MDMA: 30 years to repair brain?

[KomodoMK]

I took the following from the EDIT site.

The thing to remember is that Serotonin release is strictly controlled within the body and is not limitless. Ecstasy changes the way that the chemical is released into the brain, giving huge doses whilst on the drug, with a considerably diminished dose thereafter. Long term users of ecstasy can experience depression in later life, due largely to a lack of serotonin to the brain. Habitual users may find it difficult to motivate themselves, and become bored and restless with their lives.
The effects that Ecstasy has on the brain are irreversible. Studies carried out on monkeys have shown that at least in their case, the brain will take an average of 30 years to repair the damage done from one dose of Ecstasy with regard to the release of serotonin.

It is undeniable that Ecstasy is very, very bad for you. Those with a history of heat, kidney & liver problems as well as strokes and high blood pressure are particularly at risk when taking Ecstasy.
Various studies carried out, indicate that the higher the dose & the more frequent the use, the worse the long term after-affects may be.

Is this information true? It seems a little extreme and I have read different information on this on erowid and elsewhere. I can't see it taking 30 years to repair the brain after a single average dose. If this was true surely it would cause much more damage in a much smaller time period, on those users who use every week or less.

I'll post the link to the article on EDIT upon permission from mods. The article contains further misinformation as well, including prices.

[Jatelka]

SWIJ rather suspects that this is on a par with "LSD stays in your spinal fluid for ever".

She doesn't suppose that EDIT quote the sources for this "information"?

She suspects it may relate to several discredited experiments which reported brain damage with MDMA (only it turned out that the monkeys had been given huge doses of Meth iv instead!)

[KomodoMK]

Nope, EDIT did not give sources for this information at all. I agree with your suspicions. I suppose it could also help EDIT in selling their 'legal harm minimisation solutions' by making out MDMA is more dangerous than what it is.

[WrtngCocaineTutorial]

Studies carried out on monkeys have shown that at least in their case, the brain will take an average of 30 years to repair the damage done from one dose of Ecstasy with regard to the release of serotonin.

hmmm. they have waited 30 years ... and then disected the monkeys?
sounds weird. And one thing one should be very aware of when reading propaganda is that they try not to be directly untruthful (although many of them are), and therefore when they say one dose - they simply don't mention that it could be a mega dose of intravenous MDMA, but lets the reader assume it's a normal tablet taken orally

Reputation Comments on this post:

nice post, but I ESPECIALLY like your signature! brilliant!

[Nagognog2]

Reminds me of the "study" on marijuana toxicity to find the lethal dose. They suffocated the rat with smoke - no air - and declared that smoking pot killed the rat. Or the "LSD breaks chromosone" report. In this they put human chromosones into a strong solution of NaOH (sodium hydroxide - drain-cleaner) and boiled them for 6 hours with a little LSD tossed in. Another research victory was declared: "The LSD broke the chromosones!"

[radiometer]

Due to the mention of "one dose of Ecstasy," one suspects that this article refers to Ricaurte's infamous methamphetamine mixup.

[KomodoMK]

Could methamphetamine do that much damage from one dose, assuming it was an average dose?

[Nagognog2]

It wasn't an average dose. It was close to a lethal dose. And the answer is no. Methamphetamine is legally used in medicine in th USA. It's sold in tablet form under the trade name Desoxyn.

[KomodoMK]

Seems kind of strange that a site selling legal (although this is debatable) drugs would post such misinformation on their site. I guess of course they could profit from such information by making possible users worried about taking the substance and thus purchasing a 'drug harm minimisation solution'. That is debatable in itself seeing as we know less about those than we do about MDMA.

[Jatelka]

For any who are interested: SWIJ found this interesting article about the methodological problems re MDMA research...

http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/loc...=1070&catid=36

[KomodoMK]

Took a quick browse and seems very interesting. I shall read fully tomorrow as I need some sleep now. Thanks for posting the article.

[allyourbase]

neurons dont grow back.

[Euphoric]

Well, there's always 5HTP to help replenish serotonin right?

[raven3davis]

The title of this thread said it all for swim......pure garbage/misinformation/myth

[High_Roller]

Originally Posted by allyourbase

neurons dont grow back.

SWIM was waiting to see something like that! Do you all truly believe MDMA doesn't impair your brain after you take it? Here's an excerpt from the medical journal*Professional Psychology:Research and Practice(talking about decreased seratonin binding in MDMA users). SWIM used this in a recent psych paper.

"The degree of binding deficit was positively correlated with reported extent of MDMA use. This finding has been replicated in other studies that use imaging techniques (see Kalant, 2001; Reneman et al., 2001) and appears to support the fact that recreational MDMA users may be unknowingly exposing themselves to a compound capable of producing neurodegeneration. The point has been made that even one dose of MDMA may produce persisting degeneration (McDowell, 1999)."

That being said, SWIM still enjoys rolling on occasion!*

[Paracelsus]

Neurons die all the time, High Roller. But most brain- and neuron- related diseases are not due to neuron deficiency (low numbers of neurons), they are caused by dysfunction of synapses, that means exchange of information BETWEEN neurons.

And, by the way, every drug kills neurons. Some more, some less. Huffing solvent and drinking (alcohol) kills more neurons than MDMA does. And life does kill neurons too.

EDIT: Regarding to the 30 years needed to reverse brain damage caused by MDMA, they probably measured how much serotonin gets restored in a couple of hours and then "calculated" the time needed to replace all of it. Highly innaccurate.

[stoneinfocus]

So what about the number of neurons that alcohol kills in one drinking session?-noone seems to borther)

And neurons do grow back, to a limited extend and depending on where they are...

I believe MDMA can be >used< with no serious side-effects and the "side" effects rather being on the good side than the bad, when it´s used with some kind of common sense.

The rule is that everything has a remedy, even "depleted" serotonine levels and such that can be dealt with in a very good manner.

We´re not at the age of inquisition and there´re enough herbal-weirdos out there bashing anything that´s "chemical", not to say there´re all sorts of psychos where you would least expect them.

[KomodoMK]

Originally Posted by High_Roller

SWIM was waiting to see something like that! Do you all truly believe MDMA doesn't impair your brain after you take it?

I assume you did not read this thread? We are talking about the damage taking 30 years to repair after a single dose.

SWIM knows first hand that it can cause damage with over use becuse he had trouble with his short term memory, upon stopping use due to this after 9 months his memory has improved a lot.