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  #1  
Old 25-01-2013, 04:58
Drummer16 Drummer16 is offline
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OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

I tried posting another thread about this, but basically this time I won't break the rules and try to get a centralized place for the new info.

Release info:

Generic Oxymorpone ER by Impax Labs, mfr by Global has been released as of January 8th, 2013.

Finally guys! It's out. I literally have the pills in my hand. I will post pictures shortly of them. I can confirm that they are round, about the same profile as the Endo ERs. They have a coating similar to the old octagons. They were designed by Impax labs, but the prescription says the manufacturer is Global. The 30mg Oxymorphone ER tablets I received are yellowish-brown and say G77 on them. I talked to impax and confirmed they are crushable. I just got back from the pharmacy. I literally got word from one of the pain management pharmacy's on Monday that they had received their first 40mg batch of the new generics, so I was able to get the 30s when I got my script. The coating comes off just like the old stop signs. There is a lot less powder than even the Activis generics.

ISO Extraction:

Ok, so I've done quite a bit of experimentation with these but it turns out it's a lot easier to do the alcohol extraction with these. You do not have to remove the coating. A lot less iso alcohol is needed for the extraction. You don't need to wait as long because they crush so finely. You do have to be more carefuele. Here are the steps:

- Crush the pills with the coating on
- Dump the powder into shot glass with ISO alcohol 91%+ (2-4mL is needed per pill)
- Stir every couple of minutes for 15 minutes (or less if you don't want to wait because I don't notice a difference with how long I wait)
- Put half a cotton ball presoaked in ISO alky into a 10mg oral syringe and stuff it to the bottom. Use the plunger to push the cotton as flat as possible at the bottom
- Once you are ready, get containers together to portion out your doses (I put 15mg per container by maesuring out the alcohol mixture appropriately)
- Squirt the oxymorphone ER/iso mixture into the back of the syringe with the cotton in it
- **IMPORTANT** Let the mixture go through the cotton into the containers on its own. Don't push with the plunger. It may take a little longer but pushing with a plunger will make fine particles that will gel later on get into your containers. You can use a plunger if it looks like it's clogged and not going through but do not go all the way to the bottom and try to wring out the cotton. It will make particles come through.
- Once you are done, run a few more mL of iso through again, never pressing the plunger against the cotton or the particles will come out.
- When you are done, set up a blow drier (I rig it up in my dresser drawers point to the floor) and a tray with your containers and set the blow drier far enough away so your containers don't go blowing or secure your containers down.
- In about 5-10 minutes depending on how much you put per container, it will be perfectly dry and ready to add water. There will be no gel matrix in the containers and your post filtered iso before blow drying should be clear...if it's not, you pushed on the plunger and got the particles through which isn't a big deal, you will need to soak more when adding water before using. It won't go through a micron if you get too much gelling matrix in, but you just need to let it soak in water like I just said and it's not a big deal.

Relevant legal information

Endo tried to sue the FDA to prevent these from being released, but the FDA smacked down the lawsuit saying that Endo was only concerned about being the sole manufacturer of Opana and not the safety of the patients, as evident by their new patent on the crush resistant formula. They tried to claim that the FDA should not allow the unsafe non-crush resistant generic forms to be sold because of abuse, but the judge saw right through what Endo was saying. Good for the judge...I tip my hat to him. I love to see the legal system actually work!

Hope this helps! It took me a while to figure this out...it works
  #2  
Old 03-03-2013, 02:10
Drummer16 Drummer16 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

**WARNING**

I would be careful injecting these. Something just isn't right. I think and have been using 5 or more 30s a day since I got them the day they were released. I think it causes acute kidney failure when using the result of the alcohol extraction over time. These are better left snorted until someone can figure out how to prevent the extra chemical that is being dissolved into the alcohol and making it through the filtration process. I am getting all sorts of blood clotting (surface and deep thrombosis), swelling of extremities, chills, sore muscles, and cola colored urine from IMing.

Does anyone have any information on the ingredients of these pills? They have to be published somewhere...it would be very beneficial to figure out what the additional chemical is that would be causing this. You can tell there is something in there because they foam after you put the resulting dried OM from the Iso extraction mixed with water through a micron filter.

This is potentially a life threatening issue that people need to be aware of. This is serious...

Drummer16 added 1 Minutes and 22 Seconds later...

Also, it doesn't make difference if you leave the coating on or remove it ahead of time. The problems still occur.

Last edited by Drummer16; 03-03-2013 at 02:10. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
  #3  
Old 03-03-2013, 02:24
Frmrjunkie Frmrjunkie is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Here's the list of all ingredients contained per pill.

Citation to be edited in shortly


11 DESCRIPTION
Oxymorphone hydrochloride extended-release tablets are for oral use and contain oxymorphone, a semi-synthetic opioid analgesic. Oxymorphone hydrochloride extended-release tablets are supplied in 5 mg, 7.5 mg, 10 mg, 15 mg, 20 mg, 30 mg, and 40 mg tablet strengths for oral administration. The tablet strength describes the amount of oxymorphone hydrochloride per tablet.
The tablets contain the following inactive ingredients: microcrystalline cellulose, lactose monohydrate, hypromellose, xanthan gum, magnesium stearate, polyvinyl alcohol – partially hydrolyzed, macrogol, talc, and titanium dioxide. The 5 mg, 7.5 mg, 10 mg, 20 mg, and 40 mg tablets contain FD&C Yellow #6 Aluminum Lake. In addition, the 5 mg tablets contain FD&C Blue #2 and D&C Red #27. The 7.5 mg tablets contain FD&C Blue #2 and FD&C Red #40. The 20 mg tablets contain D&C Yellow #10 Aluminum Lake, FD&C Blue #1, and FD&C Blue #2. The 30 mg tablets contain Iron Oxide Yellow and Iron Oxide Black. The 40 mg tablets contain D&C Yellow #10 Aluminum Lake.
The chemical name of oxymorphone hydrochloride is 4, 5α -epoxy-3, 14-dihydroxy-17-methylmorphinan-6-one hydrochloride, a white or slightly off-white, odorless powder, which is sparingly soluble in alcohol and ether, but freely soluble in water. The molecular weight of oxymorphone hydrochloride is 337.80. The pKa1 and pKa2 of oxymorphone at 37°C are 8.17 and 9.54, respectively. The octanol/aqueous partition coefficient at 37°C and pH 7.4 is 0.98.
The structural formula for oxymorphone hydrochloride is as follows:


Do not think I can link directly to site info came from as it is a .gov site so the .gov has been removed & replaced by .ass

http://dailymed.nlm.nih.ASS/dailymed...1f8#nlm34089-3
  #4  
Old 06-03-2013, 21:02
Drummer16 Drummer16 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

I found that same ingredient list on another forum a week ago or so. I was going through the list of ingredients to see which ones could be being absorbed and causing the issues. If you are able to get the OLD Opana ER ingredient list (for the octagons), we can cross reference it with this list and see what's different. I mean, I know other people used to inject the octagons for years, and I know they did not have all these issues. Here are the results of my research:

LACTOSE MONOHYDRATE - SOLUBLE IN WATER
HYPROMELLOSE - SOLUBLE WATER INSOLUBLE ETHANOL

IRON OXIDE - INSOLUBLE IN WATER
TITANIUM DIOXIDE - INSOLUBLE IN WATER
TALC - INSOLUBLE IN WATER AND ETHANOL
POLYETHYLENE GLYCOLS/MACROGOL - SOLUBLE IN WATER AND ETHANOL
XANTHAN GUM - SOLUBLE IN WATER AND ETHANOL
MAGNESIUM STEARATE - INSOLUBLE IN WATER
POLYVINYL ALCOHOL - SOLUBLE IN WATER AND SLIGHTLY SOLUBLE IN ETHANOL

So, bolded are the ones that could potentially end up in the final product after doing an alcohol extraction, since the 91% alcohol contains 9% water. Correct me if I am wrong on the solubility in water thing, guys, since I am making an assumption there. I know the Macrogol and Polyethlyene Glycols are in the old formulation because I believe those are what cause the fizzing. I take Miralax (which is a MIRACLE for opiate induced constipation. Trust me I have ~200mg oxymorphone a day...take a full cap full in water/drink of choice with 5 fiber pills, and you will shit out soft-serve yogurt instead of rocks), and PG is the main ingredient in Miralax. Miralax also foams the same way that these pills doI with the filters. So, I would say we can cross off Macrgols and PG off the list, especially since I found online that they aren't that bad to have in the bloodstream. They can actually help heal damaged nerves in guinea pigs.

So please, anyone with chemistry knowledge or experience, can you please give us any information as to which of these chemicals could be making it into the 91% isopropyl alcohol extraction and causing the previously mentioned issues?
  #5  
Old 09-03-2013, 07:07
Drummer16 Drummer16 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

So here are the ingredients for the old octagons. The list is the union of all different strengths and sizes. Let me do some research to figure out what the intersection of this set of ingredients is and then take the difference and narrow down which it could be...

Opana Er Ingredients


Active Ingredients

Oxymorphone Hydrochloride

Inactive Ingredients

Hypromelloses
Methylparaben
Sodium Stearyl Fumarate
Titanium Dioxide
Triacetin
Fd&c Yellow No. 6
D&c Yellow No. 10
Lactose Monohydrate
Cellulose Microcrystalline
Polyethylene Glycols
Polysorbate 80
Fd&c Blue No. 1
.alpha. Tocopherol
Citric Acid Monohydrate
Polyvinyl Alcohol
Talc
Ferric Oxide Red
Ferrosoferric Oxide
Ferric Oxide Yellow
Polyethylene Glycol
Propylene Glycol


* Products contain combinations of these ingredients.
  #6  
Old 10-03-2013, 06:12
sterling77 Iridium member sterling77 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drummer16 View Post
So here are the ingredients for the old octagons. The list is the union of all different strengths and sizes. Let me do some research to figure out what the intersection of this set of ingredients is and then take the difference and narrow down which it could be...

Opana Er Ingredients

Active Ingredients

Oxymorphone Hydrochloride

Inactive Ingredients

Hypromelloses
Methylparaben
Sodium Stearyl Fumarate
Titanium Dioxide
Triacetin
Fd&c Yellow No. 6
D&c Yellow No. 10
Lactose Monohydrate
Cellulose Microcrystalline
Polyethylene Glycols
Polysorbate 80
Fd&c Blue No. 1
.alpha. Tocopherol
Citric Acid Monohydrate
Polyvinyl Alcohol
Talc
Ferric Oxide Red
Ferrosoferric Oxide
Ferric Oxide Yellow
Polyethylene Glycol
Propylene Glycol

* Products contain combinations of these ingredients.

I think you may have posted the wrong ingredient list.


I believe the culprit here may be partially hydrolyzed Polyvinyl Alcohol (PVA). This ingredient is common to both the tamper-resistant Endo Opana, and the new Impax/Global Pharm generics, but not in the old octagon formulation. Since it is partially hydrolyzed, I believe the PVA's present may be of the high molecular weight variety. This ingredient *IS* WATER SOLUBLE, meaning it will even pass through a micron filter in cold water. It can cause anemia, proteinuria, kidney failure, hepatic failure, clotting issues, fever, chills, embolism, vascular lesions, spleen issues, etc. It can aggregate in organs such as the liver, spleen, brain.

Intravenous use in humans is not too well studied as far as I can tell, and it is sometimes used in medicine for embolization of abnormal tissues. There are numerous studies showing dangerous side effects when administered IV or SC to animals.

Last edited by sterling77; 10-03-2013 at 06:22.
  #7  
Old 10-03-2013, 08:29
Drummer16 Drummer16 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Quote:
Originally Posted by sterling77 View Post
I think you may have posted the wrong ingredient list.


I believe the culprit here may be partially hydrolyzed Polyvinyl Alcohol (PVA). This ingredient is common to both the tamper-resistant Endo Opana, and the new Impax/Global Pharm generics, but not in the old octagon formulation. Since it is partially hydrolyzed, I believe the PVA's present may be of the high molecular weight variety. This ingredient *IS* WATER SOLUBLE, meaning it will even pass through a micron filter in cold water. It can cause anemia, proteinuria, kidney failure, hepatic failure, clotting issues, fever, chills, embolism, vascular lesions, spleen issues, etc. It can aggregate in organs such as the liver, spleen, brain.

Intravenous use in humans is not too well studied as far as I can tell, and it is sometimes used in medicine for embolization of abnormal tissues. There are numerous studies showing dangerous side effects when administered IV or SC to animals.
Thank you for the great information. I posted the ingredient list for the old octagon ER tablets, which people have been injecting for years without these problems. I looked it up by NDC number, so I know I got the right one. The new crush proof ones have a different NDC number.

Regardless of the ingredient list I posted and whether or not it's the right one, the fact of the matter is if what you are saying is correct, then we need to find a way to get rid of that ingredient. It is POISON. Many people will be affected, and yes, that ingredient was one of the ingredients that was soluble in both ethanol and water, so it would not be filterable with a micron filter.

So, what to do? Do you or anyone else have any idea how to get rid of this chemical? The fact that we are doing an alcohol extraction means that it sounds like it will be difficult to remove this chemical, if not impossible. I wonder if this chemical exists in just the coating, and I am not doing a good enough job removing the full coating. I mean the fact that it says poly vinyl makes me think it's in the coating and I am not removing it fully, even when I wipe it off with my alcohol swabs. I hope that this is the issue and I just have to potentially sacrifice more of the pill or use a razorblade to remove the full coating.

What do you think about this?

Thank you so much for narrowing it down for me. I'm IMing, though, and not IVing. However, those are the EXACT symptoms being experienced, even down to the anemia. Testing was confirmed via lab tests, urine is brown and smells odd, having fever, clotting, chills, and all the issues you mentioned (probably damage I cannot even see). Do you think this is an issue with the coating of the pill? I have received PMs from other users experiencing the same issues with the new generics, and this can end up KILLING people if we don't figure this out soon. People will sacrifice their own well being to avoid withdrawals, we know this. In this case, it could be fatal.
  #8  
Old 10-03-2013, 17:27
sterling77 Iridium member sterling77 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drummer16 View Post
Thank you for the great information. I posted the ingredient list for the old octagon ER tablets, which people have been injecting for years without these problems. I looked it up by NDC number, so I know I got the right one. The new crush proof ones have a different NDC number.

Regardless of the ingredient list I posted and whether or not it's the right one, the fact of the matter is if what you are saying is correct, then we need to find a way to get rid of that ingredient. It is POISON. Many people will be affected, and yes, that ingredient was one of the ingredients that was soluble in both ethanol and water, so it would not be filterable with a micron filter.

So, what to do? Do you or anyone else have any idea how to get rid of this chemical? The fact that we are doing an alcohol extraction means that it sounds like it will be difficult to remove this chemical, if not impossible. I wonder if this chemical exists in just the coating, and I am not doing a good enough job removing the full coating. I mean the fact that it says poly vinyl makes me think it's in the coating and I am not removing it fully, even when I wipe it off with my alcohol swabs. I hope that this is the issue and I just have to potentially sacrifice more of the pill or use a razorblade to remove the full coating.

What do you think about this?

Thank you so much for narrowing it down for me. I'm IMing, though, and not IVing. However, those are the EXACT symptoms being experienced, even down to the anemia. Testing was confirmed via lab tests, urine is brown and smells odd, having fever, clotting, chills, and all the issues you mentioned (probably damage I cannot even see). Do you think this is an issue with the coating of the pill? I have received PMs from other users experiencing the same issues with the new generics, and this can end up KILLING people if we don't figure this out soon. People will sacrifice their own well being to avoid withdrawals, we know this. In this case, it could be fatal.
Here is the ingredient list straight from Endo's website for the original octagons:

Inactive ingredients: hypromellose, methylparaben, silicified microcrystalline cellulose, sodium stearyl fumarate, TIMERx-N, titanium dioxide, and triacetin.
The 5 mg, 10 mg, 15 mg, 20 mg, and 30 mg tablets also contain macrogol, and polysorbate 80.
In addition, the 5 mg, 7.5 mg and 30 mg tablets contain iron oxide red. The 7.5 mg tablets contain iron oxide black, and iron oxide yellow. The 10 mg tablets contain FD&C yellow No. 6. The 20 mg tablets contain FD&C blue No. 1, FD&C yellow No. 6, and D&C yellow No. 10. The 40 mg tablets contain FD&C yellow No. 6, D&C yellow No. 10, and lactose monohydrate.

They actually reformulated it twice, and the first time it was reformulated they weren't around very long, so I think there might be a possibility you're posting the ingredients for that one (the biconvex ones). Kind of confusing. From what I can tell, the original octagons do not seem to have Polyvinyl Alcohol.

I meant to include in my previous post that, yes, I do think the Polyvinyl Alcohol is a component of the coating. It is used for films and coatings, however we can't be completely sure that it is not elsewhere in the pill. Also, we don't know the exact molecular weight or extent of hydrolyzation, which is very very relevant here. The amount of water in the alcohol extraction is probably more than enough to extract the Polyvinyl Alcohol. It doesn't seem to be very soluble in organic solvents so a solvent extraction is probably necessary.

This is a potentially a huge widespread health problem as these generics continue to hit the market. I hope my theory about the polyvinyl alcohol is wrong, but I believe anyone who has done these generic pills has an obligation to post about whether or not they have had side effects.
  #9  
Old 10-03-2013, 21:27
Drummer16 Drummer16 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Quote:
Originally Posted by sterling77 View Post
Here is the ingredient list straight from Endo's website for the original octagons:

Inactive ingredients: hypromellose, methylparaben, silicified microcrystalline cellulose, sodium stearyl fumarate, TIMERx-N, titanium dioxide, and triacetin.
The 5 mg, 10 mg, 15 mg, 20 mg, and 30 mg tablets also contain macrogol, and polysorbate 80.
In addition, the 5 mg, 7.5 mg and 30 mg tablets contain iron oxide red. The 7.5 mg tablets contain iron oxide black, and iron oxide yellow. The 10 mg tablets contain FD&C yellow No. 6. The 20 mg tablets contain FD&C blue No. 1, FD&C yellow No. 6, and D&C yellow No. 10. The 40 mg tablets contain FD&C yellow No. 6, D&C yellow No. 10, and lactose monohydrate.

They actually reformulated it twice, and the first time it was reformulated they weren't around very long, so I think there might be a possibility you're posting the ingredients for that one (the biconvex ones). Kind of confusing. From what I can tell, the original octagons do not seem to have Polyvinyl Alcohol.

I meant to include in my previous post that, yes, I do think the Polyvinyl Alcohol is a component of the coating. It is used for films and coatings, however we can't be completely sure that it is not elsewhere in the pill. Also, we don't know the exact molecular weight or extent of hydrolyzation, which is very very relevant here. The amount of water in the alcohol extraction is probably more than enough to extract the Polyvinyl Alcohol. It doesn't seem to be very soluble in organic solvents so a solvent extraction is probably necessary.

This is a potentially a huge widespread health problem as these generics continue to hit the market. I hope my theory about the polyvinyl alcohol is wrong, but I believe anyone who has done these generic pills has an obligation to post about whether or not they have had side effects.
Unfortunately, your theory seems to be more and more accurate as I do more research. The generics I had been doing extraction on previously did not have a coating, and they, too, do not have polyvinyl alcohol in them. Here's a link to the ingredients for the Activis 15mg ER generics (no coating) which I used for a year with NO PROBLEMS:

http://www.medicationdaily.com/oxymo.../00228-3262-50

So since those don't have a coating, it looks like that may be the culprit in these new pills. I mean, everything inside the new generic pill is powder, and very fine powder at that. I wouldn't think, based on the description of polyvinyl alcohol, that it would be used in a fine powder like that. So, we have to make sure we use a razor blade, get off the ENTIRE coating (maybe even a little extra of the layer to be extra safe) and then do the alcohol extraction and just eat the coating instead of throwing it away. I rub off my coating right now and it makes it so that some of it still remains on the pill (the pill isn't perfectly white) but it just seems so odd that if it was just in the coating, you would think that since I got rid of the majority of it, that the issue would stop happening. I'm basically inducing embolisms every time I take a dose, and inducing embolisms is preventing the drug from even working. My legs are swollen and have lumps the size of half of a tennis ball under the skin all over. My upper arms are the same way, but hey, at least up there it's more consistent and I look buff lol. Seriously, I have run out of areas to inject and I can't even administer a dose anymore.

This is getting out of hand, and I am just going to snort these if removing the coating with a razor blade still doesn't fix the problem, and just inject the IRs, so I can save myself. I must say that I do notice chunks of coating in my pre-filtered alcohol extraction, even after rubbing off, so maybe that is it...let's hope that the layer is extra thick and we're just not getting it all. Anyways, thanks for everything, sterling, and please, continue to let me know anything you find out. I will do the same.
  #10  
Old 11-03-2013, 01:16
sterling77 Iridium member sterling77 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drummer16 View Post
Unfortunately, your theory seems to be more and more accurate as I do more research. The generics I had been doing extraction on previously did not have a coating, and they, too, do not have polyvinyl alcohol in them. Here's a link to the ingredients for the Activis 15mg ER generics (no coating) which I used for a year with NO PROBLEMS:

http://www.medicationdaily.com/oxymo.../00228-3262-50

So since those don't have a coating, it looks like that may be the culprit in these new pills. I mean, everything inside the new generic pill is powder, and very fine powder at that. I wouldn't think, based on the description of polyvinyl alcohol, that it would be used in a fine powder like that. So, we have to make sure we use a razor blade, get off the ENTIRE coating (maybe even a little extra of the layer to be extra safe) and then do the alcohol extraction and just eat the coating instead of throwing it away. I rub off my coating right now and it makes it so that some of it still remains on the pill (the pill isn't perfectly white) but it just seems so odd that if it was just in the coating, you would think that since I got rid of the majority of it, that the issue would stop happening. I'm basically inducing embolisms every time I take a dose, and inducing embolisms is preventing the drug from even working. My legs are swollen and have lumps the size of half of a tennis ball under the skin all over. My upper arms are the same way, but hey, at least up there it's more consistent and I look buff lol. Seriously, I have run out of areas to inject and I can't even administer a dose anymore.

This is getting out of hand, and I am just going to snort these if removing the coating with a razor blade still doesn't fix the problem, and just inject the IRs, so I can save myself. I must say that I do notice chunks of coating in my pre-filtered alcohol extraction, even after rubbing off, so maybe that is it...let's hope that the layer is extra thick and we're just not getting it all. Anyways, thanks for everything, sterling, and please, continue to let me know anything you find out. I will do the same.
Unfortunately, the nature of some symptoms and the polymer aggregations would not be something that would immediately go away in between consistent dosing... I think it's possible for high molecular weight PVA's to get stuck in the body for months and years in certain circumstances.

I believe it's possible Polyvinyl Alcohol may be the mystery chemical that is responsible for the outbreak of Thrombotic Thrombocytopenic Purpura (TTP) symptoms in abusers of Opana in Tennessee.
  #11  
Old 18-03-2013, 02:41
Drummer16 Drummer16 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Yea, the problem is greatly lessened when you use 99% ISO alcohol (and the PG is gone too) I THINK. I know the PG is gone with 99% alcohol but I can't find the solubility of oxymorphone in almost a pure alcohol solution. It just says sparingly soluble which could mean 100mg dissolves in 100ml lol. So, uhhh, I need to find that answer or just bit the bullet and try it. Man, the powder is so weird when I use 99%. I guess if it doesn't work...I'll just do a wash with 91% right after. I have been using 99% to remove the coating of the pill then adding water in later once the coat is removed then adding a little h20 to dilute it to 91% just before portioning it out to my doses to dry. I will not add water this time and see what happens.

Let me report back. Kinda hard to tell if shit works with so much damage done to me already. I got some in a vein on accident and omg it hurt so bad and caused such a bad clot. How can you do this?
  #12  
Old 02-05-2013, 06:27
Drummer16 Drummer16 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

How has no one posted in this thread? This is extremely serious and can cause issues that are deadly. The anemia is real...do NOT expose the coating to water under any circumstances if you are prepping this for IM/IV. Do not even lick it off or rub it off or anything like that. The safest thing you can do, from what I have found, is you drop the pills straight from the pill bottle into 99% alcohol. It penetrates the coating rather quickly and you can stir and try to get most of the crushed pill separated from the coating. I then strain the coating out and crush it up and eat/snort the extra powder it once it's dry. The remaining solution I add a slight bit of water to and stir it for a few minutes then push it through a large amount of cotton. You can basically tell if you have the PVA in your solution because there will be a translucent film when you are drying. I noticed that when I keep the alcohol percentage high, it doesn't have this. It could be the PVA or it could be the PEG, but either way, keep the mixture exposed to water briefly and the alcohol content above 95%. You need some water to make sure you get the OM otherwise it's a waste. I don't think you can absorb enough of the OM in straight 99%, as I noticed a decrease in quality when not adding some water.

The problem is with this coating (probably due to the new ingredients) is that you cannot use a razorblade to separate it from the powder. It is basically stuck to a layer of powder that will remove a significant amount of the pill. I read up on the PVA as there is some good literature out there on its effects. We cannot be certain that it isn't in the pills as well, but I would imagine since the powder is so fine, that it is not. It's unfortunate the effects may last for a long time, and I am pretty much fucked. It's back to snorting for me, but god only knows if that crosses via the nasal cavity membrane anyways. Bastards put poison in our pills and don't warn us. I sadly miss the 15mg Activis ER generics...I wish my insurance would cover them. I hope we get new generics soon what with Impax's monopoly running short on time.
  #13  
Old 02-05-2013, 23:57
NativeAddiction NativeAddiction is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Here is my question. I am on my first script of the impax oxymorphone HCL ER 20 mg 2X day. I also take 10 mg of IR 4X day. So at first I was sniffing them the first day I got them while I was still on my last fentanyl patch, and I sniffed 3 and got a buzz. However since being off the fentanyl and just on the ER and IR, I have to swallow them because if I don't I will go into withdrawals about ten hours in. I have always sniffed them from the getgo, but just can't anymore because my nose is so effed up, and I can't breathe when I sleep despite cleaning with saline and every mist possible.

The pain relief is zilch when swallowed. I have legitimate chronic pain and as I had always sniffed them before I was RX'Ed them, I expected when I swallowed them I would get some relief, even though I know how poor oral bio is. So I take one ER in AM and one before bed and use the IRs in between. Even if I go on using this for days this way, if one day I sniff 3 20s at a time if I am in killer pain it does NOTHING, nada. What the hell is going on? I was beyond excited when I found out impax finally released the generic, because before a 40 would not only rid me of pain 90% but I would also get a buzz. My tolerance cannot be that high from swallowing them for the most part.

Somebody please give me some advice. I try to eat a fatty meal when taking the ERs orally but even that doesn't help. I was under the impression it would increase plasma levels by almost 50%. What am I doing wrong? Should I just give up on trying to get even the slightest buzz since I am taking 80mg total including the IR? But how come when I sniff 3 at a time on a bad day it STILL does nothing? My tolerance either went sky high from the fent or something else is up

Although I am sure this is nothing new to any of you, I use chelates magnesium pills which help keep my tolerance down and it actually works, just 1 oral per day. Any help would be GREATLY appreciated!

NativeAddiction added 2 Minutes and 26 Seconds later...

One more question: I am unaware of how micron filters work and I am wondering if they are only for IV use, which I am 100% staying away from. I would love to find a way to filter my IRs because its a shitload of powder. I really want to stay away from anything but oral use with the ERs just because of the talc in them and the whole thing about them causing silicosis.

Last edited by NativeAddiction; 02-05-2013 at 23:57. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
  #14  
Old 10-05-2013, 02:48
Drummer16 Drummer16 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Honestly, if you are IMing just the IRs using a .2 micron filter, you are getting pretty much medical grade liquid with no other chemicals in it. If there is any small amount of fillers or binders that make it through, your body would just absorb them and you'd be fine. The water from micron filtering an IR is crystal clear and virtually sterile if you do it right, which isn't hard to do. The problem is micron filters are expensive ($1 per filter is the cheapest you'll get them for), and you have to use one per IR. If I had the option, I would swallow the ERs and IM the IRs, but I can't rationalize wasting that much oxymorphone. It really all is relative, though, because your tolerance will just scale down to whatever you use on a daily basis. If you step down in dosage, depending on how much you step down, your body will feel shitty until it adjusts to the new dosage, which is what you are experiencing. The problem is, if you want to get high every day, it's impossible without experiencing corresponding negative feelings. If you want effective pain control and to just feel normal every day, that is possible. Tolerance and withdrawal of opiates is all relative. My gf withdrawals with similar symptoms to me from one drop out of the 3ml shots I take...one drop given twice daily.

As for your tolerance, opana is notorious for causing a very quick tolerance that can go up indefinitely. I only pretty much feel my first dose of the day, and that's because I go from withdrawling to not withdrawling maybe. After that, I just feel "normal" except for when I redose there is a slight uplift in mood. I can IV 60mg and not even nod. It's pretty pathetic. Recently because of the stupid Impax ERs, my doses have been inconsistent and I don't even feel my withdrawals go away until later, so I am having really weird patterns of when my body decides to finally "feel good". It's usually after a long bout of feeling shitty lol. It's all about your receptors being burnt out. You can't feel good forever, even with increasing the dosage. Eventually you'll get the horrible headache that we all know too well. I can't even get that anymore. I think my body now thinks that oxymorphone is an invader and attacks it before it even gets to my brain lolz.

***THE FOLLOWING IS JUST ADVICE BASED ON MY OWN EXPERIENCE, DO NOT TAKE AS TRUTH OR SOMETHING YOU SHOULD DO***
If I were you and you've decided you want to stay on opiates, get some micron filters, some 25 gauge 1" needles (which are cheap), some medical grade water, some alcohol swabs, and use that and continue swallowing your ERs. Never reuse the same needle and always swab the area first and let it dry fully. No one will know because it's very discrete where you inject and doesn't leave a mark, unlike IVing. Also, IRs are very easy on the body and are very safe if properly filtered. ERs on the other hand, are evil and will cause serious health problems if injected. Remember, choosing to go down this route is a big decision and should not be taken lightly. It's equivalent of jumping from oral usage to snorting to go from snorting to IMing. To go from IMing to IVing is also an analogous jump. IVing is just bad because it causes permanent, systemic damage to your veins and the instant rush is just too addictive. But really, I am just telling you what I would do having gone down all the paths. This is by no means advice that you should take as something you SHOULD do. You should stop using opiates altogether if you can. They are evil. This advice is just the safest, most effective solution to your problem heh. Just because something has a negative stigma by society doesn't mean it's unsafe. Obviously, there are many junkies out there that do things wrong...I've seen people IVing black tar into their veins that wasn't filtered using a rusty needle with no alcohol swab with water they got from the sink. Remember, always start small and work your way up. IMing a 10mg pill is like swallowing 10 10mg IRs. So, know your limits as with everything. If you go down this route, you will be faced with the same problem again in the future, but at least you'll be able to have fun and have working opiates for a while. Some people I know go on a suboxone break every couple of weeks to try to lower their tolerance. I think that is silliness.
***END OF ADVICE THAT SHOULD BE TAKEN WITH 10 GRAINS OF SALT***

I hate these ERs. I've confirmed they have caused damage to me. Beware all...we are going to have a similar situation of them pulling the ERs from the market due to the adverse health effects caused by improper use.
  #15  
Old 22-07-2013, 03:54
Drummer16 Drummer16 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Why aren't people commenting on these generics? Is it because they are only available in California? I mean, I haven't had any trouble getting them. I still see people posting about dealing with the name brand when they could easily get these. Well, I guess it is a good thing for me to have a consistent supply without everyone running the mfr out of supply. But that doesn't help collaboration on solving these health issues regarding these tablets. Maybe, they are only available in CA...bizarre...I would picture this thread exploding with comments.
  #16  
Old 23-07-2013, 11:01
mistman mistman is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Very important information you have posted Drummer16. I currently am only getting IR's and have not ran across these ER's. I don't IV or IM and never will. A lot of people do, however. They need to be made aware of what you have learned. I believe the thread would get a lot more attention if you put the very real chance of death or organ failure in the title. In lieu of that you may want to start a new thread. In any case good job.
  #17  
Old 25-07-2013, 20:29
sdrow sdrow is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Hey, thanks for the information Drummer16. I actually joined this place to get info about the new generics..
Reading your posts I've been wondering, because I may be getting the new generics and would love to IV (and was looking forward to a little ISO extraction process);

Do you think that those extremely adverse side effects would happen with limited use? For example, if one were to only Inject (IV) the extraction once, or once a day, would the clotting, etc. happen immediately or say after a couple of days of regular use. I ask because of your experience injecting this solution 5x/day.. I assume with use not as regular as yours the clotting would happen eventually, but maybe take more time. I am no professional though, obviously.

Also if one were to plug (possibly?) the solution (extracted, evap. + water), it wouldn't be going directly into the body like IM or IV would be - similar to nasal passage but better absorption (so I've read) , that this may reduce the problem? (I don't particularly like plugging, but if I'm going to get blood clots from IV... )

And I read somewhere that sniffing oxyM hass 40% bioavailablility, which seems like a waste to me? If I get 20mg and snort the whole pill only about 8mg will be in effect? Do you have any better information than this?
- Do these gel inside your nasal passage? I tried sniffing the new Opana ER once and the gooey slime that produced was just disturbing.

sdrow added 100 Minutes and 11 Seconds later...

*my post isn't directed to anyone specific although I did thank Drummer16 in the beginning. If anyone has any answers feel free to respond, and thank you for any information you have.

Last edited by sdrow; 25-07-2013 at 20:29. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
  #18  
Old 03-08-2013, 08:10
Drummer16 Drummer16 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Thanks guys, and you are welcome for the information. Basically, the blood clots form when you miss (and you will miss because injecting something that thickens your blood is quite difficult). When you do hit (and if you do it all day like me), you will start to notice edema happening at a more systemic level. So, your feet will swell, arms and hands, etc. It's not good. It impairs healing when your body thinks its oncotic pressure is out of whack and you have all this extra water/blood at the surface. The edema will break after usage stops because opiates bloat you up already and adding this to the equation just makes the problem serious. You can take a diuretic or let your body sweat it out overnight, but make sure you drink a ton of water so you can not have a heart attack or stroke from your sludge blood. I know because when I do the IRs on their own I don't have these problems.

Good news is I did notice is that once I have changed my process, things have gotten a bit better. I may be losing more of the OM, but it's worth it to not...die. So, I have to make a special blend of alcohol because 91% seems to be too soluble to do this. I basically just drop the pills in a shot glass with a little 99% alky and stir occasionally with an opened paperclip until the coating and pill separate. Then, I take the solution and strain it. I pour some 99% over the coatings to get the remaining powder. I toss the coatings aside at this point. Then, I basically turn the 99% alcohol into ~95% alcohol by adding the right amount of 91%. This minimizes dissolving the PEG and PVA. I think the PVA is mostly in the coatings, which are tossed aside for nasal use. Then, I slowly filter the remaining stirred solution of 95% and white ER powder through a half a cotton ball in a 10ML syringe and put it into containers to each be doses. It works out pretty well, and I know this because if I am missing 5mg from a dose I would know it and my 2 ER dose for the day is the best one. I let the fan dry em or use a blow drier if I need it within 15 mins. The resulting dried crusty film should be orange/yellow. The more white that is in it, the more PEG made it through your cotton filtration, or your solution was below 95%. I put it into 6 15mg doses and then add my white IR and water once all the alky is dry and dissolve the pill in the water and scrape the containers. Gives me a nice ~25mg dose, which I need like every 2-4 hours to live lol. By the end of the day I am still swollen because I sometimes get white in the containers when in a rush, but exercise and sweating it out is essential, so take breaks from the ERs if you can. Or, be more diligent in your process. Unfortunately, it takes tweaking of the process to get it right. Once you get it, you will know. The resulting dried residue should be extremmmeeellyyy bitter. That's how you know you got the OM. I really thing the orangeness depends on how slowly it evaporates.

Once a day should be fine, depending on how much you have.

I heard rectal was only 10%, so I have never tried it. Snorting is good if you like walking around with a bunch of goo. You'd be lucky to get 40% BA snorting...there are so many other factors that make it not absorb, like post-nasal drainage, gelling, etc. Maybe, try snorting the dried powder mixed with a tiny water to form a nasal spray solution after doing my process. That would probably get you closer to the 43% or whatever the intranasal BA is, and it would be by far the safest method. Well, I hope a lot of people don't use water, fire, and spoons with these babies or it's going to be a problem.

The mfr is in California, so maybe that's why it's easier to find? I've never had a problem with having these in stock. I want to try the teva generic IRs, but all I can get are Roxannes.
  #19  
Old 03-08-2013, 19:07
mistman mistman is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drummer16 View Post
Thanks guys, and you are welcome for the information. Basically, the blood clots form when you miss (and you will miss because injecting something that thickens your blood is quite difficult). When you do hit (and if you do it all day like me), you will start to notice edema happening at a more systemic level. So, your feet will swell, arms and hands, etc. It's not good. It impairs healing when your body thinks its oncotic pressure is out of whack and you have all this extra water/blood at the surface. The edema will break after usage stops because opiates bloat you up already and adding this to the equation just makes the problem serious. You can take a diuretic or let your body sweat it out overnight, but make sure you drink a ton of water so you can not have a heart attack or stroke from your sludge blood. I know because when I do the IRs on their own I don't have these problems.

Good news is I did notice is that once I have changed my process, things have gotten a bit better. I may be losing more of the OM, but it's worth it to not...die. So, I have to make a special blend of alcohol because 91% seems to be too soluble to do this. I basically just drop the pills in a shot glass with a little 99% alky and stir occasionally with an opened paperclip until the coating and pill separate. Then, I take the solution and strain it. I pour some 99% over the coatings to get the remaining powder. I toss the coatings aside at this point. Then, I basically turn the 99% alcohol into ~95% alcohol by adding the right amount of 91%. This minimizes dissolving the PEG and PVA. I think the PVA is mostly in the coatings, which are tossed aside for nasal use. Then, I slowly filter the remaining stirred solution of 95% and white ER powder through a half a cotton ball in a 10ML syringe and put it into containers to each be doses. It works out pretty well, and I know this because if I am missing 5mg from a dose I would know it and my 2 ER dose for the day is the best one. I let the fan dry em or use a blow drier if I need it within 15 mins. The resulting dried crusty film should be orange/yellow. The more white that is in it, the more PEG made it through your cotton filtration, or your solution was below 95%. I put it into 6 15mg doses and then add my white IR and water once all the alky is dry and dissolve the pill in the water and scrape the containers. Gives me a nice ~25mg dose, which I need like every 2-4 hours to live lol. By the end of the day I am still swollen because I sometimes get white in the containers when in a rush, but exercise and sweating it out is essential, so take breaks from the ERs if you can. Or, be more diligent in your process. Unfortunately, it takes tweaking of the process to get it right. Once you get it, you will know. The resulting dried residue should be extremmmeeellyyy bitter. That's how you know you got the OM. I really thing the orangeness depends on how slowly it evaporates.

Once a day should be fine, depending on how much you have.

I heard rectal was only 10%, so I have never tried it. Snorting is good if you like walking around with a bunch of goo. You'd be lucky to get 40% BA snorting...there are so many other factors that make it not absorb, like post-nasal drainage, gelling, etc. Maybe, try snorting the dried powder mixed with a tiny water to form a nasal spray solution after doing my process. That would probably get you closer to the 43% or whatever the intranasal BA is, and it would be by far the safest method. Well, I hope a lot of people don't use water, fire, and spoons with these babies or it's going to be a problem.

The mfr is in California, so maybe that's why it's easier to find? I've never had a problem with having these in stock. I want to try the teva generic IRs, but all I can get are Roxannes.
The pink Endo/Qualitest are back out, just recently. Have you asked your pharmacy if they can order them lately? Or tried another pharmacy?
  #20  
Old 18-10-2013, 18:24
Pain-pal Pain-pal is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Hello. Can anyone confirm that generic crushable oxymorphone is still available? I just read this on drugs.com:

Has a generic version of Opana ER been approved?

No. There is currently no therapeutically equivalent version of Opana ER available.

I was going to possibly switch my pain med to oxymorphone but only if the extraction can be done.

Thanks to anyone that can help!
  #21  
Old 21-03-2014, 23:10
Drummer16 Drummer16 is offline
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Re: OFFICIAL: Generic Non-Crush Resistant Oxymorphone ER out now!

Yes, it is still available. I have been getting it every 4 weeks since I started this initial post.

I have also PROVEN that my method will yield up to 95% of the original drug from extraction AND can be done SAFELY. The key is to keep the original ISO at 99% until the pill is COMPLETELY crushed and removed the skins. I also run ISO 99% over the skins until every last particle is off of them, quickly run just a ml of 95% over them when they are sitting in my tea strainer, and toss them aside for tasting / my nose later. Once it is completely dissolved in ISO 99% and the skins are removed, you can start adding ISO 91% if you don't have your own 95% and use it to collect any particles from the container you strained into. Then, I put that washout with the rest of the 99%/particles into the shot glass to form a 95%-96% solution and stir/suck up in 12ml syringe and when ready push into little cups for my 14 doses a day.

Trust me, I have tested this method vs KVK-Tech and Roxanne IR, know my withdrawal cycle and also tested the person who mooches off me, and know without a doubt, that this method can be done safely if you do NOT let that solution sit too long after getting to 95% ISO, have enough cotton to make sure none of the particles make it into the ending cups, and never let it get below 95%. If it does, you will start to see more stuff at the bottom of your cups instead of pure orange resulting product. You may think you are getting "more" if you see more stuff in the cup but what you are getting is dissolved filler that is the activated ER matrix. That will cause you to get swollen feet and other bad stuff. I should post pics so you guys know how to do this...IRs do nothing to me alone...I have to have my 120mg-180mg of ER a day filtered this way or I WD baddd. Oh, and be careful not to nod and spill because I am sure some of you would love to come to my place and lick my carpet because it's packed full of probably a few grams worth of OM that I once cried over...I now make it in a glass baking thing to prevent unrecoverable spillage heh.

If you saw me, you would have no idea that I take 14 doses a day (damn this 1.5 hour half life!) and pretty much feel no pleasure except the 15 seconds after it hits my bloodstream. It is a pain to make, expensive as hell for all the needles/.2 microns, making and taking the doses, and expensive for the drugs, but better than living a life of pain. You CANNOT do this safely unless you have 500+$ to spare a month (the microns run $1-2 each, and clog fast with OM IRs and ERs) and needles/syringes are expensive. Maybe, yall will have better luck with your addictions. Having a partner that is skilled with a needle and can make sure you are ok is always a plus.

But remember, ALWAYS START SMALL AND WORK YOUR WAY UP and DO NOT DO THIS UNLESS YOU ABSOLUTELY HAVE NO OTHER OPTION IN LIFE. NEVER EVER TAKE THE AMOUNT YOU USED TO AFTER PERIODS OF WD OR ABSTINENCE...We don't want people dying or ruining a good thing. This is seriously strong stuff, and as fast as your tolerance will go up, it will go just as fast down. I can't tell you how many times I've had to go 6 hours and then had my dose and nodded hard, and a few times, was walking around with a needle in various spots on my head that was sitting on my desk during a hard nod.

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