Using an anti-depressant for after the roll

[Unsolved]

SWIM has heard of doing this before but doesn't know much about it other then that. Searched around a little on the net for him. He was wondering how many days after the roll should one be taking the anti-depressant up to ex 1 day after, 2 days after? What dossage of an anti-depressant should be taken low, moderate, high??

Reputation Comments on this post:

[IHrtHalucingens]

Although more frequently seen with MAOI's, it was my understanding that anti-depressants and ecstacy can also cause seritonin syndrom. So although im not a doctor, i would say 1-3 days after the E, since thats how long it normally lasts in your body. Then id go with a moderate or low dose for a day or two just to be safe you never know exactly how long your body takes to eliminate the E. Better safe than sorry as i see it.

[Abrad]

SWIM has heard people claim that SSRIs are usefull for the comedown He is very skeptical though and would think it may cause more harm than good. SWIY should probably just get som 5-htp.

[metatriptical]

SWIM takes 100 mgs of 5-htp shortly after an MDMA or MDA comedown and that seems to work. A day or two later, if needed, SWIM finds that a Trazadone is also helpful. That is an SSRI that is generally prescribed to treat depression, insomnia and/or cocaine withdrawl. Be sure to have a good 10 or more hours to sleep when taking a Trazadone, as it tends to knock SWIM out for that much time.

[Mr. J]

Antidepressants and MDMA are a potentially lethal combination. Not just MOAIs, all antidepressants.

Ecstasy is a very potent agonist of the brain chemical, seretonin (one of the monoamines are the "MO" in MOAI). Seretonin is the brain neurotransmitter boosted by antidepressants. Combining ecstasy and antidepressant drugs can cause "Seretonin Syndrome". It not only can happen, it has and does happen!

So, like abrad84 said, SWIY should just get some 5-htp..

[blue_eyes]

SWIM agrees with Mr J

SWIM takes 5-HTP daily to prevent depression. She has a history of bad reactions to several types of mainstream antidepressants. Through research, SWIM discovered 5-HTP and has been taking a regular, low dose for about 6 months now.

SWIM finds 5-HTP essential in a quick recovery from taking e, but, it has to be noted that even 5-HTP can be dangerous if taken before a roll. Just as other antidepressants can cause serotonin syndrome when taken with MDMA, so can 5-HTP.

5-HTP is a pre-cursor to serotonin, which assists in the creation/availability of serotnin in the brain. Therefore, it's important to only take 5-HTP at the end of a roll, and not if you intend on rolling again that day/night.

SWIM actually takes a number of suppliments as a pre-load and post-load when taking e. SWIM is a single mum, and can't be a waste of space for several days after a weekend of indulging. Life goes on at a never-ending pase when you have kids. That's why SWIM is very interested in harm minimisation.

SWIM recommends the following:

90 minutes prior to roll:
1000 mg vitamin c
250 IU vitamin e
750 mg magnesium
200 mg alpha lipoic acid


6 hours after a roll:
1000 mg vitamin c
250 IU vitamin e
750 mg magnesium (if jaw is clenched and/or teeth grinding at all)
200 mg alpha lipoic acid
100 mg 5-HTP


SWIM also keeps up a higher dose of her regular 5-HTP for about 3-5 days after (300mg daily), so for a person not taking this suppliment regularly, take about 100 mg daily for 3-5 days after a roll, if you have a tendency to be down and out when you come down.


I hope this helps. The advice I would like to give most is this: listen to your body, it reacts in certain ways to try and rectify an inbalance in some way shape of form. If there are ways to reduce the severity or incidence of different side effects, then you pay it to your body to do it. Its the only way that you can minimise the negative aspects of taking drugs, which in turn makes the positive effects of taking drugs even more positive and enjoyable. And who doesn't want that?????????

Reputation Comments on this post:

plenty of info

[Unsolved]

hmm.... very intesteresting. Thanks guys, I apreciate the quick responses and info.

[sterling77]

There's some short window of time where the antidepressants should be able to prevent neurotoxicity, something like within 12 hours after the roll. The most popular dose is around 20mg of Prozac. There do seem to be some dangers involved, but there are people doing it without many problems that SWIM has heard of. However, SWIM would definetly not mix 5-htp and prozac.

The general concensus on another board is that 5-htp is a better alternative because there was another study which disproved that Prozac was beneficial.

[Abrad]

How could prozac do anything? It takes weeks of daily dosing before it has an effect.

Reputation Comments on this post:

[Unsolved]

I believe all anti-depressats have some initial effect on the brain and it's chemicals from day one. It takes weeks for the full effect of these medications however to work fully. But some changes are made in the brain even after the first day of taking an anti-depressant.

[Gareth]

The leading serotonin theory on MDMA is that dopamine is allowed into the depleted serotonin axon. This dopamine oxadises and damages this axon.

SSRI's completely prevents this damage (based on injection tests on lab rats) by blocking the reuptake of both serotonin (which would be broken down anyway) and dopamine. This must be done within 8 hours of INGESTION.

Maximum effectiveness is achieved at the moment of ingestion, and only about 10% effectiveness (that is the damage control) is achieved at 7 hours. None after 8 hours.

It should also, in theory, prevent most of the negative aspects of a 'come down'.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Very good info.

[FrankenChrist]

Originally Posted by Gareth

The leading serotonin theory on MDMA is that dopamine is allowed into the depleted serotonin axon. This dopamine oxadises and damages this axon.

SSRI's completely prevents this damage (based on injection tests on lab rats) by blocking the reuptake of both serotonin (which would be broken down anyway) and dopamine. This must be done within 8 hours of INGESTION.

Maximum effectiveness is achieved at the moment of ingestion, and only about 10% effectiveness (that is the damage control) is achieved at 7 hours. None after 8 hours.

It should also, in theory, prevent most of the negative aspects of a 'come down'.

Where did you get this information?

Originally Posted by Unsolved

I believe all anti-depressats have some initial effect on the brain and it's chemicals from day one. It takes weeks for the full effect of these medications however to work fully. But some changes are made in the brain even after the first day of taking an anti-depressant.

You are right. When you take one for the first time, you will definitely know. Swim has tried antidepressants after mdma and analogues, and he has had this experience with both an SSRI (paroxetine) and an SNRI (sp?) (Effexor). The Effexor in particular made swim very talkative within a couple of hours. This is almost like one of the first stages of being drunk.

[N0ly]

Is it normal to not have a hard comedown? SWIM never really gets deppressed after an ex trip. He feels fine hours after its over. Could it just be that he is used to being deppressed and that is whats normal to him? Hes just sad that the pill is finished. but after a few minutes hes happy again.