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Beta-Ketones Mephedrone, Methylone, Butylone, Methedrone, Ethcathinone, 3-fluoroMethCathinone (3FMC), Methylenedioxypyrovalerone (MDPV)

 
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  #1  
Old 11-05-2011, 19:00
JSiN JSiN is offline
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Methylone (bk-MDMA) vs. MDMA

AFOAF was wondering if there was any reall noticable difference between MDMA and bk-MDMA. AFOAF doesn't really have the experience to know.
  #2  
Old 11-05-2011, 19:10
Terrapinzflyer Terrapinzflyer is offline
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Re: bk-MDMA vs MDMA

While there are similiarities the differences are substantial- no one experienced with MDMA would likely be fooled by bk-mdma.

Generally, bk-mdma is much less euphoric, and what euphoria there is tends to be much shorter lived. Also many report bk-mdma to be "speedier", especially after the main effects have worn off. There are countless other smaller differences as well.

While a mildly interesting substance in its own right I doubt you would find many who would consider it a replacement for mdma.


read through:
Ecstasy experiences

Methylone (3,4-methylenedioxymethcathinone, bk-MDMA) Experiences
  #3  
Old 11-05-2011, 20:46
Descartesx Descartesx is offline
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Re: bk-MDMA vs MDMA

My fox has found that bk-mdma is noticeably different for these reasons:
1) the onset is much more rapid and speedier
2) the peak is more focussed, less tactile, less euphoric and with more of a push
3) the come-up and peak are linear and predictable, unlikethe waves of mdma
4) at higher doses, the plateau is very speedy and egocentric (sometimes)
5) the come down is sharp and fast, alike to being told you have failed an exam
6) after effects feel more toxic on the body and sleep is often hard to achieve if the fox redoses at all
7) bk-mdma is far more effective when ingested- hardly at all when insufflated

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Nice summary of differences between the two experiences
Very apt description at number 5!
A very helpful & easy to understand breakdown of the differences between these products! Thank you!
Couldn't have put it better myself
thats bk-mdma summed up in 7 sentences.
excellent post thank you,describes the effects of methylone in correct time frame
  #4  
Old 12-05-2011, 02:53
enquirewithin enquirewithin is offline
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Re: bk-MDMA vs MDMA

The adjective 'speedy' is often used. I remember so-called ''speedy acid."

Perhaps is "amphetamine-like"? I some ways MDMA is shares many qualities with ordinary amphetamines, which makes my horse avoid it (and MDA which just gives him a jittery feeling, like speed). The bk's, although lacking the intense ''empathy'' felt by MDMA users, which I think is almost as fake as the enthusiasms of speed, have a cleaner feel. MDMA feels somehow coarse-grained in comparison.

Its just an anecdote, but I remember seeing a video of Genesis P-Orridge doing an acid house gig, obviously high on MDMA, and saying to a member of the audience, "I know exactly how you feel'!" The answer was, "No you don't!"

BK-MDMA seems to be more addictive than MDMA-- there is more tendency to re-dose, but I don't agree that it feels more toxic than MDMA-- quite the opposite. The late Owsley didn't the like the compound much-- it's not as ''benign'' as psychedelics.

Apart from he possible comparative toxicity of BK-MDMA I agree with the above points entirely, if 'speedy' means stimulating-- a good summary.

A negative side of BK-MDMA is that I would expect that people tend to take it many more times than they take MDMA/ E. Mostly people lose interested in MDMA as the effects get less interesting every time its taken-- BK-MDMA is more like, say, cocaine, in that it still keeps on working after repeated occasional use, although much of the "magic".

BK-MDMA certainly no ecstasy replacement, thankfully- but I think MDMA is hugely over rated anyway, and have no need for anything like it, although I accept that many DF members would not agree with me!

Last edited by enquirewithin; 12-05-2011 at 03:07.
  #5  
Old 12-05-2011, 03:53
JSiN JSiN is offline
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Re: bk-MDMA vs MDMA

The only reason why I asked is because my dog got what he was told was molly from Mr. Dealer. However my dog has reason to believe this not to be true. However an experienced individual would be able to take this and tell the difference right away?
  #6  
Old 12-05-2011, 04:08
Phenoxide Phenoxide is nu online
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Re: bk-MDMA vs MDMA

If in doubt investing in a pill testing kit seems advisable. The two compounds are easily distinguished with Marquis reagent. Methylone will turn Marquis reagent yellow (if there's a color change at all), while MDMA, MDA and the like will yield a deep purple to black color.

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  #7  
Old 20-05-2011, 12:18
Lady Codone Lady Codone is offline
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Re: bk-MDMA vs MDMA

For SWIM, methylone would absolutely be an MDMA-equivalent drug if its effects lasted longer. The effects are almost indistinguishable for SWIM, with methylone being slightly more energetic/euphoric than pure MDMA (she likes feeling "energized" more than "relaxed"). The shorter duration and lack of a harsh comedown/"suicide Tuesday" is another bonus when compared to MDMA. It has a less toxic, more therapeutic feel. SWIM has heard people say it feels identical to ecstasy and others who see no similarities whatsoever.

How I describe it: methylone is to MDMA what MDMA is to MDA--a shorter-acting, less neurotoxic entactogen. Codone would hate to see it banned without studying its therapeutic potential.
  #8  
Old 20-05-2011, 14:49
Descartesx Descartesx is offline
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Re: bk-MDMA vs MDMA

http://www.neurophys.wisc.edu/~cozzi/sfnabs24.html

The link in a nutshell says that bk-mdma has far less action on the serotonin transporter than mdma does. But my fox has read that its affinity for the dopamine transporter is greater. This is likely why a lot of users report bk-mdma being more 'speedy' and having a shorter come-down period, because the body can resynthesize dopamine far faster than it can with serotonin.

My fox thinks its important to take into account that a lot of mdma is cut and sometimes is cut with amphetamines. My fox has had very pure crystal mdma before and it is far, far more of a positive experience than with bk-mdma. If a fox is sensible and keeps usage down to every few months then suicide tuesday is less likely to occur.
Take care
  #9  
Old 24-05-2011, 04:48
JSiN JSiN is offline
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Re: bk-MDMA vs MDMA

Well my dog reports good things about bk. Its not like he's displeased. In fact he's only done molly once, and likes the bk better. However the problem was he was told by mister dealer that he was buying molly, and he actually got bk. It leaves him with a sense that he was ripped off, and should have been told before hand. He has now started getting into this whole legal high thing, and would like some sudjestions as to what to try next.
  #10  
Old 24-05-2011, 16:35
enquirewithin enquirewithin is offline
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Re: bk-MDMA vs MDMA

At this point googling is the way to find out what you want to know. With the 'legal' chemicals there is more chance of getting what one expects, but not 100%.

Last edited by enquirewithin; 15-08-2013 at 14:24.
  #11  
Old 01-08-2011, 23:26
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Re: bk-MDMA vs MDMA

it averages alot cheaper then mdma so it miight be a valuable replacement

Last edited by Phenoxide; 02-08-2011 at 00:00.
  #12  
Old 14-08-2013, 11:49
WhitneyLoveXO WhitneyLoveXO is offline
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Re: bk-MDMA vs MDMA

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSiN View Post
Well my dog reports good things about bk. Its not like he's displeased. In fact he's only done molly once, and likes the bk better. However the problem was he was told by mister dealer that he was buying molly, and he actually got bk. It leaves him with a sense that he was ripped off, and should have been told before hand. He has now started getting into this whole legal high thing, and would like some sudjestions as to what to try next.
I'm pretty sure Molly is bkmdma. So if the dealer said that's what he gave you, Molly, then he wasn't lieing. Real mdma is not called Molly.

WhitneyLoveXO added 3 Minutes and 33 Seconds later...

Sorry the post I just wrote was in reply to your post at 1135. Molly is bkmdma. Real mdma is not Molly.

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Molly is slang, anything can be called molly,

Last edited by WhitneyLoveXO; 14-08-2013 at 11:49. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
  #13  
Old 15-08-2013, 00:01
Phenoxide Phenoxide is nu online
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Re: bk-MDMA vs MDMA

I disagree. When people use the term "molly" they're typically referring to powdered MDMA, not methylone. This is similar to how "ecstasy" typically refers to pressed pills containing MDMA.

However, much like "ecstasy" pills often contain drugs other than MDMA, substances sold as "molly" may well also be something else. This is a problem with using slang terms.
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Old 03-12-2013, 22:13
bleedingthrough425 bleedingthrough425 is offline
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Re: bk-MDMA vs MDMA

bk-mdma to me was way more fiendish than MDMA . with MDMA i can take 2 xpills roll hard as fuck and when i come down i can call it a night and head to bed . with Bk-mdma il take some (usually around 250mg-350mg) peak and then fiend hard and chase that first peak and never get it back , ive blown threw easily 3.5 grams of this stuff in a day and was strongly psychologically addicted to this substance for alil while . i am clean though now from
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Old 13-07-2014, 21:04
sayitaintso sayitaintso is offline
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Re: Mdma vs Mehtylone

Real MDMA kicks ass...methylone is like...."I'm almost there...whens it gonna peak" ...and it doesn't...sucks imo
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Old 14-07-2014, 02:23
Budgetadvisoryservice Budgetadvisoryservice is offline
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Re: Mdma vs Mehtylone

If you're getting real pure product, (over 99%) m1 kicks MDMA's ass for the initial rush. The key differences I've noticed are that MDMA is a ripoff, the cops are ignorant and often get a false negative for m1, m1 seems far more fiendish with a strong compulsion to redose along the lines of coke, and vaso-constriction is much more rapid and remarkable with m1.

Mix your m1 with a little MDPV, (maybe 5:1) and you get a much longer and more intense rush with less nystagmus and bruxism, which can be a real problem with very high doses of m1 on its own. On the other hand, there's no decent data on the long term effects of all these bk analogues. I'm on day five clean at the moment and the scariest part is that none of the clinicians have even heard of a substituted cathinone.

I've used MDMA to carry me over 'til I could get more m1. It kinda worked, but I didn't seem to have any tolerance, as 240mg IV really fucked me up (as in too much - splitting headache, vomiting etc) while I was on about a gram of m1 on a lean day at the time.

Take it easy with that shit.
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Old 14-07-2014, 12:28
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Re: Mdma vs Mehtylone

Quote:
Originally Posted by Budgetadvisoryservice View Post
If you're getting real pure product, (over 99%) m1 kicks MDMA's ass for the initial rush. The key differences I've noticed are that MDMA is a ripoff, the cops are ignorant and often get a false negative for m1, m1 seems far more fiendish with a strong compulsion to redose along the lines of coke, and vaso-constriction is much more rapid and remarkable with m1.

Mix your m1 with a little MDPV, (maybe 5:1) and you get a much longer and more intense rush with less nystagmus and bruxism, which can be a real problem with very high doses of m1 on its own. On the other hand, there's no decent data on the long term effects of all these bk analogues. I'm on day five clean at the moment and the scariest part is that none of the clinicians have even heard of a substituted cathinone.

I've used MDMA to carry me over 'til I could get more m1. It kinda worked, but I didn't seem to have any tolerance, as 240mg IV really fucked me up (as in too much - splitting headache, vomiting etc) while I was on about a gram of m1 on a lean day at the time.

Take it easy with that shit.
My stuff is in rock form whitish with a yellow/sandy tint in it and odorless they gave it to me as mdma thoe what do you think?
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Old 14-07-2014, 14:09
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Re: Mdma vs Mehtylone

You can not ID a drug based on how it looks.
Get yourself some reagents testing kits from somewhere like dancesafe and test your drugs.

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That old chestnut... Excellent advice. Tell the world! Test your gear.
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Old 14-07-2014, 14:39
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Re: Mdma vs Mehtylone

Quote:
Originally Posted by RyderSku View Post
My stuff is in rock form whitish with a yellow/sandy tint in it and odorless they gave it to me as mdma thoe what do you think?
I'm with the zombie.

Get a reagent kit. MDMA usually tests really clearly. If you've got any quantity of product then the cost is far outweighed by the benefit of knowing what you're working with.

Of coarse, you could just bang it up and see how dead you get...

Budgetadvisoryservice added 7 Minutes and 43 Seconds later...

The most pure MDMA I ever met was flouro orange, but I've seen white rocks test relatively pure as well.

... and then there was the little bag of quartz crystals that I tried cooking in a spoon. They were as you describe, and totally odourless.

Last edited by Budgetadvisoryservice; 14-07-2014 at 14:39. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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Old 14-07-2014, 15:38
RyderSku RyderSku is offline
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Re: Mdma vs Mehtylone

Quote:
Originally Posted by ianzombie View Post
You can not ID a drug based on how it looks.
Get yourself some reagents testing kits from somewhere like dancesafe and test your drugs.
its pretty compliacated to order testing kits from net to my place..
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Old 14-07-2014, 18:29
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Re: Mdma vs Mehtylone

Then i would suggest you skip the drugs until you find another solution.
Maybe you can get them delivered to a friend?
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Old 15-07-2014, 03:45
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Re: Methylone (bk-MDMA) vs. MDMA

I am sure much of what I have to say has been covered, but you know me, I like to opine on topics I am very familiar with. Having exposed myself to more pure MDMA than even the biggest fan of the drug could be content with, as well as bk-MDMA, the differences are not slight. MDMA is much more powerful.

1. Milligram for Milligram, MDMA is more than twice as potent. 125mg being a strong dose for MDMA for most users, 250mg-300mg being a good starting dose with bk-MDMA

2. Eye wiggles vs Eye rolls. When "rolling" on MDMA, your eyes tend to roll or in some people, on a strong dose, you can hardly tell their eyes are open as they are walking around the venue as if they are sleep walking. With bk-MDMA you get a different and unique eye wiggle where your vision seems to intermittently vibrate back and from from left to right, real fast. <-> <-> <-> and then it may not happen for 20 more minutes or so, when it occurs again. I found this to be interesting and certainly different than what I remember MDMA visual disturbances (if you can call them that) to be like.

3. MDMA is more stable than bk-MDMA. I have had MDMA stay potent providing a +++ for many years after proper preparation for storage and then adequate storage conditions themselves. I always store my compounds in vacuum sealed bags which are then buried a foot or so in the earth till I desire them, at locations that require me to really want to use the drug and not do so out of spontaneous and often irresponsible time periods. This is the way I cope with compulsive and immediate gratification since I have had problems with certain drugs over the years. I live in a cold region most of the year. Recently, I pulled out a bag of bk-MDMA that had only been stored for 2-3 years tops and a dose of 250mg didn't even phase me. My friend, also took 250mg, and she hardly felt anything. At the time of storage, 250mg was enough for a 2-3 hour trip that I would rate as a pleasurable ++ if sex was involved. The bk-MDMA was re-crystalized prior to storage, as should be done with any compound you wish to store for lengthy periods of time before placing in a desiccator to ensure absolute anhydrous conditions.

3- I have a hard time falling asleep at the tail end of both experiences and find both a bit moreish. With MDMA, I know better not to exceed two doses in one night. With bk-MDMA, the same rule should apply if you wish to keep a healthy head. Some benzodiazepines expedite this process of inducing sleep.

4- I can fuck on both drugs, but expect the occasional el limpo el dicko show to rear its cute limp head. It's just the nature on these drugs, especially when you are really flying nicely and have worked up a sweat and need a water-cool off break. Never a major problem getting back up once a break is over.

5- I feel more drained after 2 doses of MDMA the days after a night of fun, than I did when I took say, 400-500mg of bk-MDMA. This is likely due to the short nature of effect bk-MDMA has compared to the 6 hour roll you get from MDMA.

In summary, I will take MDMA any day of the week. Shit, I will take MDA over bk-MDMA any day of the week. bk-MDMA is just not as special and doesn't winner winner chicken dinner me the same way as MDMA and MDA does.

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Great information for the OP
  #23  
Old 15-07-2014, 12:02
maltdog maltdog is offline
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Re: Methylone (bk-MDMA) vs. MDMA

I Wanted to briefly add my own experiences.

I have enjoyed tested MDMA crystal many times. Crystal has always been tested but it has varied in color. Clearish, white, yellowish, grey, orangish etc.

In addition to this I have enjoyed MDA and MDEA Crystal numerous times again all tested and all matched the clEAR subtle differences exactly. (Many other well known and more exotic chemicals have also been enjoyed- ,everything has always been tested and carefully measured with specific dosages on high quality scales).

I wanted to illustrate this because my experiences with methylone have not been very pleasant. I have acquired methylone from numerous sources all again tested (including reputable labs) here is the point...... I get no real discernable effects from methylone.

Now, I could try crazy doses but the highest I have tried is 400mg (over two doses) and I really could not tell any effects and feel no need to explore boyond this. In all testing I have have lab assistants, again all qualified who have been able discern very clear and positive effects. These same assistants have worked through majority of the trials of MDMA etc mentioned above so are familiar with my trialling approaches.

Im at a loss to understand this.... I only have this occurrence with methylone, no other phenthylamine, cathinone or tryptamines. I do detect some elevated heart and perspiration but nothing more.

I find it odd, no one else seems to report anything similiar- and have actaullly seat on this for years concerned of being ridiculed in some way.

However, my sentiments of MDMA and methylone are hopefully clear.

maltdog added 0 Minutes and 59 Seconds later...

I Wanted to briefly add my own experiences.

I have enjoyed tested MDMA crystal many times. Crystal has always been tested but it has varied in color. Clearish, white, yellowish, grey, orangish etc.

In addition to this I have enjoyed MDA and MDEA Crystal numerous times again all tested and all matched the clEAR subtle differences exactly. (Many other well known and more exotic chemicals have also been enjoyed- ,everything has always been tested and carefully measured with specific dosages on high quality scales).

I wanted to illustrate this because my experiences with methylone have not been very pleasant. I have acquired methylone from numerous sources all again tested (including reputable labs) here is the point...... I get no real discernable effects from methylone.

Now, I could try crazy doses but the highest I have tried is 400mg (over two doses) and I really could not tell any effects and feel no need to explore boyond this. In all testing I have have lab assistants, again all qualified who have been able discern very clear and positive effects. These same assistants have worked through majority of the trials of MDMA etc mentioned above so are familiar with my trialling approaches.

Im at a loss to understand this.... I only have this occurrence with methylone, no other phenthylamine, cathinone or tryptamines. I do detect some elevated heart and perspiration but nothing more.

I find it odd, no one else seems to report anything similiar- and have actaullly seat on this for years concerned of being ridiculed in some way.

However, my sentiments of MDMA and methylone are hopefully clear.

Last edited by maltdog; 15-07-2014 at 12:03. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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