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  #1  
Old 20-10-2011, 16:21
concernedhubby concernedhubby is offline
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Can temazepam really knock someone out?

This happened to someone NOT ME...
My friend's wife went out of town for work. She had just filled a prescription for Temazepam (insomnia) but didnt want to take them unless her husband was there. She has NEVER taken benzo's before and has nO history of drug abuse or addiction.

She was staying at a rented house on a job site, with 4 other co-workers.

She had a few glasses of wine at dinner and doesnt remember anything afterwards. She woke up naked and insists she had had sex. Sure enough, she checked her stuff and realized 4 15mg temazepam tablets were missing...her 4 co-workers all had access to her room/duffel bag...

She thinks its the young I.T. guy but cant prove anything

I think she is lying, she cheated, and made excuses...can 60mg of temazepam and 3 glasses of wine knock someone out and delete their memory??

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  #2  
Old 20-10-2011, 18:33
Potter Potter is offline
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Re: Can Temmies really knock someone out?

Yes it very well could have. That's a lot of booze to be mixing with an insomnia drug. A rather foolish situation to have put her self in.

Any of her co-workers admit to having sex with her?

Such a person is going to be visibly intoxicated, the other party must have known she was not in the right state of mind.

Or she's was drunk and horny and had regrets in the morning.

If it WAS rape, then she should have gone to the cops.

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If it was rape(which it could be) they definitely need to call the cops.
  #3  
Old 20-10-2011, 19:24
Benzeneringz Benzeneringz is offline
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Re: Can Temmies really knock someone out?

The short answer is YES. The long answer involves the pharmacological profile of temazepam and the synergistic effects of the drug and ethanol consumption.

Temazepam is a 3-hydroxy benzodiazepine with an intermediate duration of action. It's a minor metabolite of diazepam (Valium), occurring through hydroxylation and the -3 position. The addition of a hydroxyl group at the -3 position changes the pharmacology rather significantly. Potency is approximately cut in half (benzo.org.uk), making 20 milligrams of temazepam equivalent to 10 milligrams of diazepam. This decrease in potency might lead one to believe that temazepam is half as "powerful", or is "weaker" than other, more potent benzodiazepines. This isn't the case though. A study was done that compared the general degree of intoxication experienced after administration of either triazolam (Halcion) or temazepam at two different doses. The goal of the experiment was to test the theory that triazolam produces more behavorial and mental impairments than temazepam, as triazolam is one of the most potent benzodiazepines in existance. The experiment began with two doses of triazolam, .25 milligrams and .5 milligrams and two doses of temazepam, 15 milligrams and 30 milligrams. Those who had taken the triazolam exhibited a higher degree of mental impairment and behavioral disruptions that those who had taken either dose of temazepam. However, the triazolam group reported high levels of sleepiness and general intoxication compared to the response seen in the temazepam group. Speculating that the doses of triazolam and temazepam weren't clinically equivalent. They repeated the experiment using the same dose of triazolam (.5 milligrams) with a higher dose of temazepam (60 milligrams). Both groups reported strong feelings of intoxication and sleepiness, but TEMAZEPAM produced SIGNIFICANTLY more behavioral disruptions than triazolam. The surprising conclusion suggested that temazepam produces greater impairments in behavior and is more disruptive than an equivalent dose of triazolam.(1) So what's the point? The study illustrates the formidable strength of temazepam even though it's only half as potent as diazepam.

Temazepam is a powerful sedative, but it's also a powerful amnesiac. Dosages above 30 milligrams (and even a dose of 30 milligrams in some individuals) can often lead to a condition known as anterograde amnesia. Anterograde amnesia is a form of amnesia that prevents the formation of memories in the short term as the brain cannot commit anything for later recall. It's what happens when a person "blacks out". Temazepam has a propensity to cause such a condition because of it's affinity for a specific binding site in the brain. I won't go too much into it; there's already a thread that does that. All you need to know is that there are 5 different receptors that cater to the benzodiazepines. One of these receptors, known as alpha-1, causes sedation and is responsible for any amnesic activity. Temazepam happens to have a strong affinity for the alpha-1 receptor.

Your friend had the deck stacked against her: she was benzo naive, and she was drinking. She most likely took one or two of the tablets, forgot about taking them, and took a couple more. So what's the moral of the story? That temazepam is a very powerful benzodiazepine, you shouldn't mix alcohol with temazepam (or any other benzo for that matter), and if you're benzo naive you should start with the smallest dose and work your way up. Hope that helps.

(1) A comparison of the acute behavioral effects of triazolam and temazepam in normal volunteers, 1993

Last edited by Benzeneringz; 20-10-2011 at 19:28. Reason: wanted to add the title of the study cited
  #4  
Old 20-10-2011, 19:25
sveedish sveedish is offline
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Re: Can Temmies really knock someone out?

Yea, temazepam is a benzodiazepine, buts more of a sedative type of benzodiazepine than say klonopin or xanax. Mixing that amount with booze is very likely to cause temporary amnesia, especially in someone with no history of taking the drug, or mixing the two.

It sounds like the real question is, was she raped or is she cheating? There's not enough data for a good answer, but I'll try my best.

It's possible she blacked out from drinking alone, ...you would know her drinking habits and how she is more than random people on here. If she has no history of drug abuse, I can't see her eating a bunch of tempazepam after getting a little tipsy. That sounds like something a seasoned abuser (likely yours truly!) would do. It sounds like she is implying that that someone had already stolen the pills from her before she started drinking, crushed them to a powder and then mixed that into her wine. Or, maybe her coworkers had already decided to take advantage of her, and had some other type of substance to drug her with...then AFTER they raped her, when she was blacked out, or fell asleep, they went through her purse and stole 4 tempazepams out of prescription that had never been touched. Many rapists make their decision by impulse and are typically pretty stupid, but this is would just be unfathomably stupid:
A. To rape an employee (not trying to say acquaintence rape doesn't happen)
B. Drug her with her own drugs that were prescribed by a doctor and that she's never taken before. Or drug her with some other drugs, and then stole drugs from her (really boring drugs in my opinion, not worth stealing).
C. After raping her, they left her alone naked. No, a smart rapist would have made her put some clothes back on so that when she woke up she wouldn't think, - "huh, why am I naked." - then her employees are the only ones in the house, etc. stupid.
***Although I'm not saying that's not how it happened, rape is rarely carried out logically. I definitely wouldn't want to blame a victim, and I don't know those employees, and I don't know your wife or how in love you two are with each other, or if there has been any history of cheating from either of you, etc. So i can't jump to any conclusions, maybe your suspicion is a sign of insecurity and really you should be supportive of your wife right now, or maybe your suspicion is justified and something like this was just bound to happen sooner or later.

Reacting with anger was probably not the best initial reaction, but is totally understandable. The best thing to do is to be supportive of your wife for right now, and ask her to tell you as much as she can...I would say this is a pretty serious issue, and if she's trying to minimalize it, that might be a red flag. If there's tons of contradictions - red flag. Also talk to her employees, if that wouldn't be too wierd. If she was that drugged up, its likely that at least one of them saw something suspicious, or swaggering, or slurring her words. Or maybe nobody else knew she had been drugged, but they saw her go in the room of some other employee and shut the door. I'm just saying that if something bad happened that night, its probable that at least one other person knows something. It'd be best not to immediately ask them what happened that night, that way you can get a good read on them without them being too suspicious. Figure out what they are like first for a base reading, then see if they're heavy drinkers, pill poppers, mention sex in passing like a normal "bro" would and just see how the topic of "sex" makes them react. Talk about your wife.

Does it make them uncomfortable? Do they look scared, or guilty, or secretive, or like they want to get the fuck out of the room immediately? You can't give what you suspect away and you definitely can't act crazy because even if they were innocent your behavior could actually make them fearful and then you could misinterpret that fear as being caused by their guiltiness. Its difficult to interrogate somebody, probably best left to detectives from grainy film noirs and such.

Last edited by sveedish; 20-10-2011 at 19:54.
  #5  
Old 21-10-2011, 18:30
concernedhubby concernedhubby is offline
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Re: Can Temmies really knock someone out?

She does not want to go to the police or tell her employer. At this point, there would be NO dna evidence...it would be his word against hers,,.

There is only ONE possible rapist as the other three she is positive would not have done it...

She is POSITIVE she did not take any pills...the only reason she had them was she filled the prescription on the way to the airport...then decided she didnt want to take seditives unless her husband was there...so she KNEW exactly how many pills she had...4 were missing...she is a benzo virgin, but she has had 3-4 glasses of wine in the past many many times...it does NOT intoxicate her...

Apparantly she jokingly mentioned to the "potential rapist" that she drank too much and doesnt remember anything about that night, he replied that he was also drunk and remembers nothing...she said he didnt seem nervous when talking...

She took 30mg of temazepam last night before bed and it knocked her out...she woke up in the middle of the night, memory was blurry but there...must have been the alcohol/sedative mix
  #6  
Old 21-10-2011, 19:04
C.D.rose C.D.rose is offline
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Re: Can Temmies really knock someone out?

Quote:
Originally Posted by concernedhubby View Post
There is only ONE possible rapist as the other three she is positive would not have done it...
Now that sounds like convincing evidence as to who could have done what ...

There were a couple of questions that went through my mind when I read this yesterday: the first one was why she had benzos with her if she didn't want to take them. That one is explained now because, as you said, she got them on her way to the airport. (Still though, one of the last things I would do when I had to catch a flight would be to pick up medication that I wouldn't need on the trip, but ok, I guess stuff like that happens.)

Next would be: did her co-workers know she had temazepam with her? If not, the hypothesis of rape becomes extremely sketchy. Her co-workers would have had to go through her luggage before they all sat down for dinner, thus before she was even mildly intoxicated from wine. Why would they do that? If they did do that, they would have had to find the temazepam and then spontaneously decide to drug and rape her. The thing is, if they (or anyone of them) had sufficient criminal energy to decide to drug and then rape her, why didn't they bring the substance with them themselves? Temazepam is not a drug commonly used for drug rapes, so the person in question would have to be at least somewhat knowledgeable about dosage and so on.

I think the hypothesis that she was drugged with her own temazepam and then raped is extremely unlikely. That doesn't mean it can't have happened, but it's not very likely. More likely is something like this: they all had a few glasses of wine, she became talkative and said that she went to the pharmacy on her way to the airport to pick up those "sleep aids", one of the guys asked her what kind of sleep aid it was, and convinced her that they each take two because "benzos are fun" or something along those lines. Then, she and someone else had sex. Temazepam is not the first drug that would come to mind that can make you do crazy stuff and forget about it, but it's certainly not impossible.

However, I don't think that she was cheating and only made that story up. Why make up any story whatsoever if she could have just not said anything? But the idea of drug rape really seems quite unlikely, given the information here in this thread. I'm not saying this lightly, I find sexual violence truly horrible and disgusting, and I would certainly not want to be the guy who tells a victim that she wasn't raped, but I think that the facts don't really support her allegations.

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Astute observations about the stated series of events that don't quite fit.
A very logical (and probable) alternative to the original assumption.
  #7  
Old 12-11-2011, 16:16
concernedhubby concernedhubby is offline
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Re: Can temazepam really knock someone out?

Update:
She talked it over with her co-workers...there were 4 coworkers present...3 women and the IT guy...the women INSIST the it guy was with them the entire day and couldnt possibly have snuck into her room and gotten her pills...why would they lie or cover it up

He admits to having sex with her, he knew she was drunk, but so was he...he had no idea she had sleeping pills let alone spiking her drink with them...

She now believes she might have taken a couple, forgot she took them, and took 2 more...

is it possible she had 3 glasses of wine, (was not even buzzed)...took 2 15mg pills...and forgot? Would the drug make what she did BEFORE taking it hazy or hard to remember...

The it guy claims they all were drinking, she went to bed...he was laying on the couch watching tv when she came back out to get something to drink...she sat down, he knew she was drunk and he hit on her...she was willing and off to her room they went...they had protected sex (he wore a rubber) and he realized she was passed out, he stopped and left the room...

At this point I dont know what is true and what is bull shit...I also believe SHE doesnt really know either...regardless of what happened, i dont think she was aware or willing...she believes he didnt spike her wine so she doesnt want to press charges...he quit...

her husband hasnt decided what to do...being drunk is no excuse for cheating...
  #8  
Old 12-11-2011, 18:01
Tigey Tigey is offline
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Re: Can temazepam really knock someone out?

Hi Hubby,

I've got to chip in here with my own experience - it'd be unfair on you not to. I had 1 beer once, which I didn't finish, and unthinkingly dosed 2x10mg temazepam tablets (temtabs over here). Within 5 minutes I was passed out in bed, but I didn't remember anything. I woke my wife up at 4am and made love to her, apparently unusually horny and dominant. I still remember nothing of that, and didn't know what she was on about in the morning. I've never told her because I didn't want to totally freak her out, as to this day I'm worried she might find it as upsetting as I do The thought still sickens me. It could've been anyone in the bed, and I'm fairly sure I would've done the same. That's despite me being a committed Christian, and the thought of even making love while under the influence of anything makes me sick to the stomach - I've got tears in my eyes typing this, and the last time I cried was when I buried my premature son last year.

Whether she's a heavy drinker or a light drinker, it sounds like she essentially date-raped herself. I know that's a blunt and horrible thing to say, but 4 'stronger version' benzo tablets are a whole heap for someone who's not built up a big tolerance over time. If you take 10mg valium and haven't had it before, you'll likely be asleep in 10 minutes and not know what you said or if you did anything until you wake up the next day. She should never have taken 2, never mind 4, and because it's a hypnotic agent, it can really screw you up when combined with alcohol. If she'd not taken benzos and had just got drunk and had sex, very different. Assuming she's telling the truth (and if he co-workers found her dopey and spacey in the morning, she probably is - everything sounds consistent), I'd hope that hubby can forgive her, as distasteful and upsetting as he finds the situation, for both their sakes. This isn't a normal way to cover up an illicit sexual encounter, she sounds shaken, nervous and scared of what she doesn't remember, and the IT guy's story is consistent with her vaguest memory of the encounter as far as she trusts herself (and would justify what happened, if justify is the right word).

If she loves him and he loves her, they'll both be hurting and terrified right now - this is a time for support rather than recriminations assuming we give her the benefit of the doubt.

In relation to your last questions:

Quote:
Would the drug make what she did BEFORE taking it hazy or hard to remember...
Yes. Short term memory loss is very common when taking more than tolerance. Think of a wave effect starting when body metabolises enough but going in both directions. Alcohol would've potentiated onset, massively lowered inhibitions and impaired judgement.

Quote:
he realized she was passed out, he stopped and left the room...
That the guy came onto a drunk, married co-worker is imo reprehensible but hardly illegal. If she took the drugs, as she thinks she did, and passed out, he'd have no reason to lie....the sex was to all intents and purposes consensual and if he did stop when he realised she was no longer in a position to give consent, I think that's closer to correct gentlemanly behaviour than criminal.

I will also say that benzos have a rep even on this forum or making some people horny, and every time I wake up after a night on them I find my wife especially attractive + tend to approach, despite the fact that I have some nerve damage that makes things more difficult than they used to be.

Thanks for reading and I hope it is helpful - you'll understand that on a public forum I hope never to say another word about this ever again, so won't respond to any requests for clarification unless it's something you can't find out from here, wikipedia or other sources of information and you've tried!. The only reason I've gone into so any detail, let alone so much, is in the hope that it could be the difference between saving and not saving a marriage.

I will also say that diazepam, oxazepam, clonazepam and zolpidem don't mess me up the way temazepam does regarding memory blanking. I don't know why I'm susceptible in this case - others leave me foggy but I can remember taking the others...in the case of valium and stilnox, the last thing I remember.

Given the complexity of the situation and how easy it'd be to say "I was drunk and I think X raped me" without blaming her own pills or referring to them, and the complexity of feeding someone four sleeping pills", it's hard to see why she would've made the situation up or even spoken to her husband about it if she'd intended to cheat on him. I'll be praying the couple involved get through this without permanent damage to their relationship.

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Very good points both on the drug-related aspects and on how to go forward from here...

Last edited by Tigey; 12-11-2011 at 18:04. Reason: added mention of other drugs + effects on me.
  #9  
Old 15-11-2011, 10:17
BillyF BillyF is offline
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Re: Can temazepam really knock someone out?

Yes it can. It is a Metabolite of Valium. Diazepam. I had a friend on Temazepam and she was on 80mg I believe and she would fall over after taking it.

Temazepam is a "Twilight Benzo". It is used for sleep moreover than anxiety I believe, albeit, some do use it for anxiety.

-B.
  #10  
Old 03-02-2014, 00:14
SmokeyJ86 SmokeyJ86 is offline
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Re: Can temazepam really knock someone out?

Quote:
Originally Posted by concernedhubby View Post
This happened to someone NOT ME...
My friend's wife went out of town for work. She had just filled a prescription for Temazepam (insomnia) but didnt want to take them unless her husband was there. She has NEVER taken benzo's before and has nO history of drug abuse or addiction.

She was staying at a rented house on a job site, with 4 other co-workers.

She had a few glasses of wine at dinner and doesnt remember anything afterwards. She woke up naked and insists she had had sex. Sure enough, she checked her stuff and realized 4 15mg temazepam tablets were missing...her 4 co-workers all had access to her room/duffel bag...

She thinks its the young I.T. guy but cant prove anything

I think she is lying, she cheated, and made excuses...can 60mg of temazepam and 3 glasses of wine knock someone out and delete their memory??
First of all, it doesn't make sense that she'd be lying. If she's going to lie then the obvious lie would be to say nothing to her husband at all about it!

So she is probably telling the truth. She needs to go to the police asap and go through with them in detail, everyone that could have had access to that bag, when they could have had access to it and also rule out for sure that she didn'' take one or two herself (maybe after having a few drinks too many??) in which case, she wouldn't remember taking them. she needs to go to the police. And, if she wont go to the police 'because she can't prove anything' then the husband has cause for wondering that she might afterall, be holding something back. What I don't know! Interestingly, did her co-workers know about the temazepam she had on her?
  #11  
Old 03-02-2014, 16:11
Grizwald Grizwald is offline
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Re: Can temazepam really knock someone out?

I've had sex before on a Benzo blackout and didn't find out until the next day, but i was totally coherent according to my partner and even managed to drive myself home without incident.

She freaked out when i told her i had no recollection of most of the evening at hers, she didn't know i was even on Benzo's until i came clean (Naive and messing about with Etizolam, thinking it would just chill me out) I only had 1 beer at hers which i remembered (i didn't have a clue about the dangers of mixing Alcohol and Benzos) but after that was a total blank.

My point is, having no memory of something does not remove the intent.

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anxiolytic, benzo, benzodiazepine, benzodiazepines, benzos, date rape, date rape drugs, downer, drug rape, drugged, drunk, hypnotic, intoxication, muscle relaxant, restoril, temazepam, temazepam effects, temazepam side effects, triazolam, valium

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