.

That's hardly surprising. Your attitude is bordering on trollish to say the least. Not everyone's out to get you but keep thinking that way and your stay here will disimprove as it continues.

[BeetleJuice]

"Nothing will improve in this world until all people everywhere understand the conclusion arrived by all the oldest religions (Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Buddhism, Confucianism, Daoism, Hinduism): Love Thy Neighbor. Hatred cannot be defeated by further hatred and vengeance. Love is the law."

Thats Baptism under fire.
The truest words in this thread.

[Nature Boy]

The oldest religions also contradict themselves to various degrees. It's all about perceptions. The most religious person in the world could be the most loving, caring individual in existence. They could also be the cruelest, most sadistic person too though. Humans are assholes naturally. Whatever system or method is put into practice, some idiot will always come along and ruin it. Even if you look at how some of the great apes act, our closest cousins on the evolutionary ladder, you can see how with intelligence comes ignorance. They get brought up to by their mothers for years and in their adolescense they form posses and attack the more vulnerable apes amongst them. So like us.

[El Calico Loco]

Originally Posted by Nature Boy

The oldest religions also contradict themselves to various degrees. It's all about perceptions.

You'll get no argument from me. The trouble is this: one brilliant person (Hillel, Christ, Buddha, etc) comes up with a great idea and inspires others to follow. These followers then embellish and distort, like a game of Telephone over generations. Politicians then realize that they can use this religion that's grown to further their own self-serving ends, and The Word is distorted even further. By the time a few hundred years have gone by, the religion is a twisted reflection of its original ideas.

Take the Bible: it's a crazy mix of ancient Semetic paganism, the Hebrews' first attempt at a civil law, the (embellished) story of Jesus, and tales of the End Times; never mind all the stuff the church decided to leave out at the Council of Nicea. Modern Christians - particularly American fundamentalists - pick and choose from it in a sort of "Cafeteria Christianity", taking those things that reinforce their prejudices (godhatesfags.com) while leaving out those that seem inconveinient in our modern day (godhatesshrimp.com). Never mind that Christ did away with the 600-some-odd laws of the Mosaic tradition in the form of a much simpler New Covenant with only two commandments: Love God and Love Others as Yourself. Christians who quote the Old Testament to argue that homosexuals are going to Hell, tattoos should be illegal, or whatever else are out to lunch.

Perhaps what Jefferson said about governments is true about religions as well. Perhaps they need a new prophet every couple hundred years to shake things up and get rid of the crap.

But the fact remains: for all of their mistakes and contradictions, all the religions mentioned do, at some point, restate The Golden Rule in their own way. It seems to be a common theme across all races and cultures. Seeing as how many religions are an outgrowth of old traditions (ie, things learned by primitive man through trial and error), I'd say "Love Thy Neighbor" is a fairly strong rule-utilitarian ethical system.


ECL

[Riconoen {UGC}]

Also, if anyones read the old and new testaments together you'll notice god is a veangeful dictator who rules the universe with an iron fist in the old but then without explanation he becomes a merciful infinatly wise bieng who will forgive us all for our sins in the new.

[BeetleJuice]

Maybe he became a buddist in between his books lol.
Yea there are alot of contridictions in most holy writings but like loco said,the basic idealism's of them is where its at(peace,love and respect).The rest is just details and distortions nowadays.