Opinions - Stupid people and Research Chemicals

[grandbaby]

Originally Posted by napoleon in rags

Kids like this shouldn't be regarded as morons either, they're just kids and kids make mistakes. Misinformation is the key. They may have heard from 5 or 6 of their personal friends that it's a greak high, or whatever. Most of the time they have no idea what they're injesting, or they've been told that it's something else (LSD, ect)

Naw, this particular kid likes to think of himself as a hardhead - recommends gigantic doses of chems to first-timers, etc. Will not listen to anyone else regarding anything. He is a true and unadulterated specimen of the species Homo moronus.


The only consolation is that he won't likely be around for very long...

[illuminati boy]

Apparently the little trip report about a massive 2C-E / MDMA combo made Erowid. It can be found here: http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=52338

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[fatal]

Originally Posted by illuminati boy

Apparently the little trip report about a massive 2C-E / MDMA combo made Erowid. It can be found here: http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=52338

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no surprise there. erowid has accounts of other activities including 500 mg doses of aMT and 100 mg nasal 2C-I doses...

[treefingers49]

Speaking as a person who was very recently a kid, I believe they can be labeled morons. As a kid, SWIM was still responsible and researched psychedelics to death, reading every trip report he could get his hands on. SWIM even made the decision to abstain from psychedelics until he achieved a better understanding of the world. Research and knowledge is essential especially when dealing with these powerful and little known substances, regardless of age.

[Sick Jack]

@treefingers49

Well said !

I personally refused to give any sources even to people 10 years older than me, because RC must not be a substitute to television or playing football. It disserves a lot of commitment, in order to avoid been part of the drug-related deaths statistics....

[Abrad]

Here is another post from the same site, unless SWIM is mistaken this is a HUGELY irresponsible thing to do and is a dangerous thing to have posted on a forum frequented by 14-16 year olds. Isn't this the kind of thing that got AMT and 5-MeO-DiPT scheduled?

Been awhile. Haven't been sitting on my ass while I've been gone, though; here's my latest report:

Both compounds are believed to be relatively pure, and are consumed on an empty stomach. Supervision was neither obtained, nor believed to be necessary (at the time). Experience is after a 6+ month abstinence from both compounds.

T+0: Ingested 100 mg MDMA.
T+1.5: First effects of initial MDMA dose are felt.
T+3: The MDMA is really starting to take effect; waves of warmth begin rushing over me. Usual emotional bonding is triggered; another 200 mg of MDMA is ingested.
T+5: The effects of the initial MDMA dose are beginning to subside, so I ingest another 200 mg of MDMA. CEV's are apparent.
T+6: Deciding that the night was still very young, I weigh out and ingest 100 mg of 2-CE; figuring that I'd spent a very fair amount of serotonin with the MDMA, I am not afraid of the unusually high dose.
T+7: Entactogenic qualities of MDMA are still very apparent. However, the 2-CE has yet to make an appearance (which is quite abnormal, taking into consideration the usual come-up, for me, is short of 45 minutes). I reason that I'm merely burnt-out, and decide to ingest another 100 mg of 2-CE.
T+7.5: Almost immediately after ingestion of the second dose, effects of the initial 2-CE dose are apparent. The psychological effects of the last MDMA dose are still going surprisingly strong.
T+10: The 2-CE is now overwhelming the MDMA. The usual visual effects (liquid, colored tracers, etc.) of the 2-CE are noticed; I am at Level 3 / ++.
T+11: I am immediately rocketed into Level 5 / ++++. The outside world crumbles beneath massive waves of patterning; coiling around me, in unison with the most bizarre psychological behavior I've ever experienced. One moment I'd known I'd lost it, and was never coming back...then I'd realised it was merely an illusion, and back.
I was stuck in this loop, playing these convoluted mindgames, for nearly 4 hours, as I randomly stumbled through my house. At some point I found myself lost in my bedroom (with no greater than 10 sq. ft. of walking space), unable to grope for a seat or a light in fear that I might knock something over. I stood there for an hour or so, nearly crying because I never thought I would find my way out. I finally crawled to my dresser and found the lightswitch.
T+15: After finally making my way to the garage and enjoying my last cigarette, I decided to lay in bed and watch TV. I began picking up on social cues that were either very well-hidden, or not really there. At some point I fell into a hole...or, more favorably, was "sucked out" of a hole. Everything was black, except for the glossy sheen of some strange bubble that I now surrounded. I began feeling painful sparks of electricity shooting all around me, accompanied by a strange WHOOPH sound. I now understood the concept of viscoelastic mass, and was able to transport to strange dimensions (via rapid suction, of some sort), where I was confronted by these entities made of foam. They explained to me, using imagery, the concept of deep dissociation and interpsychological travel.
T+20: I came to in bed, exhausted, but still unable to sleep. I was back at Level 4 / +++. Patterning still coiled over nearly every inch of the room, and I find that I am completely unable to walk straight.
T+24: I go outside and light up a cuban cigar. The sun is warm on my skin. The sky was rippling like an ocean tide, as the trees and surrounding vegetation danced and breathed. I'd occasionally notice a butterfly, to the very outterskirts of my vision, as it would tumble about in the air, leaving a wake of yellow and red fractals behind it. I felt very in-touch with the universe at the moment, and very content, save the occasional welling of tears in my eyes at the memory of the impact of last night's experience.
T+28: Even though I'm fiending horridly for a cigarette, I dare not make a trip to the store, as I STILL stumble around, much like a hopeless drunk on St. Patrick's Day. Visual distortions, especially when looking in the mirror (my head looked like it was made of wet clay), were still very comical at this point.
T+36: Finally back at baseline. I feel restless, and am extremely emotional. I was quite relieved to find that not only had I managed to not kill myself the night before, but also noted that I felt neither any nausea, nor vascular dysfunction, through the entirety of the experience. Sleep that night is impossible.

I would definitely ingest a similar amount of 2-CE again, in fact, looking back at my mere 60 mg doses, am actually beginning to believe that the compound really only becomes active at 40-50 mg doses. The above experience seriously rivaled, if not conquered, my past experiences with 500+ ug doses of LSD.

I will most definitely be experimenting with a similar dose of 2-CE again, however, excluding MDMA from the mix in order the compact the experience into ~24 hours. I will also make sure to have a sitter on-hand; while from what I can gather the peak of the 2-CE lasted approximately 8 hours at Level 5 / ++++, I cannot honestly say I was in any condition to be alone. That sect in time was spent in what I can only describe as a total failure at the neural/motor barrier, completely lacking any sort of judgement and being a seriously fatal threat to myself and others.

[Nagognog2]

How stupid and irresponsible can anyone get!? This is no different that telling kids that rat-poison is a great high. Just ignore the warnings on the can and chow down, doods! The poster of this should be shot.

[Toltec]

OMG this can't be true! if it is, it should have been remove for harm reduction reasons.

He should be shot, but first skinned alive and dipped in vinegar!
Cheese & Rice

[Abrad]

If you know what forum it is go and have a look. Something that SWIM found equally disturbing is that most of them don't seem to realise how outlandishly dangerous it was. After making a post warning of the dangers of taking such a dose SWIM was told "It's OK, he's a hardhead".

[DJ-666]

people who are taking this stuff without knowing any doses (SWIMs is 3mg) are really too stupid to live on this planet. In swims experience every vendor is labeling the zipbag which contains the stuff...so, everyone who is able to bux this stuff online - 2C-I or DOI - should also be able to do some resaerch on the net, otherwise...DIE!

[glogga]

The stupidity factor is everywhere. It affects every facet of our society, not just research chemicals. I mean just turn on the media and look at the bullshit people buy into. Or look at the way people drive their cars. Its no surprise at all, really, that people do stupid things with white powders.

[Nagognog2]

Probably written by a kid in Utah whose daddy is an FBI agent. Brat is trying to earn a Merit-Badge from his Boy Scout troop in Disinformation.

[Nagognog2]

Such is what separates this forum from Erowid. When some jack-ass wanders in here to tell us the wonders of taking a potentally fatal (pun slightly implied) overdose - we don't let it remain up for long.

I wish Erowid would understand that posting that sort of crap can serve to encourage the uninformed to follow suit. Maybe Erowid has faith that no one out there is so stupid as to gobble 100mg of 2-CE - so it's okay to let a dangerously stupid idea to stand on their boards. Unfortunately time and experience proves that many people are stupid - and what they hear and read is believed without question (Bush is the American President - I rest my case). Such is why I have grown increasingly disappointed with Erowid.

I used to enjoy reading the reports on that site. But nowadays it takes so much time to sift through the garbage that I cringe before I enter same. If Erowid is out there and listening: Please weed your garden. Come on! You might save a life or two.

Some might howl that doing this would be censorship. I will not argue semantics when lives are at stake. Yes - it is censorship. It is also known as Common Sense.

[Silence_Inc]

yes Nag, i'm totally with you... cause this next sentence from his report ...

"I would definitely ingest a similar amount of 2-CE again, in fact, looking back at my mere 60 mg doses, am actually beginning to believe that the compound really only becomes active at 40-50 mg doses. "

is a totally irrisponsible assumption that would give other people a reason to test their limits - and maybe fail of getting back.

cause their is always someone who might be intriged by the idea - but doesn't want to waste alot of money for building up to the same dose over several sessions and just - goes ahead with doin a similar dose.

with these reports is censorship indeed common sense. as protection. maybe they should be stored in some - moments of the extreme database.

also i find it very sad to see that he didn't even warn others in his report or give them an URL to some site where the normal dose ranges are seen - wich is the least you can do when writing this heroic report.

[Abrad]

Maybe he will establish an approximate toxic dose for us and rid us of his stupidity in one fell swoop. Seems to me that he is mainly just trying to show off in front of the kids over there though. I am a little surprised at erowid putting that report up though, especially since it can take months or even years for most reports to be posted there.

[enquirewithin]

It does sound like a there's a strong element of BS!

And what on earth is a Plus 5? Hey, I had a Plus 7 yesterday!

[illuminati boy]

I am mixed about whether Erowid should post TRs like the above. On the one hand, they will post TRs for say gasoline and other stupid mistakes just so that the data points are out there. On the other hand, this is clearly reckless behavior and the individual may have only been spared due to the staggered nature of the dosing rather than having taken all or most of the compounds initially. I personally feel a little more comfortable with reports like this showing up in a forum so that way people can (usually) voice their concerns about the frank stupidity of such an endeavor. Unfortunately some boards are little more than 15 y/o kids going “Hells ya that sounds cool… now where can I get me some of that what did you call it 2 C something?”

Who knows, maybe the individual in question will try taking 200 mg. of 2C-E again and the universe will teach them a rather pointed lesson about safety and/or humility.

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PS enquirewithin I think the “Level 5” they were referring to was on THIS scale. It is a scale that has been around a while and seems to do a decent job of describing the effects of LSD & Mushrooms… not sure of its utility beyond that.

[blue jammer]

2 x 100mg of 2-ce in such a short time, after 500mg of MDMA

Smells of bullshit, especially when he says "Deciding that the night was still very young, I weigh out and ingest 100 mg of 2-CE" - after doing 1/2 gram of MDMA, I very much doubt he'd be able to see clearly enough to weigh himself on large scales, never mind 2-ce.

I first read this report through and thought 2 x 10mg of 2-ce, which is more believable, until I read he claims to have done 60mg of 2-ce before.

Are we expected to believe after doing all that, he was able to write such a lengthy report?

What an eijit.

[enquirewithin]

PS enquirewithin I think the “Level 5” they were referring to was on THIS scale. It is a scale that has been around a while and seems to do a decent job of describing the effects of LSD & Mushrooms… not sure of its utility beyond that.

Thanks-- it's that scale-- I thought he meant the Shulgin scale!

Who knows, maybe the individual in question will try taking 200 mg. of 2C-E again and the universe will teach them a rather pointed lesson about safety and/or humility.

His ego loss could well be permanent!

[Nagognog2]

Good.

I know of one "case" who took an unusually large amount of LSD25. When his parents found him, he was standing in a bucket of wet cement - naked - in the basement of his parent's house. He had splashed pain all over himself and was trying to glue shingles on to his body. His parents asked him what the F%!%!! he thought he was doing. He told them that he was a house. His parents had him taken away to the laughing academy.

One can only hope a similar fate befalls this idiot.

[nanobrain]

when can you sit on a porcupine w/a bare nekkid ass?

well, either when the porcupine is shaved, or when its not your ass, or when the Party tells you, Comrade.

or so the Russian joke goes. which this aint. but the human organism has an amazing capacity for adapting to even the most powerful of toxins, tolerant being the way it was designed.

outliers will be outliers, their significance or lack thereof should not by any means be transitioned to a state of memes among the populi.

as Shulgie said, the proof of the pudding, proof being the testing model...

[GDxCAT]

although i dont agree with this reckless behaviour i think its necessary that these reports appear on erowid just so the info is out there for the rest of us.

[raven3davis]

Would these reports really be taken down from here if they were posted? SWIM does not see why this should be the case. There are plenty of people here who have calimed to do pretty stupid shit and their posts are not taken down.

SWIM agrees that these posts, although wreckless and stupid, should be kept up to set some kind of limits. There is so little known data on the toxicity level of these chemicals so at least we are getting somewhere.

[Abrad]

TBH his subsequent posts are probably more dangerous than the TR itself.

"I would definitely ingest a similar amount of 2-CE again, in fact, looking back at my mere 60 mg doses, am actually beginning to believe that the compound really only becomes active at 40-50 mg doses. "

when compared to the present data of such high-end psychedelics, could only present the conclusion that, indeed, 2-CE is only truely "active" at doses of 50+ mg, with a standard recreational dose of 100-200 mg.

I will never eat less than 200 mg of 2-CE again.

It is becoming quite clear IMO that he is mainly trying to show off to the kids over there, which (again IMO) is hugely irresponsible.

[grandbaby]

Quote:
when compared to the present data of such high-end psychedelics, could only present the conclusion that, indeed, 2-CE is only truely "active" at doses of 50+ mg, with a standard recreational dose of 100-200 mg.

is it possible he's got a very crappy batch of 2C-E, that it's degraded or been cut ... or he doesn't know how to use a scale.... or....??

It is entirely possible he's not malicious.

But the report is harmful all the same.