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Piperazines Piperazines and piperazine containing party products.

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  #1  
Old 27-08-2006, 20:38
cadillac555 cadillac555 is offline
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London Underground XXX - Is this their best MDMA like product like they say ???

Hello, SWIM was wondering for all you who have taken London Undergrounds XXX product, and what you have thought of its effects in general, especially compared to their other MDMA alternative product "JAX" as well.

Also, on one of their websites, it lists the ingredients as :

200mg BZP, and
+
100mg Methyl-BZP

for BOTH the "XXX" and "Fast and Furious" Products. SWIM thought the "Fast and Furious" was a SPEED alternative, and "XXX" was an MDMA alternative ???Why would they use that same Piperazine Formula for two products that are supposed to have much different effects and are aimed at completely different Markets.

Is it maybe a misprint ??? or are there other ingredients not listed in them???
If there are other ingredients, can anyone who has taken them or anyone in the know speculate on what they may be ???
I know Jax is supposed to have Black Pepper and Nutmeg Extract in it, but I have'nt heard anything about additional ingredients in their "XXX"

SWIM would greatly appreciate any help. Especially with the shortage of info available on Methyl-BZP. Thank You
  #2  
Old 27-08-2006, 20:44
Nagognog2 Nagognog2 is offline
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Why? Because they are unscrupulous business-men who don't give a flying fuck about their customers - they just want your money. They'd tell you it was like cyanide if that would sell the stuff.

They pay pennies for a "dose" of this stuff, and make a fortune re-selling it labeled whatever to get people to buy it.
  #3  
Old 27-08-2006, 20:51
cadillac555 cadillac555 is offline
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So you think this is the same formula in different packaging basically ???? SWIM knows they are all out to make money, but SWIM would really like to know as SWIM wants the best experience possible that he can get from London Underground. SWIM knows it will never compare to real MDMA, SWIM just wants to know the closest thing they have to it. Thanks.
  #4  
Old 27-08-2006, 20:54
radiometer radiometer is offline
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The similarity stops at the appearance of the pills. Which is why these piperazine products piss us off so much. Assholes are selling these as "ectasty" pills all over the place.
  #5  
Old 27-08-2006, 21:48
cadillac555 cadillac555 is offline
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Look, SWIM totally agrees with everyone that these companies are out there to make money, and can understand why one would be pissed off that someone sold them a piperazine pill as MDMA.
But no one has tried to answer SWIMs' question yet. SWIM is just looking for the best piperazine MDMA replacement pill made by London Underground.
They have 1 product SWIM is mainly trying to gather information on, their "XXX" product.
Please, if you have any info on London Undergrounds "XXX" or the Methyl-BZP / BZP combo that they are composed of, please post. Thank You
  #6  
Old 27-08-2006, 22:15
Abrad Abrad is offline
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The point being made is that none of them will be like MDMA. Maybe if SWIY tried them for what they are, and not try to recreate the MDMA experience SWIY may find it enjoyable (although many do not). Advertising them as MDMA replacements is purely a marketing gimmick.
Here and here are trip reports SWIY may find usefull.
  #7  
Old 27-08-2006, 23:10
cadillac555 cadillac555 is offline
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Thank you. SWIM should have told everyone in his question that he has already read all the reports on "xxx", "Jax", and "Fast and Furious" made in this forum.
He is looking for some new info.
Howeve, SWIM HAS already said he knows that a piperazing pill is never going to compare to a "real" MDMA pill, he just wants to find the most similar, pleasant experience he can get.
Mona Lisas' report on XXX made them sound like they were very good
However, Euphorics' report on "Fast ans Furious" made me want to stay FAR away from anything that resembles that formula.
But, according to the london underground website, they have the same ingredients except for a "twist" factor, which SWIM thinks is ingredients that the companies can not post because of LE.
So SWIM is looking for new info & trip reports to help him find out what is the best product for him
  #8  
Old 28-08-2006, 01:27
Nagognog2 Nagognog2 is offline
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Piperazines are illegal in the UK. They were illegal, but not enforced. Now the law is being enforced, so the question of illegal ingredients becomes moot. But, again, the "secret ingredients" is nothing more than a marketing ploy. Next they'll come with a "secret de-coder ring" and a college diploma.

They are, and have been, illegal in the USA.
  #9  
Old 28-08-2006, 01:39
cadillac555 cadillac555 is offline
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SWIM does not mean to be rude, but he is getting a lot of answers that do not have anything to do with what he is looking for. SWIM does sppreciate SWIYs' replies, but SWIM just wants to know what the best e-like pill is that London Underground makes.

Not interested in legal status of piperazines throughout the world, not interested in hearing about marketing tricks used by manufacturers, not interested in 101 reasons why piperazines will never be XTC.

SWIM just wants to know which product is the best MDMA-LIKE piperazine pill from London Underground. Thank You.
  #10  
Old 28-08-2006, 01:46
Nagognog2 Nagognog2 is offline
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It appears that you have exhausted the local talent here. Have you considered asking the manufacturer for their suggestion?
  #11  
Old 28-08-2006, 01:55
cadillac555 cadillac555 is offline
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Yes but SWIM can't seem to get a hold of them for some reason lately ??? And SWIM was hoping to get an opinion from someone without an agenda like pill manufacturers.
SWIM much prefers the non-hyped trip reports of others who have tried the products first hand.
Well, just have to see if anyone else who is familiar with these products happens to stumble on the thread I guess.
  #12  
Old 28-08-2006, 02:03
Alfa Alfa is offline
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Abrad gave the answer to SWIY's question: the products are not like ecstasy.
If SWIY wants to know which piperazine product is the most stimulating and euphoric, that would be another question.
  #13  
Old 28-08-2006, 02:14
cadillac555 cadillac555 is offline
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Ok well then how would SWIY rate

methyl-bzp

as compared to

tfmpp

since that is the only difference in ingredients between JAX and XXX

Thanks
  #14  
Old 28-08-2006, 03:55
Euphoric Euphoric is offline
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Greetings Cadillac555. Like I reported on behalf of SWIM in the fast and furious story, (and I know it's not London underground) but SWIM finds PEP pills closest to E, and 4/5 friends agree.

SWIM also will make a quick report on Jax. Jax make for another LONG trip. It was strange. The first couple of hours were like a stoned/drunk feeling. then the euphoric high hit. Something about it SWIM didn't like though. It was probably a good 12 hours, but just didn't seem as nice as PEP experiences. SWIM finds PEP gives a constant feeling of wellbeing as well as great waves of euphoria. Goes well with pot. Does not go well with alcohol.

SWIM has red devils and will try and report on those soon, but is taking some time between pills, in fear of developing tolerance.
  #15  
Old 28-08-2006, 04:16
cadillac555 cadillac555 is offline
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Which type of PEP would SWIY recommend for the closest MDMA type experience ??? PEP LOVE, PEP ORIGINAL, PEP X, or PEP TWISTED ??? Thank SWIY very much by the way
  #16  
Old 28-08-2006, 04:48
Euphoric Euphoric is offline
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SWIM has used mostly original and uses those most often. SWIM has also tried twisted, which is slightly psychedelic. The others SWIM has not tried, but LOVE sounds promising and is on SWIMS to do list. SWIM would be happy to see others reviews too. Also, in regards to fast and furious, just cuz SWIM had a rough time, doesn't mean everyone will. Everyone's different. But we all know that.
  #17  
Old 28-08-2006, 09:09
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In answer to the orginal question, in New Zealand the law requires that products containing BZP must be labeled acordingly. However most NZ manufacturers now only label the BZP content, and leave out the other ingredients, such as TFMPP, MCPP and other piperazines. Others list something along the lines of "200mg BZP, 270mg propietry blend of piperazines and amino acids."

The Methyl BZP is probobly a way of getting around the maximum of 200mg BZP per pill regulation(which is yet to become law).

Keep in mind that many companies chance / elvolve the formulas of their products. Jax for example has changed more than once.

The Fast and Furious product is a good meth alternative in Swims opinion.

Swim told me XXX is both speedier and trippier than MDMA. It is also rougher and less empathogenic, but it is an advancement on Jax etc for an atempt at making an MDMA replica.

Whether or not we agree with the ethics of London Underground, theres no disputing they manufacture the most cutting edge products of the genre. They are lightyears ahead of Peps, Funk Pills etc in attempting to produce a legal alternative to the common illegal drugs of choice (Meth, MDMA, Weed, LSD).
  #18  
Old 28-08-2006, 13:48
Beeker Iridium member Beeker is offline
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why not just ... use MDMA in the pills? @.@
  #19  
Old 28-08-2006, 21:08
cadillac555 cadillac555 is offline
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What about Methylone??? would SWIY it considered to be a more authentic MDMA replacement than the piperazine combos ???
  #20  
Old 28-08-2006, 21:19
Alfa Alfa is offline
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As the structure of Methylone is very simular to MDMA, one can expect relating effects.
  #21  
Old 28-08-2006, 21:23
Euphoric Euphoric is offline
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Is Methylone still even available as a legal high?
  #22  
Old 28-08-2006, 21:36
cadillac555 cadillac555 is offline
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not in Europe from what SWIM hears, but still legal in the USA if SWIY know where to find it ( SWIM still looking as well )

Anyone else have some light to shed on Methylone VS Piperazine Pills as an MDMA replacement ???
  #23  
Old 28-08-2006, 21:40
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If you UTFSE you will find a lot of info on that topic. This thread is about Piperazines.
  #24  
Old 28-08-2006, 21:49
cadillac555 cadillac555 is offline
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Yes SWIM realizes this.
He Has indeed used the search engine to find out very much information about Methylone, especially dosage.

But he is interested in how it compares to Piperazine MDMA replacement pills so he thought it would be relevant to post in the piperazine thread he started more than anywhere else.
  #25  
Old 28-08-2006, 22:12
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If you have really read all there is for info about methylone and bzp at Erowid and here, you would have your answer.

I also believe, if you would stop referring to “MDMA replacement pills” as there is NO replacement for MDMA, I think you’d get more of the replies you are looking for.

Each of the substances you refer to in this thread is unique and so are the experiences.
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