How to stay within the rules of the law.

[Alfa]

For those of you who live in the US. Do you feel that you can trust the rules set in the law? That you will be safe following reason and didactics?Or do you think that anything may happen? Laws are applied with utter insanity and it's getting crazier month after month. I have stopped amazing myself overmad laws and infantile justice operationslong ago.


That they are trying to close the research chemical loophole I regret, but I can understand. Making information on drug production, spoons andpipesillegal shows bluntrandom prosecution, violation of freedom of speech and information. Rights that go beyond national law. It is not logical nor compliant with first first amendments or international law, so how can anybody be expected to know the law and not to break it?

[Woodman]

<blockquote>Originally posted by Alfa on 12 August 2004<hr>
Do you feel that you can trust the rules set in the law? <hr></blockquote>

NO!

[wizard warior]

its about time they started giving people more responisblite over ther own decisions

Reputation Comments on this post:

I agree

[Gahaba22]

It is really unfortunate that we cannot be trusted to make the right decisions regarding our drug intake. Does it make any sense that Marijuana and GHB are both schedule I and Schedule 3 drugs. That's the biggest oxymoron ever!



geeb

[crazyride84]

the government expects its people to follow the law,but then they turn around and bend and turn a blind eye to the laws,and in return only one is punished,and to me if they went to get you they have there ways.What a sad,sad world we live in.

[thydarkprevails]

i cannot trust the laws of a government that will put a marajuana user in jail, and let a rapist out early with good behavior..

[Skeptikon]

That's a very good question. It seems that every time the government
tries to enforce ridiculous laws like that it ends up shooting itself
in the foot. Like when they have those benighted ads on TV about how
smoking one joint is like stabbing yourself in the chest with a
fireplace poker smeared with shit and peanut butter...when people find
out that they are full of crap about that, then they don't ever believe
them about other things that they might actually be right on. People
think, aw christ, what the hell is the government doing now? I don't
need to deal with that crap. It really decreases trust in the
government overall. Dumbasses.

[windtraveler]

How can you trust the law when you are treated like children by it? I want to use the graymatter that i was given, educate myself and not simply believe what i am spoonfed, and make decisions for myself. I trust that i can and will make the right decisions. No person or group of people can do that for me.

[Sitbcknchill]

See but usually there is some stupid fuck that ruins it for everybody. Some people can't make the right choices for themselves so there are laws governing what you can and can't do. For the rest of us that are reasonable people have to be punished because someone somewhere decided to do something very stupid so they make a law to prevent it from happening again. Problem being there are so many that you don't really know what they are. Don't get me wrong I'm not defending the government, it sucks and I think it's just all a big scam. You can vote but shit man what's the difference. Do you actually think things will ever change for the better? We have no rights, the government('s) do what they want when they want and it's just going to go downhill from here.

But.....You actually do have freedom, we all have freedom of choice, you can do anything you want when you want but it doesn't mean there won't be a consequences.

[WhiteRyan]

I envy more tolerable places in the world. The United States needs the old ppl to leave and the new to step up. Im scared of our government, and its lawmen. If im clean I like to fuck with them.

[P!MPJU!C3]

American laws are allright. Its just the police that are so dangerous. I bet that if u cross the street in America without lookin youll get a fine. Some laws u gotta have. But u need policemen to be realistic and say. Ok u made a boo-boo. I wont beat u up because u r black or because im frustrated im just gonna look the other way. Everyboddy makes a bad sometimes. The police just oughta look the other way soemetimes because some things are really not important.

This is why dutch police r so cool. If u do something bad like rob people theyll just take u in in a reasonable way but should u be drunk in public its more likely theyll take u home then send u to jail.Edited by: P!MPJU!C3

[thydarkprevails]

some police in america absolutely rule...

in early september i got 3x the legal limit on booze, and ran my car into a pole..totaling it, and destroying the pole...the cop didn't give me a dui..and he said he knew i was drunk..he just understood my age and stupidity, and wanted me to have a second chance.....i thank him for this...now i refuse to drive drunk...

yet..if i had 8 or 9 grams of pot on me...i'd get slapped with possesion with the intent to sell..

[Triple7]

Here in sweden there is a guy that had a bookshop.. he went to jail
because he sold books about cultivating weed. Then there is a well
known sweed that got into jail for selling seeds from his website. Both
of them were senteced for preparing illict manufacture (or how to say
it).



Myself.. I was busted for something. I don't like to say what drug I
was busted for (but I had over a months supply).. whatever, I confessed
and told them the whole truth about myself.. but lied about friends to
protect them. Two undercover police men questioned me for two days.
They were very nice to me.. and I am sure they knew I protected my
friends.. also it felt that they avoided to ask me difficult
questions... and in the end.. I didn't even have to goto court.. I
asked why, they said "case is sabbotaged".. well.



It seems one need lots of luck and that it is quite random if you
happen to meet a good cop. What strikes me, is that pherhaps some
realised some truth about humen?? They should learn about right and
wrong by working with criminals everyday. Still it is amazing how
brainwashed most of them can be. And talking about brainwash... the
most stupid people I know are customs, 50/50 they catch me on a airport
or seaport.. I don't know why.. I think it's my looks.. more stupid
guys are (un-)soldiers and guards at clubs. Why I think like this, does
pherhaps not belong to this forum. But swedes are always talking about
letting these stupids take some police roles... that thought makes me
shiver.

[mattttt]

I can't understand how spliff is illegal while drink isn't, stick 5 guys in a room with a few crates of beer while in another room have 5 guys with a bag of weed. 1 room there will be 5 guys trying to fight each other while the other will be 5 guys laughing together over the funny sound of certain words

[hh339]

Originally Posted by Triple7

Here in sweden there is a guy that had a bookshop.. he went to jail
because he sold books about cultivating weed.

Is this for real?? Hey, if you have a link about this i wood appreciate if you could PM it to me. No use putting it here cause I guess it would be in Swedish.

[Micklemouse]

This is going to sound like a silly question, but - banning spoons? What are you going to eat/drink soup with?

On a more serious note, in Briton I trust the police a lot more than the legislators. Blatantly I don't trust the police that much either, but in my experience, in small numbers they are at least liable to be reasonable if a person is reasonable with them, & isn't blatantly being a dick - the older the cop the better also ime.

Of course it's a different matter when they swarm...

[IHrtHalucingens]

The only way i would feel safe in America is if i were a celebrity of some sort. It seems time and time again celebrities get caught breaking laws but have the money and fame to obtain the right lawyers and get the right publicity to get off with probation and community service for something that would land myself and most others in jail without question for years.

Even still, police in America have way too much power with out much to regulate it. They have the power to establish probable cause, just because they personally were suspicious, to search you and your vehicle at any time for no other reason than that. The courts weigh a police officers judgment, knowledge, and testimony over any suspect. Even when quite often the police officer is far less intelligent than who ever it is they are arresting.

Our whole government is set up on lies and fake freedoms, carefully worded and cleverly loopholed so they can do whatever they want. The whole innocent until proven guilty saying is complete BS. You're guilty until you pay a lawyer thousands of dollars to prove that you arent.

And i agree with you micklemouse the more cops that show up the worse it will turn out for you. In my neck of the woods cops love to blow things way out of proportion and cause a scene. It seems they are all rediculously bored all the time and feel the need to be a part of every traffic ticket given out. Its not uncommon to see 5 or 6 police cars, often with 2 cops in each one, respond to a speeder or someone with a gram of weed when our violent crime rate has gone up like 300% in the past 2 years. GET A LIFE AND GO CATCH SOME REAL CRIMINALS!

...AND any time an actual crime has ever been committed, involving me or my family being the victims, of course the cops are absolutley incompetent. My house was broken into a few years back and 2 cars responded and spent a total of 30 mins looking around the place when the whole house was torn apart and obviously burglarized. We had to determine the point of entry and show the retards where the fingerprints were. But of course if a car with 3 teenagers is pulled over 10 cops show up and spend hours stripping the car down looking for drugs, because they thought they smelled something.

As much as i take for granted here in America i cannot stand our officials and plan on getting the hell out of here as soon as its monetarily a good time. I definately do not trust a single cop or politician in America, nor will i ever.

[Nagognog2]

There are only a few enclaves in the US where there are decent politicians who are actually working for the people they represent. I live in one of them. Otherwise I'd have left years ago.

I was called to jury duty a little while ago. We were asked if we had any relations or friends who were in law enforcment. Four hands went up. Then we were asked if we believed that cops are likely to tell the truth. Two hands went up. And these six people were sent home. I ended up on the jury - despite my SHOOT BUSH FIRST button on my headband and my ONE NATION UNDER SURVEILLANCE t-shirt.

Blissfully, the case was dismissed the night before I had to go and watch the parade of idiots.

Moral of story: Democracy is possible. But democracy is like having a shiny, new car. If you leave it unattended - some asshole will come along and steal it from you.

[garbled]

America is rushing down the road to third-world nation status so quickly that the federal, state and local governments love the growth in the criminal justice sector. It employs otherwise untrainable individuals who have lost their jobs to India or China while providing a walk-on spring camp environment for the hundreds of thousands of young high school graduates and college-bound individuals looking for work every year. They take individuals who have never had an ounce of power in their lives and turn them into superheros literally overnight. Similar to the "esprit de corp" instilled in our military, these gung-ho jarheads hit the streets every day and night of the week looking for unsuspecting "criminals" to express their concern to.

How many years have we seen politicians roll out the numbers for crime in their districts as a campaign platform and vow to "get tough on crime?" The result has been an entire industry built around keeping their fellow man down. The US justice system preys on the poor and less fortunate, literally forcing the majority to "regain their freedom" just by pleading guilty, ignoring their criminal records which just get longer and longer.

The criminal justice system has grown out of control, until reaching its present state of bloated existence. There are more Americans under lock and key than any other nation in the world. Many more are "on deck" and are only awaiting the testimony of a "confidential informant" to send them to meet their friends. Probation has captured many more potential residents of the grey-bar hotel, eager to return them to their rightful home.

Police officers, judges, baliffs, corrections officers, court reporters, probation officers, lawyers, they ALL have a vested interest in keeping America locked up. You show me ONE of the individuals above who says they would like to see a reduction in the crime rate, and I'll show you a bold-faced liar. A high crime rate is job security for these people. They don't want to see anything that could mean their jobs.

Now, thanks to the latest trend in terrorism, the America public is dumbly going along with everything they hear on TV. You are just one step away from being arrested and being forced to accept a plea bargin. You don't have to do anything to plead guilty for, but you damned sure better believe the DA is going to be focusing on his conviction rate.

If that means bastardizing justice, bending the rules, planting a little evidence, lying under oath, so be it. After all, it's all for the continuation of the American Way...

[old hippie 56]

As having experience with the justice league, they really don't want you but your money. Add up the probation fees, fines, court costs, it adds up quick. Then the jails are selling bed space to states that have overcrowding. Big business as usual.

[788.4]

Originally Posted by Gahaba22

It is really unfortunate that we cannot be trusted to make the right decisions regarding our drug intake. Does it make any sense that Marijuana and GHB are both schedule I and Schedule 3 drugs. That's the biggest oxymoron ever!



geeb

Marijuana is S1 and GHB is S3. GHB (brand name Xyrem) is extremly useful in the treatment of narcolepsy.

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In general I trust the police to follow the law. There have been a lot of times when they violate it, but it is not something that my friend worries about when he sees a police officer and has something on him.

Police offers usually rely on tricking people into confession. This is especially true regarding undercover drug dealers. For example, in Washington Square (NYC) there are usually undercover cops who say "Smoke Smoke" to people walking by in an effort to get them to buy drugs. If a police officer clearly acts in a way that suggests he wants to sell drugs to you (before you aproach or say anything to him or her) and you buy them you will most likely be not found guilty in a court of law by a jury or judge (if you waive the right to a trial).

The police verry often arrest people on evidence that would be easily defeated in court by a jury. The excuse "I would not buy drugs if the police offer didn't offer them to me" works very well. Usually when police "catch" someone buying drugs in a situation like that they will say they will be lenient if they confess, writing them an order to appear in court instead of arresting the. But because they confess they will be found guilty. If they do not confess they will be arrested, but the DA will not be able to recieve a guilty verdict, so they drop the case.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Hit the mark on this post, great reply

[Myzrael]

Does anyone here from the Netherlands have any information about our law system? SWIM sure knows there must be some information from the governement itself on the internet? Because we don't work like the people in America so what works in America might not work here.

[~lostgurl~]

The Injustice System. Between the crooked cops and the loop holed laws, the stigmatizing by society with their prehistoric principles based on media misinformation and uneducated interpretation, the wrongs and rights, blacks and whites, oooh and grays.... The Government has one policy, which is then interpreted by other entities to best fit their own needs and/or standards. The police have their own standard procedures, the Courts another and the health system another. Add to that the personal discriminations, beliefs and experiences of a Judge, a Jury, a Parole Officer, a Prison Guard, a Police Officer, a Dr, a Teacher, a Parent etc. and the outcome is bound to be erratic and untrustworthy. To top it all off, throw in a few career criminals, a couple of narks and the odd psychotic drug fuelled rampage, and you'll find even the smartest of scholars brainwashed against all drug usage. The more I think about injustice, the more frustrated I get, it’s like teaching Physics to a child who has just learnt how to count…. Though I personally think the psychologically handicapped are worse off then the intellectually handicapped…..

Reputation Comments on this post:

Great rant, good viewpoint.

[Alfa]

Myazrael, that would be a good question for a new topic.

[TheTrueBlackMeat]

Anyone that tries to shove you around and tell you what to do should never be trusted unless necessary... 'Cause they're assholes. They may be considered socially immoral but they have guns, and we don't.