Ololiuqui-Anyone ever tried it? Better than hawaiian baby woodrose or morning glory?

[Powdered Sugar]

SWIM just ordered some Ololiuqui and was wondering if anyone out there has tried it. is it any good is it beter then morning glories or HBWR, does it have the same side effects, , and does any one have preferance on how to take it.

Thank You

[radiometer]

"Ololiuhqui, sometimes applied to morning glory, is the Nahuatl word for the seeds of Turbina corymbosa (river corymbosa), a closely related plant." - pharmako/gnosis - Pendell

He goes on to say that morning glory is about 5 times more potent than Ololiuhui.

[Akewstick]

He goes on to say that morning glory is about 5 times more potent than Ololiuhui.

Let's say (hypothetically) that it had zero nausea factor, then it'd be better than morning glory, cause even if it's 5 times less potent, you could take 10 times as much and be fine, right? In this case, ololiuhqui would be twice as good as MGs.

My point is, it's not just a question of potency, it's a question of how much LSA SWIY can get inside SWIYself before it gets to the point of being uncomfortable because there's too much other nasty shit inside SWIYself along with the alkaloids.

Sorry I don't have the answer, all i'm saying is "MGs are 5 times more potent" dosen't really tell us anything.

[radiometer]

Doesn't tell us anything?

I misread your post a bit (as I will freely admit I do a lot lately, I'm working on it) so I've taken the liberty of editing this post somewhat. As I read it, you thought my post was saying that Morning Glory was better than Ololiuqui because of potency, but that is not the case, I was merely mentioning the fact as I had read it, not drawing a conclusion from it.

The answer sought by the original poster is subjective and will differ by the individual depending on what they are looking for (edit - The original poster has now said that the desired characteristic was less "side effects"). And certainly for some individuals, potency might be a variable in this question. For instance, many people prefer the more potent A. nervosa over I. violacea because less seeds are needed. Clearly, such individuals think HBWR is better because of its potency. So I thought it might be worthwhile to post.

Anyway, I was a bit puzzled as to why my answer was so useless as to cause to you reply just to say so. Oftentimes I will make a simple post on a thread such as this and then start further research. Here is some further difference I discovered has been reported:

"The same alkaloids occur in both I. violacea and T. corymbosa, and in the same relative proportions. The difference between Turbina and Ipomoea is the presence of lysergol in the former and ergometrine (ergonovine) in the latter" - Pendell

[Powdered Sugar]

I saw a site that said it has the best trip with none of the side effects that come with MG & HBWR seeds.

[Thirdedge]

Thats BS about MG being more potent. Swim has felt an effect similar to 10 HBWR from 30 Rivea seeds. It would take about 250 MG seeds to get these effects. Also, the Rivea had very little nausea in comparison to the other two.
These seeds are much smaller than HBWR so the total mass to be consumed would be similar. The lack of Nausea makes these seeds (Rivea) far superior in Swims opinion.
Just be carefull and start with a lower dose than swim, as some literature states these as somewhat poisoness.

[radiometer]

It's interesting how experiential data can often vary from theory. I think it's safe to say that the research which went into Pendell's books is solid.

One is assuming that the potencies listed in the given reference refer to potency by weight, not by # of seeds. Did SWIY weigh these seeds to which SWIY refers, so that he may give a comparison by weight?

Pendell also included this very wise advice in his chapter on Morning Glory:

"The methodology for experimentation should be the same as when testing a new mushroom for edibility: start small. See how well your body endures the poisons, and proceed from there. As the incautious mycophage has long ago been weeded out from their fraternity, mushroom-hunters are a good group to learn from."

[Powdered Sugar]

swim was thinking of putting some ground up Rivea seed with some HBWR powder extract he made in a capsule and maybe adding some Guarana. does anyone know what a good dose of rivea would be if mixing with the extract?

[Thirdedge]

Originally Posted by Powdered Sugar

swim was thinking of putting some ground up Rivea seed with some HBWR powder extract he made in a capsule and maybe adding some Guarana. does anyone know what a good dose of rivea would be if mixing with the extract?

That would depend on the amount of HBWR. When swiy say's extract, how strong of an extract is he talking about? Swim would recomend starting somewhere around 15 rivea seeds with 4 HBWR seeds.

Guarana is a good idea. Swim adds kola nut to HBWR to eliminate the lethargy. He also adds ginger to eliminate HBWR nausea.

Keep in mind these capsules will probably loose some potency with time, so the fresher the better is the general rule of thumb. Also be aware that excessive doses could kill.

[tregar]

Radiometer is indeed correct...mg is more potent than Ololiuqui...but I believe that Ololiuqui lacks one alkaloid component that mg does have that causes some slight vasoconstriction in very high doses.

Ololiuqui seeds are very very expensive to buy in comparison to mg seeds..both seeds were used by the Indians. It would not be economically feasible to buy and use Ololiuqui seeds. And even if you grew them yourself, the Ololiuqui only has a few seeds per individual flower, whereas the mg plants have hundreds of seeds per individual flower on the plant.

You should have a very nice experience with the Ololiuqui seeds you ordered...I'm not knocking them at all....in fact, if the plant only put out a nicer quantity of seeds per flower, like mg does, it would be ideal to use for multiple dream trips instead of just one or two.

[Thirdedge]

Originally Posted by tregar

Radiometer is indeed correct...mg is more potent than Ololiuqui...

Going to have to agree to disagree on this one.

Swim tried Rivea again last night - 26 seeds - Soaked in water for 5 hours and drunk.
This had mild but definate effects. Mild anxiety and side effects also felt. Feedback from Swims two friends was similar. After checking with Swims supplier, it turns out the HBWR he tried(see above) were of low potency, so Swims comparison of 30 Rivea to 10 hbwr would generally be wrong.

The following is a comparson from erowid:
LAA% Total Alks. % by weight

Baby wood rose: 0.04 0.30
Ololiuqui: 0.02 0.04
Heavenly Blue: 0.01 0.02
Pearly Gates: 0.02 0.03
Wedding Bells: 0.01 0.03

[Thirdedge]

According to Swims scales (which he would not trust his life upon), 25 Rivea seeds = 0.76 gram.

Do any Swiy's happen to have any HBWR seeds they could weigh for comparison?

[snapper]

third edge - did SWIY ingest the seeds with the extract ?
SWIM liked hbwr excet for the painful vasoconstriction, which was really distracting. SWIM did not get these effects from MG seeds, but did an extract with a np solvent. If the whole seed material is not irritating, this would be a superior plant to the others containing LSA.

[Thirdedge]

Originally Posted by snapper

third edge - did SWIY ingest the seeds with the extract ?

No, in hindsight he wishes he had, but as he was still a little anxious about how strong the dosage would be so he used a coffee filter to strain the liquid. Also, he forgot to hold the liquid in his mouth, simply washing it down with fruitjuice.

He did notice very slightly acky / stiff legs (similar to what one experiences after exercise) later on upon going to bed.

[radiometer]

Another reference, from TiHKAL:

Rivea corymbosa...was the first of this botanical group to be analyzed for its alkaloid content, ...contained levels that measured some 0.01% by weight in the fresh seeds.

There is a second Morning Glory with the botanical name Ipomoea violacae...the alkaloid content of the fresh seeds, by weight, runs between 0.02 and 0.10%.