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Drug testing discussion What can you do against drug testing & more...

 
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  #1  
Old 26-08-2011, 04:39
butterfli butterfli is offline
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Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

Hello, swim just had some questions about the best way to pass a supervised drug test at her methadone clinic. She was just wondering if any swimmers had advice or experience with this, as passing this particular test would seem to be more difficult than other drug tests (such as for an employer, etc) since swiy would need to test positive for only methadone (as opposed to just being able to test negative for everything by, perhaps, using someone else's urine).

Regular substitution (ie using someone else's urine) wouldn't work unless that person was taking methadone but nothing else. How have other swimmers passed supervised urines at methadone clinics? Swim gets take home bottles, and, therefore, her (random) supervised urines must test positive for methadone and, of course, only methadone. Thanks in advance for swiy's help!
  #2  
Old 26-08-2011, 05:05
coolhandluke coolhandluke is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

i was in this situation about two weeks ago. you need to befriend another at the clinic to get a source of clean urine, or wait until you have nothing but methadone in your system and freeze some bottles of your own piss for a later date.

i had done some coke while out at the bars and got called for a piss test. i acted like i couldnt pee, which is not unusual for me because every time except once i couldn't pee from a combo of the urethral retention from the methadone and just not having to go(if you cant go they give you 24 hours to come back and piss). anyway so they said to drink water before coming the next day. i had to get my friends wizzinator (a fake dick for drug tests lol), got used to how to use it without them catching on. went to another guy i knew who was on the methadone program and got his piss, and passed. one of the more stressful days ive had in a while.

for a lady im not sure what the standard practice is for using false piss while being watched. you could perhaps put it in a condom, stick it up there, and have a pin handy to poke the latex? or maybe buy one of those fake piss things the synthetic ones. it comes with a little plastic Blatter and a plastic tube. you could take the synthetic pee out and then put the methadone positive stuff in there, then put the pee pouch in your armpit, tape the hose down your back and run it down your ass crack, that could work. anyway like i said im not familiar with how women sneak piss around, because in a guy. maybe a female could chime in.

sorry for the foul language and nasty pictures i put in your head. but the business of handling piss isn't the most proper one to begin with.

ive been cheating piss tests since i was 14 and wasn't about to loose my take homes over some bull shit like that. i have to drive 120 miles round trip to the clinic and just got 6 take homes a week.
  #3  
Old 26-08-2011, 07:03
sunsun34 sunsun34 is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

Are you concerned that you have other drugs in your system besides the methadone, and want to try to trick the supervisor or something? Maybe that question isn't clear.....are you wondering how to use someone else's urine or are you wondering if the tests are accurate? I'm not sure what exactly you want to know.

sunsun34 added 114 Minutes and 36 Seconds later...

Never mind! The guy above me seemed to answer your question better than I could have in a million years!

Last edited by sunsun34; 26-08-2011 at 07:03. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
  #4  
Old 26-08-2011, 12:40
butterfli butterfli is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

SwiCoolhandluke, thank you very much for swiy's response. Swim wasn't aware that one could freeze the "methadone only" urine for a later date. Has any swimmer tried that before? Would swim then have to heat it up before the test (or just let it thaw)?

Also, swim has never actually tried any of these methods but, for a female, was familiar with the "condom method." Do swiy think that, by inserting the urine-filled condom into one's vagina, it would bring the temperature of the urine up high enough (ie from the heat of being inside one's body)?

SwiSunsun, yes, swim was looking for methods that would work in order to pass said test when heroin was in one's system. As far as substituting urine, swim was just saying that it's kind of difficult in this situation because one would have to find someone who had only methadone in their system (as opposed to finding someone who just didn't have anything in their system).

But thanks again for the info-- swim appreciates it!
  #5  
Old 26-08-2011, 23:27
coolhandluke coolhandluke is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

honestly i dont know if freezing it would effect how it would work with the methadone in your system. if you did have the condom in your vagina for about an hour it should be the same temp as your body. when i had taken them in the past unsupervised i would put the condom in my armpit and it made it the right temp. usually i would heat it up some first, like drop it in some warm to hot coffee for a little. not too hot though or else it would be way hotter than body temp it think.
  #6  
Old 27-08-2011, 03:13
butterfli butterfli is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

Thanks again for the info, SWIcoolhandluke. Do any swimmers know how long one could save "methadone only" urine for? Not necessarily by freezing it but just regular temperature urine. In other words, could swim save this urine for 1-2 weeks (or even longer) for use on said drug test? Or would the urine (or anything in it) degrade in some way? Does SWIanyone have experience doing this (particularly with respect to methadone clinic drug tests)? Thanks again-- swim appreciates it.
  #7  
Old 27-08-2011, 05:22
kailey_elise Gold member kailey_elise is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

No, unrefridgerated urine smells AWFUL; even in the fridge it goes icky rather quickly. Freezing it is the best option, though dehydration & making your own 'powdered urine' is also an option. Heh. It would have to be done under low heat & with a light fan - a food dehydrator would work well. Even if it doesn't 'powder', you can scrape up whatever does remain & freeze that & it stores better. Then you just have to to mix it with some warm water when u need to use it.

~Kailey
  #8  
Old 27-08-2011, 05:39
coolhandluke coolhandluke is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

kailey do you know if that would effect the methadone metabolites in the urine. or have any pointers for ladies and sneaking urine into the cup while a nurse is watching?
  #9  
Old 27-08-2011, 06:22
kailey_elise Gold member kailey_elise is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

Nope, I've never had supervised urines. I have dehydrated my urine before & apparently passed my test okay, but I couldn't vouch for it exactly.

~Kailey
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Old 27-08-2011, 13:46
butterfli butterfli is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

Good to know. Kailey, does swiy know if freezing or the dehydration method would affect the methadone in the urine? Swim would need the urine to test positive for methadone, of course.

Are there any other swimmers out there who have successfully passed random supervised urine tests at one's methadone clinic (when they have used illicit substances)? How did swiy do it?

Thanks again-- everyone here is always very helpful and knowledgeable!i
  #11  
Old 27-08-2011, 20:15
coolhandluke coolhandluke is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

try searching for other threads in the drug testing forum for info on how to pass supervised tests for ladies. i doubt you could find the info about the methadone metabolite being effected by storage of urine. btw they do not test for methadone in your urine they test for the metabolite that methadone produces, the chemical your liver makes after it breaks the methadone down.

anyway sounds like your going to have to come up with the answers your looking for. im sure somewhere on the web you can find out how women sneak urine into a supervised test.

i wouldn't see why freezing your piss would effect the contents of it. it just wouldn't really make sense. again i would not speak from experience.

at wal mart you can buy a drug test that tests for methadone. the only way to find would be to pee, freeze it for a month, than test it. bingo, thats the answer. i am a pee master lol. but yea that would work perfect. the test for methadone is a little pricy, ive seen it at wal greens to, its the 12 panel version i think, it says right on the box that it tests for methadone. id think thats the only way to find out, but none the less would work!! will take some time but will answer your question.

good luck be sure to update this thread with you results so others have the info. would be a very useful contribution to the drug testing forum, for all.

Post Quality Evaluations:
excellent ideas about how to test the hypothesis!
  #12  
Old 28-08-2011, 01:18
Mr. Jiki Mr. Jiki is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

Quote:
Originally Posted by coolhandluke View Post
btw they do not test for methadone in your urine they test for the metabolite that methadone produces, the chemical your liver makes after it breaks the methadone down.
Most drug screening techniques screen for the Methadone metabolite 2-ethylidene-1,5-dimethyl-3,3-diphenylpyrrolidine or EDDP. However Methadone is generally tested for in confirmation testing along with EDDP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by coolhandluke View Post
Good to know. Kailey, does swiy know if freezing or the dehydration method would affect the methadone in the urine? Swim would need the urine to test positive for methadone, of course.
Here is a quick little "general" timeline from what I've read. I haven't read any papers specifically focused on Methadone, but these timelines should help you out. I wouldn't use them as any gold standard, but more of a generalization of how long urine (with methadone and EDDP) can screen and test positive prior to sample degredation.


Room Temp (18-28 C): ≤ 14 days (Frings, 1972)
Refridgerated (2-8 C): ≤ 12 weeks (Rockerbie, 1978)
Frozen (-20 C): ≤ 6 months (Frings, 1972)

Also, just some gee whiz info, I cam across a couple studies that summarize that Diphenhydramine and Doxylamine have been found to cause false positive results with the enzyme immunoassay for methadone (Hausmann et al., 1983; Kelner, 1984).
--------------------
Also...about waiting for a month and testing to see if it shows up positive. We keep positive samples frozen for up to 1 year after they were screened. If I have time I could try and pool together some positive methadone samples from the past year and see if they still screen positive, and compare that data to the previous screening semi-quant values. There are papers where this was already studied, but I haven't really looked for methadone specific studies. However it may have to wait as I was going to be testing the flushing + adding B vitamins and creatine powder to see if that can artificially increase the creatinine levels and turn extremely diluted urine yellow.
---------------------
C. Frings, C. Queen. Preparation and use of a urine control for certain drugs of abuse. Clin. Chem. 18: 1440, 1972.

C. Frings, C. Queen. Stability of certain drugs of abuse in urine specimens. Clin. Chem. 18: 1442, 1972.

H.A. Hausmann, V. Kohl, H von Boehmer and H.H. Wellhoner. False-positive EMIT indication of opiates and methadone in a doxylamine intoxication. J. Clin. Chem. Clin. Biochem. 21: 599-600, 1983.

M.J. Kelner. Positive diphenhydramine interference in the EMIT-d.a.u. assay. Clin. Chem. 30: 1430, 1984.

R.A. Rockerbie, D.J. Campbell. Effect of specimen storage and preservation on toxicological analyses of urine. Clin. Biochem.: 11: 77-81, 1978.

Last edited by Mr. Jiki; 28-08-2011 at 01:27. Reason: Adding more info
  #13  
Old 28-08-2011, 02:59
butterfli butterfli is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

Thank you both very much. Coolhandluke, swim will definitely try to search some more, but, as swiy mentioned, she couldn't find much info on the methadone aspect of it. Buying the test to see if it still tests positive after a period of time of being frozen is a great idea.

Mr. Jiki, the approx timelines given were very helpful, and, if swiy is ever able to test the frozen urine for methadone as mentioned, swim would be very grateful to hear the results. Also, does swiy think that everything else that they test for would be ok after the urine was frozen for a period of time (such as specific gravity, creatinine levels, pH, and whatever else they test for besides drugs)?

Thanks again, guys! Swim will definitely post her findings/results.
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Old 01-09-2011, 09:47
Drey Drey is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

I apologize if I'm not being helpful to your current problem, but, maybe you could remind yourself of all the current hassles your having next time you're tempted to do some drug you're not supposed to? Not trying to be preachy, but the program might actually help you if you try working with your dr in finding the right does to handle your cravings?

Just mho.
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Old 04-03-2014, 15:29
Chiroptera Chiroptera is offline
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Re: Supervised Drug Testing At Methadone Clinics

I am not trying to sound judgemental or anything but I agree with Drey. If you are still having drug cravings than you are probably not on a high enough dose. Part of the programs objectives is to find a dose for each individual that not only keeps the withdrawals away but also keeps the cravings to a bare minimum. If you were on a proper dose the methadone may also block the effects of other opiates. Now none of this applies if you are using the clinic just for a basic security back up and therefore are not trying to actually be in recovery. Which of course is your decision. I just would hate to see someone trying to get clean and their clinic not giving them a dose high enough to actually help them to get clean. Some clinics and some counselors try to keep the dose to a minimum which has been proven to not work. Dose caps are more or less out the window but some individual clinics have their own form of dose capping and just don't listen to the clients. If you happen to be at one of those where they doub you and refuse to raise your dose and that is why you need other drugs than maybe you could benefit from a different clinic. Hope everything works out for you no matter what your goals are.

With Love
Ava

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please check the date on a thread before adding to it. This is a few years old and not really relevant

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