Certain drugs produce specific hallucinations?

[Praxis]

So theres the Salvia Goddess, the Machine elves...what other bizarre recurring hallucinations are there that are common among users and trips on certain drugs? SWIM is currently very intrigued by these hallucinations that are shared by many many people.

[D.U.M.B]

One that is quite frequent for SWIM is talking trees. Especially with mushrooms.

SWIM was told the way out of a forest once by a tree. The advice was accurate and later it freaked out a sober SWIM

Reputation Comments on this post:

damn cool post

[Montgolfier]

Originally Posted by D.U.M.B

One that is quite frequent for SWIM is talking trees. Especially with mushrooms.

SWIM was told the way out of a forest once by a tree. The advice was accurate and later it freaked out a sober SWIM

Glad I'm not the only one!!)SWIM is always having conversations (telepathic ones) with trees, bushes and other shrubbery whilst tripping on mushrooms!! It's allmost like the bobbing motion created by the wind becomes the trees natural repetitive movements and the flailing branches become beconning arms or something! )

Swim also saw a tunnel filld with demons on a very strong LSD trip, he realised at the time that these were simply visual manefestations of his own fears and made them dissapear.

[djama]

Originally Posted by MrCheese

SWIM is always having conversations (telepathic ones) with trees, bushes and other shrubbery .

Wasnt there someone famous who was talking to a burning bush that told him what God wanted him to do.


Swim and a friend one day on mescaline saw thousands of tiny 'worms of light' in the sky. They wondered if it was what Wilhelm Reich called Orgone Energy. The worms seemed to appear and disappear and also collide with effect but without destruction. Swim wonders if it is a retinal effect of glare that we normally simply screen out because it is distracting - anyone else seen my worms?

[Praxis]

definately thought this would be a conversation stimulator

[Alfa]

Would think so to. The entities encountered on various substances are very specific for each substance. It is very strange that world wide people experience the same entity on a drug. It defies the logical explanation that it is just a hallucination. While AFAIK these entities hold one thing in common: extreme bizarreness.
If you look at the history of the uses of these drugs, natives/shamans have often described the effects of these drugs as the soul or spirit of the plant. So this should be a very interesting topic to explore.
If anyone would care to research this a bit, interesting results may come up.
Which drugs have entities tied to them? Which entities? Background info is always welcome.

[zera]

Originally Posted by Alfa

Would think so to. The entities encountered on various substances are very specific for each substance. It is very strange that world wide people experience the same entity on a drug. It defies the logical explanation that it is just a hallucination. While AFAIK these entities hold one thing in common: extreme bizarreness.
If you look at the history of the uses of these drugs, natives/shamans have often described the effects of these drugs as the soul or spirit of the plant. So this should be a very interesting topic to explore.
If anyone would care to research this a bit, interesting results may come up.
Which drugs have entities tied to them? Which entities? Background info is always welcome.

An excellent article that actually talks about this (specifically the elves people see on DMT):
http://www.tripzine.com/listing.php?id=dmt_pickover

Swim would also like to say that he didn't experience the Salvia goddess on his breakthrough experience, but rather something that was very masculine, almost beastly, kind of like a Yeti. It most definitely was not female, and it didn't seem like God at all. It seemed hostile, almost demonic. Maybe the effect of the mescaline skewed his trip though. Swim should try another breakthrough trip with the rest of the salvia while sober.

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Good post

[daeron]

well every time mipro is done, this really hot elf like chick comes out of my speakers

[Female]

*SWIM wasn't sure whether or not to post this in insights or in drug culture, so if it needs to be moved to match the category that's awesome too.
Something that SWIM finds interesting is that many people report seeing spiders while on diphenhyramine, and also report seeing clearish gelatin blobs a lot too. What makes certain hallucinations common to a drug? Like why do so many people report seeing children on salvia? SWIM is interested to hear SWIY's thoughts on the matter, or reports of seeing similar things.
It'd be nice to hear theories, ranging from scientific to unexplainable phenomena or spiritual reasons, and to also mention comparative reports from personal experiences or shared experiences.

What connects it all?

[Female]

SWIM sees children on Salvia, and she once saw a painting someone did (on this forum, though she doesn't know where) of a little girl holding a ball, which is exactly what she saw. She's also compared her salvia trip to someone elses who said they went to a circus and the darkness was trying to overtake the light, just like her trip.
And with all the dramamine reports she's been reading, spiders seems to be common as well as weird filmly clear gelatin gloop stuff.

[Forthesevenlakes]

Here is SWIMs explanation for what might be going on, chemically, with some drugs causing visuals common to many people:

SWIM does not know the answer for why some people seem to hallucinate similar types of things on one drug vs. another, but he has heard of the phenomenon. His best guess is that the drugs are triggering something in the sensory cortices that would normally fire when they detect certain classes of objects, and the rest of the brain interprets this as the objects really being there. For parts of the visual cortex, different cells will fire in response ONLY lines oriented at specific angles. Four of these cells firing at once would produce the recognition of a parallelogram. Perhaps the "universal" or widespread hallucinations caused by some drugs is a higher-level elaboration on this.

Alternately perhaps it could be manifesting by triggering memories, like how some people theorize dreams operate. Maybe memories or cognitive schema of "children" or "gelatin" are stored in a relatively specific place in the brain that has not been found yet, and activity here would produce the sight or belief that a child or a large gelatin blob is in SWIYs room.

Reputation Comments on this post:

	my thoughts exactly
	right on

[Potter]

My ethnobotany teacher gave us a lecture on Ayahusaca, and remarked that pythons and panthers are almost universally seen under the influence of the ayahusaca.

[ponygirl]

One time SWIM and a friend were rolling and both kept seeing 'ashes' collect on each other and things around the room. Very bizarre. SWIM has never seen anything like that sense.

[Trebor]

I've noticed that drugs that have been used by a particular culture give hallucinations simmillar to that culture, for example; Swim had a morning glory trip in which he saw Mayan societys. The Mayans had used MG's for years as a means to communicate with ancestors. I also believe that all drugs have a hallucenagenic quality, just that with use, a little bit of it is taken from it, the more use the less hallucenations. Cannabis, if you read Fitz Hugh Ludlow, has hallucenagenic traits if eaten, albeit anytime Swim ate it he just got a regualr high, no visions, Ludlow did however in his book, "The Hashish Eater", he describes them.

[djama]

I notice that a lot of people who do not use drugs also suffer from similar hallucinations including:
Going to war is a good idea.
Getting sportspeople to wear one particular brand of clothes over another is worth millions of dollars a year, and
Paying the people who actually manufacture those clothes $1ph is fair.

How come I still got a red light? I edited my offending post, I read the rules, I confessed, did penance, ate worms - is there something else swidjama is supposed to do?

Reputation Comments on this post:

	Funny. And you, like me, have a red light becuase nobody reapproved your post.
	good perspective
	Lol, thanks for pointing this out.. not sure why you have a red light..

[snapper]

SWIM always sees the same patterns and figures while on Salvia. Though SWIM feels that most if not all hallucinogens have their hallmark patterns, feelings, and images (if visual), Salvia is ALWAYS the same. In higher doses, it starts to change, but in the normal range of usage it is repetitive enough to be boring. The visuals are often scale or shingle-like repeating patterns (as in roofing shingles) which build around themselves. These can turn to house like structures, toadstools, tombstones or other rectangular shapes. They also generally follow a spiral or circular pattern, and tend to be thin bright colored outlines on a dark background. They can be quite complex, and more often than once SWIM has felt like SWIM was flying low over a dark glowingly-outlined cityscape.
At higher doses, the effect becomes more dissociative and otherworldly, and at this level the experience can vary quite wildly and is often scary.
AMT and 5meoDIPT always had the same patterns during the alert when SWIM used them a lot. AMT always had the translucent, fluorescent, liquid blobs on the ceiling and walls,and 5meoDIPT thin swirling tendrils of bright colors loosly scattered in the field of vision. With 2-CC it was always gear or circular sawblade patterns.
SWIM thinks that this effect is partly psychological and is an attached memory to a significant emotional or mental event (ie-tripping). When SWIM had HPPD very long ago, the effects were worsened by anxiety or stress, and at those times minicked the effects of the onset of LSD, which was SWIMs favorite drug at the time. Taking LSD years later started a whole new set of alert patterns which repeated in subsequent trips, but they were not the same that SWIM remembered from previous LSD usage and HPPD. This indicates a psychological component, which is probably present and influences the effect of all these durgs, making an accurate characterization of effects at this level of detail impossible to interpret and very subjective.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Wow. Way to remember everything you ever wanted to say on the subject. +1

[Praxis]

I seriously think the Bible was heavenly influenced by drugs of all sorts. ESPECIALLY that book of revelations...come on....multiple headed animals...bugs with human heads, horns and lions manes...gotta be drugs.

[Trebor]

The Sacred Mushroom and the Cross: A Study of the Nature and Origins of Christianity within the Fertility Cults of the Ancient Near East offered the theory that Jesus was a mushrrom, you may luagh now but Allegro, John Marco, is a scholar of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

[peregrin23]

Is it possible that we all belong to an active Overmind?,could Jung,Joseph Campbell,Daniel Pinchbeck,the Mayan's,terence Mckenna,myself,countless trippers and Your own intuition maybe just maybe be onto somthing?
I believe that some not all of the entities that people encounter with various plants and chemicals are literally 'real',the fact (for me) that we are all part of a huge web that is woven with reoccurring motif would explain why our unconcious summons similar symbols and beings when its veil has been lifted,what is harder to explain is the very real presence of plant teachers and what i am intrested in is what we as a species can do insofar as contacting,documenting and implementing a plan in regards to these beautiful teachers,forums are a good start,but i kind of get the feeling we are running out of time,i think it very very important that everybody makes full use of there experiences,to enter with intent,it cannot be somthing to be used as a high,we need to corroberate and correlate what it is is being asked of us beyond just the personal.
Swims own experience has made him very aware of what he needs to do for himself,but what do these HyperBeings require from us ALL?...

Reputation Comments on this post:

	insightful: poses questions for the age
	Great post, thank you!!

[I>A\/I>]

Originally Posted by peregrin23

Is it possible
that we all belong to an active Overmind?,
could Jung,Joseph Campbell,Daniel Pinchbeck,
the Mayan's,terence Mckenna,myself,countless trippers
and Your own intuition maybe just maybe be onto somthing?

-------------we are all part of a huge web
that is woven with reoccurring motif
would explain why our unconcious summons similar symbols and beings
when its veil has been lifted,
-------------------- i kind of get the feeling
we are running out of time,
i think it very very important
that everybody makes full use of their experiences,
to enter with intent,it
cannot be somthing to be used as a high,
we need to corroberate and correlate what it is is being asked of us
beyond just the personal.

Swims own experience has made him very aware of what he needs to do for himself,but what do these HyperBeings require from us ALL?...

I believe Peregrin23 is right on the money.
Remarkable, particularly given his/her age..

[moda00]

Originally Posted by I>A\/I>

I believe Peregrin23 is right on the money.
Remarkable, particularly given his/her age..

Second this.. I didn't see that posting until just now.. great post, thank you.

[El Calico Loco]

I find it fascinating that different people experience similar illusions under the influence. As peregrin23 touched on, it lends credence to Jung's idea of the collective unconscious (which would probably be better labelled "basic mental pattern" or something). This is the idea that just as humans all share certain physical characteristics regardless of their differences (two arms, two legs, one head, etc), humans also share certain consciousness or personality traits that are the same for every human.

Many 60's hippies saw wondrous visions and came down from them with new ideas about the universe. They started collecting crystals, swimming with dolphins, and dabbling in Kabbalah. They saw the visions as being representative of something outside of themselves.

But... maybe this was the wrong way to interpret these experiences? Maybe these visions tell us not about the world outside, but about the world inside - the incredible, massive worlds buried deep in our subconscious. This is a fascinating question whether one is a materialist or a mystic.

Much of Swim's drug use has been done to explore this very idea. He thinks of himself as an amateur scientist (he studied physics at the university), of sorts, trying different chemicals and combinations and trying to note how he feels and what sort of strange illusions and delusions he experiences.

He knows that a lot of skeptical types will say this is not science (Science!!)...and I partially agree. It's certainly not science in the sense of something that one can quantify and measure. It's not objective.

However, if several persons have very similar subjective experiences with a particular dosage of drug(s) (without knowing in advance what to expect to avoid confirmation bias), then that is interesting data even though no one but the test subject can see it. Certain aspects could be verifiable and even falsifiable. I think we could learn a great deal about psychology and biology this way.


ECL

Reputation Comments on this post:

	very well said
	interesting points.. thank you for posting!!

[bewilderment]

Many people report seeing Native American like imagery on hallucinogens, especially peyote and ayahuasca. Swim once had an experience on a 2C-I/DXM combo trip (there are dangers to this, swim knows and thus does not encourage anyone else to try the same) where she stood in front of the mirror for about an hour watching her face morph into different faces of all ethnicities, but Native American showed up the most.

Swim has conjured up the spirit (feeling of presence) of Jim Morrison on many occasions when on upper-plateau DXM trips. Her spouse also had hallucinations involving Morrison when she was on DXM and ecstacy (DEFINITELY not recommended although her wife turned out fine). She's read a lot of similar trip reports online. Maybe it just has to do with people listening to "The Doors" often during trips.

She also has a tendency to meet entities (or the sensation of such) during closed-eye visuals on DXM. She once even met the Salvia goddess while on DXM (funny place for her to show up!).

[Demonslayer]

SWIM sees CEV's like Australian native paintings on Cebil.
Acid often gives fractal designs.
Shrooms have many different qualities, Liberty caps and cubensis always give SWIM Indonesian, thai and indian inspired CEV's.
Paneoulus tropicalis gives aztec-like CEV's.
Mexican shrooms always makes CEV's inspired by Hopi or apache designs.
Cannabis gives acantus-like designs in brown and green or cartoonish figures.
Salvia often looks like highly magnified cellulose cells or glass tiles in mostly green colors.

[Akewstick]

There was a Hindu deva that was "the god of" (if you want to call it that) a certain type of plant, and there is a psychoactive plant in a certain part of the world that shares it's name with this deva, i can't find the details of it now though.

Whenever Stevie Boldank mixes Nitrous oxide with weed, e and butyl nitrite, 5 out of 6 times sees The Soldiers. Sometiems, he's among their ranks, sometimes he's watching them from a great height, once he was a palace and they marched up his steps. Sometimes he glides along behind them trying to catch up (always a lovely rush when he manages it), but they will never stop marching for anything, and never get faster or slower.

It's pretty common that Stevie makes outrageous claims at deafening volume from the depths of a nos trip, "I just realised that I'm french" stands out in his mind, but there are none more outrageous and hard to defend when sober than "I am an iranian palace". Don't ask me how he knew he was iranian, but he swears that for what seemed like ages, he was an iranian palace, though none of his friends could be persuaded to find much validity in the claim.

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like the humour,need more!