The Million Dollar Question

[Stavrogin]

Why Heroin is illegal?

[HandyMan81]

Heroin is named after the German word for hero, heroisch. According to popular legend, its substitute, methadone, was initially christened Dolophine in honour of Adolf Hitler. In reality, the name comes from the Latin dolor, meaning "pain", and fin, meaning "end": hence "end of pain".

Traditionally, the purity of heroin in a bag has ranged from 1% to 10%; more recently, heroin purity has ranged from 1% to 98%, with a US national average of 35 percent. Pure heroin is rarely sold on the street. A bag may contain 100 mg of powder, only a portion of which is heroin; the remainder could be sugars, starch, powdered milk, or quinine. Until recently, heroin in the United States was almost exclusively injected, either intravenously, subcutaneously ("skin-popping"), or intramuscularly. Injection is the most practical and efficient way to administer low-purity heroin. The availability of higher-purity heroin, however, allows users to snort or smoke ("chasing the dragon"). Snorting is most widespread in those areas where high-purity heroin is easy to obtain.


When injected, heroin provides an extremely powerful rush. After 4 to 8 hours, the effects start to wear off. Tolerance develops to the respiratory depressant, sedative, analgesic, emetic and euphorigenic effect. So users tend to increase their daily dose - sometimes as much as a hundredfold or more - if financial resources permit. Financial resources frequently don't: the term "junkie" derives from addicts who stole junk metal to support their habit.

Injecting drugs can be a risky business in prohibitionist society. This is because hygiene is difficult, education is minimal, and fluctuations in quality can lead to accidental overdose. US opposition to needle-exchange programs at home and abroad has massively promoted the spread of HIV and hepatitis in users - and non-users - alike. Noxious tobacco-smoking aside, the Supreme Court of the United States has never been sympathetic to a drug-based lifestyle....

"To be a confirmed drug addict is to be one of the walking dead....The teeth have rotted out, the appetite is lost, and the stomach and intestines don't function properly. The gall bladder becomes inflamed; eyes and skin turn a bilious yellow; in some cases membranes of the nose turn a flaming red; the partition separating the nostrils is eaten away-breathing is difficult. Oxygen in the blood decreases; bronchitis and tuberculosis develop. Good traits of character disappear and bad ones emerge. Sex organs become affected. Veins collapse and livid purplish scars remain. Boils and abscesses plague the skin; gnawing pain racks the body. Nerves snap; vicious twitching develops. Imaginary and fantastic fears blight the mind and sometimes complete insanity results. Often times, too, death comes-much too early in life....Such is the torment of being a drug addict; such is the plague of being one of the walking dead..." (1962)

Reputation Comments on this post:

Good response to a one liner question.

[Stavrogin]

you guys just lost the chance to win a million dollar.

[Fantasian]

Originally Posted by HandyMan81

Injecting drugs can be a risky business in prohibitionist society. This is because hygiene is difficult, education is minimal, and fluctuations in quality can lead to accidental overdose. US opposition to needle-exchange programs at home and abroad has massively promoted the spread of HIV and hepatitis in users - and non-users - alike. Noxious tobacco-smoking aside, the Supreme Court of the United States has never been sympathetic to a drug-based lifestyle....

"To be a confirmed drug addict is to be one of the walking dead....The teeth have rotted out, the appetite is lost, and the stomach and intestines don't function properly. The gall bladder becomes inflamed; eyes and skin turn a bilious yellow; in some cases membranes of the nose turn a flaming red; the partition separating the nostrils is eaten away-breathing is difficult. Oxygen in the blood decreases; bronchitis and tuberculosis develop. Good traits of character disappear and bad ones emerge. Sex organs become affected. Veins collapse and livid purplish scars remain. Boils and abscesses plague the skin; gnawing pain racks the body. Nerves snap; vicious twitching develops. Imaginary and fantastic fears blight the mind and sometimes complete insanity results. Often times, too, death comes-much too early in life....Such is the torment of being a drug addict; such is the plague of being one of the walking dead..." (1962)

Thats a little harsh, many addicts are mum's or dad's and live normal lives provided they can support their habit. Although i know you didnt write it.

In answer to your question there are a host of reasons:
1) It makes people dependant. (when people cant get it anymore it puts them in a very bad place.)
2) It can be overdosed on very easily thus dangerous
3) It is commonly injected which comes with serious health risks especially with the unknown user.
4) It is a drug taken for recreation and has not already had an established past like alchohol or nicotine.
these are just a few.

I think i also read a thread a while back that most opiates were banned because of global politics but youl have to find that yourself.

[Stavrogin]

Originally Posted by Fantasian

In answer to your question there are a host of reasons:
1) It makes people dependant. (when people cant get it anymore it puts them in a very bad place.)
2) It can be overdosed on very easily thus dangerous
3) It is commonly injected which comes with serious health risks especially with the unknown user.
4) It is a drug taken for recreation and has not already had an established past like alchohol or nicotine.
these are just a few.

I think i also read a thread a while back that most opiates were banned because of global politics but youl have to find that yourself.

Ok, but these problems are a prohibitionism's consequence, not from the drug itself.

I just would like to know what you guys think about H prohibition, assuming you already asked yourself a thousand of times: why the hell is it illegal?

I asked myself this question lots of time, and the only 'plausible answer I can find is that heroin is illegal because this way it yelds a lots, A BIG LOTS, of money.

Reputation Comments on this post:

how is physical dependency a problem of prohibition? h is the most physicaly addicted substance.

[Nahbus]

Wouldn't money be more of a reason to make it legal? Why make it illegal if drug dealers are getting the money when the government can?
People just aren't ready for things like this to be legal, and probably won't be for quite some time. Hell, half the people have a hard time with marijuana becoming legal (if it ever does), and that has great medicinal value, let alone the thousand other uses. Major cash crop as well, but then again it would probably put many major companies out of business, most of which are controlled by the government.

This puts up another million dollar question: Why the hell are cigarette's and alcohol LEGAL? These substances are much more damaging and addicting than many illegal substances out there. People have a hard time accepting change or realizing the truth when they have been lead on to believe things are bad, addictive, make you kill, etc, etc etc...

Reputation Comments on this post:

The best response yet!

[IHrtHalucingens]

Id have to agree with Nahbus on this one. I believe the monetary gain would be much greater for the government through legalization and taxation than the current system of fines, prison labor, and community service.

And i also agree that cigarettes and alcohol should be illegal by the logic of keeping marijuana illegal. But you are right, its like the saying goes, you cant teach an old dog new tricks. Most people refuse to believe that they have been wrong their entire lives about the drug topic and many of them have based alot of their campaignes on the drug war, so becoming enlightened would make them a flip flopper and put their carreers on the line.

Very good post Nahbus!!

[Fantasian]

Originally Posted by Stavrogin

Ok, but these problems are a prohibitionism's consequence, not from the drug itself.

I just would like to know what you guys think about H prohibition, assuming you already asked yourself a thousand of times: why the hell is it illegal?

I asked myself this question lots of time, and the only 'plausible answer I can find is that heroin is illegal because this way it yelds a lots, A BIG LOTS, of money.

That's a differant question...

H is illegal exactly because of the prohibitionism's consequence!

Also i think as others have said, many people arn't ready for it's effects, it all comes down to whether you believe people are responsible enough to deal with things themselves. If heroin was legal many people would end up doing very little apart from getting high on it. Then again on another side note thats what alot of people already do with alchohol particularly here in the uk.

[Stavrogin]

If heroin was legal it would costs very less than now, so it wont be such a great business for the governments.

How can i be sure the governments arent earning something of this big money? I cant.

[rxbandit]

wasnt opium originally illegalized because people feared that chinese immigrants would use it to seduce and rape white women, im pretty sure the fear of the peculiar china man catylzed some of the biast towards opium. i assume heroin is a similiar story or at least in the united states. i saw a program on the history channel that told of how racial biast catylzed alot of the prohabitionists movements.

[IkBenDeMan]

It was actually named "Heroin" after the German word for female hero, much like the english Heroine. German nouns are feminized with the "in" ending, and Heroisch means hero-like. Hero is hero. Also, heroin was named such by Bayer by 1898.... before Hitler. I don't know if I trust any of those other numbers either. If 35% is the national average, SWIMs area must be pulling that down a LOT...

[bcubed]

1898 The Bayer Company introduced heroin as a substitute for morphine.

Originally to treat morphine addiction, if I recall correctly.

[IkBenDeMan]

Originally Posted by bcubed

Originally to treat morphine addiction, if I recall correctly.

quite true, it was marketed as a "non-addictive substitute for morphine"

[schizo_frenic2007]

I went to a lecture at my university held by some south american diplomat about the reasons drugs are illegal. If you think about it, the government get a hell of a lot of money from tobacco and alcohol companies through tax and through donations to political parties which give them a certain amount of power over policy making (for example when malboro donated a lot of money to Labour a couple years back who then 'coincedentally' changed its policy on making tobacco advertising illegal in formula one). Those two industries do not want another drug on a market as it will loose them money - people will be getting stoned instead of going to the pub or taking pills instead of paying a tenner for a pint in a club (grrr, damn those expensive clubs). Legalising drugs will result in a large loss for these industries. Obviously, this is not the only reason they are still illegal. The fascist nazi-supporting Daily Mail are part of it as well (this is not slander - during WW2, the Daily Mail DID support Hitler's regime for a while) as they print articles such as 'My public school son smoked half a spliff and now he sits in his room talkin to pink fairies!'. Anyway, ramble, ramble, ramble.

[Schwag]

Originally Posted by schizo_frenic2007

I went to a lecture at my university held by some south american diplomat about the reasons drugs are illegal. If you think about it, the government get a hell of a lot of money from tobacco and alcohol companies through tax and through donations to political parties which give them a certain amount of power over policy making (for example when malboro donated a lot of money to Labour a couple years back who then 'coincedentally' changed its policy on making tobacco advertising illegal in formula one). Those two industries do not want another drug on a market as it will loose them money - people will be getting stoned instead of going to the pub or taking pills instead of paying a tenner for a pint in a club (grrr, damn those expensive clubs). Legalising drugs will result in a large loss for these industries. Obviously, this is not the only reason they are still illegal. The fascist nazi-supporting Daily Mail are part of it as well (this is not slander - during WW2, the Daily Mail DID support Hitler's regime for a while) as they print articles such as 'My public school son smoked half a spliff and now he sits in his room talkin to pink fairies!'. Anyway, ramble, ramble, ramble.

Swim disagrees, it would be very simple for companies such as Marlboro or Camel to start making weed cigarettes or for them to start making other drugs, if drugs where to become legalised. Infact, they'd probably be making even more money than they do now.

[darawk]

Heroin is probably one of the few drugs that was made illegal for quasi-legitimate reasons. To my knowledge, it was one of the first drugs to be regulated by the U.S. government, even before marijuana. It was banned because of the extreme degree of dependency it creates in those who get addicted to it. It can completely tear people apart who aren't capable of managing its dark side.

That being said, I think the decision to ban it was the wrong one, as I believe all substances should be legal.

[Pinkavvy]

Originally Posted by Stavrogin

Ok, but these problems are a prohibitionism's consequence, not from the drug itself.

One of the problems listed is dependancy. How exactly is physical dependancy caused by prohibition?

[tone3721]

How bout, its illegal because its a DANGEROUS substance? Especially, when its not administered properly. Even when it is administered properly, especially for medicinal purposes, their are many better suited compounds, for an ailment that would need such treatment. Pain treatment has come along way since what the 1870's

[ironmics]

I believe it's illegal because it is taken for the wrong reasons and it is completely unnecessary to the world. It was invented for people with actual pain problems, but then those who think life is too painful started taking it for a completely chemically induced false reality of what happy is. No one I know personally has ever taken heroin, but SWIM has taken many other opiates weak and strong for pain. SWIM got addicted to vicodin, and he was shocked how much a substance could control his life and finally kicked it. He was only taking pain managing doses and never increased passed 15mg. If a substance becomes becomes so powerful to someone that they need it just to be happy then I think it should be a controlled substance.

I'm also upset about the fact that it was ever invented. In fact we do not need any semi or completely synthetic opiate agonists, aside from hydrocodone, oxycodone, methadone, tramadol, and maybe fentanyl(but it has probably caused more suffering than benefits). If the world only had these, morphine, and codiene we would be just fine. However, drug and biotech companies just have to keep outdoing each other inventing one after another of absolutely pointless opioids. I would like to ask the creators of ohmefuntanyl what the hell they were thinking when they made it. Why the hell does the world need something 13,000 time stronger than morphine??

Also why would the government need to make heroin legal to get business. Morphine which is a natural substance and thus a lot easier to obtain could be made legal and I bet all heroin addicts would switch right to it. Making heroin legal instead of morphine would be like making methamphetamine(one of the most disasterous things man has ever synthesized) instead of cocaine.

[Donmeka]

Originally Posted by tone3721

How bout, its illegal because its a DANGEROUS substance?

hahahaha come on, on this site where has that ever sufficed as a good reason for prohibition?

Originally Posted by ironmics

Why the hell does the world need something 13,000 time stronger than morphine??

last time i checked opiates in that kind of strength is used to takedown elephants and other large animals. or hell who knowz i think the chem i saw was 5-10k times stronger

[tone3721]

[QUOTE=Donmeka;235208]hahahaha come on, on this site where has that ever sufficed as a good reason for prohibition?

Who said anything about prohibiton? The point is its a dangerous compund that needs to be controlled in someway. Control doesnt mean all out prohibition. Prohibition causes further problems. It is dangerous to administer heroin to ones self, and medicinally speaking its an inferior compound!!!

[schizo_frenic2007]

Originally Posted by Pinkavvy

One of the problems listed is dependancy. How exactly is physical dependancy caused by prohibition?

Originally Posted by ironmics

Also why would the government need to make heroin legal to get business. Morphine which is a natural substance and thus a lot easier to obtain could be made legal and I bet all heroin addicts would switch right to it.

Obviously prohibition isn't solely responsible for physical dependence of heroin, but because its illegal it means its a lot harder for addicts to be treated. I know someone who works at a clinic and they said that it would be a lot easier to help addicts if heroin was legal, so they could give them small doses of heroin and gradually work down. Instead they have to use morphine which is pretty useless. This sounds crazy and counter-productive, I know, but its the best way to deal with withdrawal symptoms. Also because its illegal, its harder for people to seek help in the first place, as well as other problems (HIV,Potency problems, etc)

I agree with darawk in saying that all substances should be legal.You should have heroin places, where people can shoot up safely with safe needles and safe heroin. They have them in Amstrdam and are thinking of having them in the UK. Noone has ever over-dosed in them sinced they opened, and I think they could also act as a sort of advertisement for why NOT to take heroin.

Originally Posted by tone3721

How bout, its illegal because its a DANGEROUS substance?

I disagree. Apart from its highly addictive properties, heroin is actually a very safe drug, probably one of the safest, if you know what you are doing. It is also fairly easy to OD but only because its illegal. If it were legal and they had those heroin places then you would know your potency and your dose. Think about, you still have all these old rockers from the 60's and 70's who get a steady supply of good heroin and clean needles and are fine. Most of heroin's 'dangerous' properties are a result of prohibition.

Reputation Comments on this post:

good points

[Donmeka]

Originally Posted by tone3721

Who said anything about prohibiton? The point is its a dangerous compund that needs to be controlled in someway. Control doesnt mean all out prohibition. Prohibition causes further problems. It is dangerous to administer heroin to ones self, and medicinally speaking its an inferior compound!!!

pro·hi·bi·tion Pronunciation (pr-bshn)
n.
1. The act of prohibiting or the condition of being prohibited. (controlled)
2. A law, order, or decree that forbids something.

i dont see how illegal and prohibiton arent the one in the same.

[ironmics]

The problem is that most of the dangers come from the fact that it is highly addictive. Unless done under the supervision of a heroin clinic as you were describing, dosage and all safety precautions would be done at home. We all know there are a lot of we'll say dumb people out there who probably would say to themselves if this much gets me high, then clearly twice as much would get me twice as high. I've seen this mentality many, many times in binge drinkers. Also tolerance builds quickly in opiates meaning users will keep using higher and higher doses. If someone has to be using an outrageous dose to acheive their goals, then what would happen if their access was suddenly cut due to job loss or something? Also morphine should work just as well as heroin in a withdrawl situation, since they do the exact same thing except heroin has a more intense rush. SWIM's never felt a heroin rush but has felt a morphine rush and doesn't imagine why someone would need anything more than that.

I would agree with you schizo, if we lived in a perfect world where everyone was intelligent and safe. However, this is not true at all. We legallized alcohol and nicotine and look what they've done. I know opiates will not cause cancer or other problems associated with those substances, but they would produce just as many addicts. Swim likes to imagine he is very safe with his drugs. He has very easy access to opiates due to chronic pain, but if he could pick them up at 7-11 he can't even imagine what he would be like.

[tone3721]

I disagree. Apart from its highly addictive properties, heroin is actually a very safe drug, probably one of the safest, if you know what you are doing. It is also fairly easy to OD but only because its illegal. If it were legal and they had those heroin places then you would know your potency and your dose. Think about, you still have all these old rockers from the 60's and 70's who get a steady supply of good heroin and clean needles and are fine. Most of heroin's 'dangerous' properties are a result of prohibition.[/QUOTE]

Apart from its highly addictive properties???????? Heroin will never be apart from its highly addictive properties.....but if it makes swiy sleep better at night, and enables swiy to justify it to themselves...whatever! Plutonium, can be handled right too, swit guesses next swiy will be justifying why their is a need to study nuclear chemistry at home. Heroin is a dangerous, inferior compound, the only purpose it serves is getting junkies high!!! Physical LONG TERM effects of heroin are pretty benign yes, aside from looking like leather face after years of abuse, assuming of course a hot dose or the withdrawals dont kill you. Rockstars? lol lol lol you mean like Keith Richards???? Yeah if only everyone could be so rich as to get blood transfusions regularly to keep alive, to keep doing more dope......what a privilege!!! HEH What about the countless other stars that are 6 feet under now???? Heroin was killing people way before it became prohibited!


prohibition |ˌprō(h)əˈbi sh ən| noun 1 the action of forbidding something, esp. by law : they argue that prohibition of drugs will always fail. • a law or regulation forbidding something : those who favor prohibitions on insider trading. 2 ( Prohibition) the prevention by law of the manufacture and sale of alcohol, esp. in the U.S. between 1920 and 1933. DERIVATIVES prohibitionary |-ˌnerē| adjective Prohibitionist |-nist| noun ORIGIN late Middle English : from Old French, from Latin prohibitio(n-), from prohibere ‘keep in check’ (see prohibit ).

Thesaurus
prohibition noun 1 the prohibition of marijuana banning, forbidding, prohibiting, barring, debarment, vetoing, proscription, interdiction, outlawing. 2 a prohibition was imposed ban, bar, interdict, veto, embargo, injunction, moratorium.

Donmeka: not sure where you got swiy definition from, sounds like your own doctored up rendition! Prohibiton is an all out ban! Your proniciation key isnt even accurate! Some substances should obviously be monitored, or controlled in some way. Treatment is the answer, not an all out heroin free for all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Give me a fuckin break, this shit is self evident!!! Yes, treatment is a form of control, and no its not all out prohibition!!!!!!!!!!!!