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Opiate addiction Support for coping with Opiate addiction and Opiate addiction treatment.

 
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  #1  
Old 28-03-2011, 19:33
M3fan M3fan is offline
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I cannot stop thinking about opiates...

swim doesn't know what to do. swim was a closet opiate addict for 2 years. swim was taking 300-400mg a day. After swim spent 20k (his life savings) and started asking his parents for money, they found out. swim promised them he would stop, and entered treatment. Treatment was NOT for swim. swim is a college graduate who got addicted to painkillers after an accident, many many concussions cause severe depression and anxiety which led to pain killer use to feel "normal". After being dope sick for 3-4 days of the week followed by constant looking for oxycodone swim finally went to a doctor and got put on subutex (not suboxone). swim was OK for a few months. swim is now on month 4 and down from 8mg a day to 4-6mg a day and cannot stop thinking about opiates. He has been on this dose of subutex for about 2 months so it is not the dose decrease, it is the mental cravings that are killing him. He doesn't know what else to do and is dieing inside. swim hasn't gone back to the oxycodone lifestyle because he doesn't want to, but mostly because of the money issue. swim just wants to feel NORMAL. swim is extremely scared of stopping subutex because of withdrawal and relapse. swim doesn't want to take opiates again, but he just feels like opiates are what makes his life normal again. swim desperately needs stability .... swim has thought about methadone but knows nothing about it, and hates the stigma around it. swim is willing to try methadone regardless of what people think or say, because he needs to end this mental anguish. he hears how methadone is impossible to stop, but he does not care. swim feels like subutex does not work for him and feels like he is resistant to almost all drugs. even when swim goes to the dentist, he requires 3 shots of novocain just to get numb. swim does not abuse ANY other drugs, swim drinks on special occasions only. swim gets prescribed benzos and never takes more than .5mg daily. swim does not smoke weed. BUT swim cannot stay away from opiates swim just wants to live a normal life. swim is not depressed but feels hopeless sometimes. what do you guys think about methadone? no one understand how swim feels inside. someone please help.......

M3fan added 11 Minutes and 30 Seconds later...

also for the last 3-4 months of opiate use, swim switched to IV. being a college grad with a job swim never got into heroin, but tried it a few times but enjoyed oxycodone much more.

Last edited by M3fan; 28-03-2011 at 19:33. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
  #2  
Old 29-03-2011, 00:05
youssarian youssarian is offline
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Re: swim cannot stop thinking about opiates...

Hello M3fan. thanks for sharing your story.
My pet cat abused opiates for a number of years before going on bupe, then subutex. She started out taking 16mg of subutex, then down to a steady dose of 8mgs for a number of years. For her, the cravings were the worst in the first few months and even then never really completely went away. it seemed as her 'drug free lifestyle' evolved and become a more entrenched routine, the craving did get less and less. seems long term maintenance was the key.
I know this may sound like a big step to take, but has swiy considered moving to completly new surroundings? new city with no associations.
my cat would def. recommend bupe over methadone, but it really is what works for you- some trial and error is involved, plus looking into other options such as other medications (anti-deps. etc) or alternative therapies. My cat found meditation very helpful, and has heard great things about ethnobotanical kratom.
I'm sure youre aware of the danger precipitated withdrawals if swiy takes any opiates when subutex is in your system- so be careful!
Apparently the naloxone in subutex keeps cravings at bay for more than other options- but again, this may not be entirely effective.
Good luck dude! let us know how you go & try to stay strong!
  #3  
Old 29-03-2011, 00:33
spicybrainsgirl spicybrainsgirl is offline
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Re: swim cannot stop thinking about opiates...

watch out with Kratom, I got addicted to that after getting off Morphine/Oxycontin.

BUT, I would recommend it over Bupe. Bupe made me so sick, I lost 20 pounds, got suicidally depressed and I got severe arthritis (I'm only 30).

Please keep us updated
  #4  
Old 29-03-2011, 04:27
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Re: swim cannot stop thinking about opiates...

Don't do methadone..that'll just be another problem in it's own. Same with subs. It's a shame swiy endured the worst part...3-4 days after 300-400mg of oxycondone must have been rough as hell, but it was about to end. Swim cannot even fathom what 300-400mg of oxy would feel like to come down from. Swim only used about 160 equivalent a day and that was hell.

Swiy was on the home stretch. Look man, the depression will last like 4-7 days after the initial 3-4 days swiy endured. But the worst part is the 3-4 days! Everything else can be fixed by doing fun stuff, exercising, getting a hobby, and being productive! The cravings will be there the entire time. The cravings for swim lasted the entire 3 weeks last time he went clean. Then he got the dumb idea of trying some stuff out to see how low his tolerance went. Big mistake haha. If you just give it a month, your body WILL return to normal. The human body is amazing.
  #5  
Old 29-03-2011, 04:48
Pain Hurts Pain Hurts is offline
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Re: swim cannot stop thinking about opiates...

Agree with both replied above .... and its been 15 months since swim began and can say he would rather feel straight up pain than WD's ..... and that is a fact !!

Ever since loosing 10 days of a monthly RX last month (270mg per day Oxy) , swim has been down 1 x 80mg per day due to needing to borrow from a friend *** WHO ELSE CAN SAY THEY CAN DO THAT???? BUT SWIM IS SUCH A GOOD PERSON THE PAYBACK DUE TO APPRECIATION TO THE LENDER COST HIM MUCH OF THE FOLLOWING MONTHS rx TOO , AS INTEREST % !!

now, swim counts his remaining RX in his sleep and has nightmares because if you tell your doc that you lost them, even if so honestly **** you are most likely out of luck. Cut off, a 99% chance , at least in Canada due to the over- abuse and epidemic of thousands of people coming into local docs asking for HELP as their dealers run dry. It costs the health system so much $$$ when they need to treat people ... and now all docs wonder = where are these extra opiates coming from???

Yes, swim is looking at them right now and does several re-counts daily because of the damn fukin WD , it don't fell good one bit. Felt it a few times and 2 full days last month was enough. The pain is nothing compared.

Best wishes!!!!

Pain Hurts added 2 Minutes and 47 Seconds later...

so true - the human body is really amazing and will heal itself.

MY POINT IS THAT DIFFERENT FELLOWS HAVE VARYING PAIN AND COMFORT THRESHOLDS - PERSONALLY. ... swim cannot take the agony at all. Its all in the head. And his body reminds him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drummer16 View Post
Don't do methadone..that'll just be another problem in it's own. Same with subs. It's a shame swiy endured the worst part...3-4 days after 300-400mg of oxycondone must have been rough as hell, but it was about to end. Swim cannot even fathom what 300-400mg of oxy would feel like to come down from. Swim only used about 160 equivalent a day and that was hell.

Swiy was on the home stretch. Look man, the depression will last like 4-7 days after the initial 3-4 days swiy endured. But the worst part is the 3-4 days! Everything else can be fixed by doing fun stuff, exercising, getting a hobby, and being productive! The cravings will be there the entire time. The cravings for swim lasted the entire 3 weeks last time he went clean. Then he got the dumb idea of trying some stuff out to see how low his tolerance went. Big mistake haha. If you just give it a month, your body WILL return to normal. The human body is amazing.

Last edited by Pain Hurts; 29-03-2011 at 04:48. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
  #6  
Old 29-03-2011, 05:43
professor1165 professor1165 is offline
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Re: swim cannot stop thinking about opiates...

Pain Hurts & Drummer make it sound so easy....yea just do something else. Thats the ticket. Okay, now for some real advice. When I read your post my heart sank. I empathize with you. I remember when that insidious feeling crept in on me, looking around and not seeing a single reason to keep sober, but not having any means by which to get high. I wish this was the part where I say something uplifting and prophetic that promises to turn your whole life around, but this aint a perfect world. For this ex-junkie the cravings (and relapses) got so bad I eventually got put on a monthly Vivitrol (Naltexone - opiate blocker). 1 shot in the ass and for 30 days I could not get high no matter how much dope I stuffed up my arm! This may be something to consider. Regardless of cravings if you really want to stay the course & GET BETTER you should think about cutting out the Subs and going for the full block. It is a much rougher road mentally but physically you heal much quicker. Theres nothing to w/d from or taper. Just take the blocker, understand that by taking it any attempt to get high is futile, and move on with your journey. Its not easy or fun and you may end up crying in the corner the next time you get the itch, but its the ultimate insurance policy for a serious abstinence seeker. For me; I know I need it because its been 3.5 years and I still think about Heroin or Oxy at least once/day. From talking with others I've found this to be the status quo. Once your hooked, your hooked and unless you do some major footwork everyday youre heading right for relapse. I hope somewhere in this blabbering there is some useful nuggets of info that may help you. I only meant to be honest and helpful, if anything else is communicated its entirely unintentional.
P.S. don't think that you're exempt from certain things because youre a "college grad with a job". I was a 22 year old marketing manager for a fortune 500 company making 6 figures a year before I started shooting Heroin. Now I live in a cramped basement studio apartment and make about as much $$ as a first-year teacher. Pills and drugs don't care where you work or what degree you have!!!
  #7  
Old 29-03-2011, 07:01
Pain Hurts Pain Hurts is offline
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Re: swim cannot stop thinking about opiates...

thanks prof,

please note that swim does have severe scoliosis (literally spine is shaped like this:

S

Yup, the letter S, no exaggeration, none.

Degenerative disk disease and another condition prefer not to say but lets just say if you ever wanna see me in person we can arrange that via internet .. cam... and you would understand, better ... not downplaying you at all, just saying. 1 look at me and you know.

the pain is real. and sadly I have not been high off of or had a nice glow or buzz for 7+ months.... the entire goal now is keep the pain down , which is working 100%, and taper down , personally the goal = 80mg per day max.

swim understands and knows this will take losing another 35 lbs, the excess weight takes a tremendous toll of the spine. and overall well being ....

  #8  
Old 29-03-2011, 07:33
M3fan M3fan is offline
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Re: swim cannot stop thinking about opiates...

Swim just doesn't understand... why cant he feel "normal" again on subutex? he tells himself he will feel better everyday, but everyday he does not. sure, 4 months ago he felt great because he was no longer "dope sick" but now the realization is setting in that he is still not OK. It makes no difference if he takes 16mg, 8mg, or 4mg, bottom line is he us constantly thinking about opiates. subutex is like a sugar pill for swim.

Swim cannot figure it out though. before during and after his opiate useage he had plenty of straight friends. he has a great family and good values. he had a beautiful gf before & while using opiates who never even drank. now he has a new gf who he is crazy about (nevermind beautiful!) he drives a sports car, he has investments numbering in the 100k's, he just graduated college (hates school so this is awesome!!!) he invests in real estate, swim just cannot figure out why this mental anguish must persist? swim can ONLY rationalize this because of his accidents. swim has almost died numerous times. he has had severe concussions (5+) that would of killed the average person. swim has bad luck when it comes to accidents (childhood mostly) but always worked through it. in highschool swim only enjoyed to drink on the weekend. swim was very popular and good looking, so friends, girls, and "stuff to do" was never an issue!!! since swim stopped using opiates he has gone to the gym as well, and is in great shape!

BUT after his last accident, his opiate usage (20mg once a week maybe?) turned into 300-400mg a day habit (whatever i could afford)...

this is how it happened: after his concussion he suffered from severe concussion syndromes .... this SNOWBALLED into anxiety, which prevented swim from being able to sleep, and when he could, he woke up several times a night (yes literally). this caused his grades to drop, and his depression to set in. he started to feel like a failure. math was no longer making sense to him. SWIM was no longer sleeping, was full of anxiety, was full of depression all because of his accident. swim was prescribed painkillers for his accident, which made him feel "normal" when he was at his lowest moments. no one understood how it happened, including himself. when people found out, they were blown away ... because bottom line is swims life was GREAT!

now, the concussion sides have faded. swim was put on an anti-depressant which launched his usage into the sky. thats when swim really started to get wreckless with spending too much money on them. this was not a simple "lets have fun, oh shit i cant stop now" this was swim knowing what he was doing but would do ANYTHING to escape from his mental state.

swim went to concussion specialists, got MRIs, second opinions, the works.. nothing worked. swim started to think the problem was his opiate use, and after spending all his money, he wanted to stop this lifestyle he did not agree with. swim was always an extremely confident person, but he found himself crying when people asked him "what is wrong?" swim told himself "it must be the opiates!" so swim told himself it was time to stop the lifestyle. swim started IVing because it was more cost effective per say... he could get off to 60mg oxycodone IV for just as long as he could snorting them, but got a "rush" from it too.

Anyway, after 2 months swim went from 8mg subutex to 4-6mg daily. now swim is back to taking 6-8mg without his doctor knowing. his doctor wants to drop him down to 2mg a day but at this point swim is about to give up hope!

I hope this post may have made a little more sense. I do not feel like his use was because of escaping from reality, from partying, or wanting to have a good time. swim is a good person who just could not escape his mental anguish.

SWIM blames it all on his concussions and injuries. at this point, he feels as if using opiates was the only thing in his life that made him feel normal. I am not talking about drooling or nodding out, it wasn't about that. I used and became energetic, my anxiety went away, my depression lifted, my sleep was back. thats why he used.....

When swim tells his doctors this, they think he is a stable patient who is just going through some hard times. yes, these times are hard, but swim does not feel like he is getting better! he is only "better" because he is constantly forcing himself to believe he is better. yes his money is back, yes his lifestyle is gone, but his cravings for opiates are as strong as ever. also he lives in 2 different locations: school during the week and home during the weekend. swim DOES NOT hang around any opiate users and does not associate with them either.

swims subutex doctor doesn't take insurance and is also an "addiction specialist" with a degree from an ivy league school and NYU medical school degree, so he has helped countless amounts of people but 400 dollars a visit and 200 for the subs is KILLING his bank, its basically as much as his oxy habit!

swim doesn't know what to do anymore, but swim is starting to think he never knew what to do to begin wth
  #9  
Old 29-03-2011, 15:51
ex-junkie ex-junkie is offline
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Re: swim cannot stop thinking about opiates...

Quote:
Originally Posted by M3fan View Post
BUT swim cannot stay away from opiates swim just wants to live a normal life. swim is not depressed but feels hopeless sometimes. what do you guys think about methadone? no one understand how swim feels inside. someone please help.......
Hi there,

I'm just going to comment on this part of your post, because it jumps out the most to me. Firstly, it is important to mention that depression is known to have a higher incidence in methadone clients, than subutex clients.

Secondly, if your pet wants to continue to use opiates, then methadone is the better option. Buprenorphine has both agonist and antagonist properties, so every time your pet uses opiates your pet will precipitate varying levels of withdrawal next time buprenorphine is taken. It's not a comfortable form of maintenance, for using pets, whether it is subutex or suboxone.

Thirdly, it could be argued that methadone is easier to detox from than buprenorphine. I say this because buprenorphine is a very effective detox drug, when used short term. It helps to speeden up the detox process, when detoxing from methadone - making the duration of withdrawals shorter than it would be on a long taper. Buprenorphine helps people get off of methadone, but what is there to help people get off of buprenorphine?

Ignore the social stigma that society wacks on methadone. One method will not always for one, whereas another will. My pet detoxed from methadone over five years ago and had no trouble integrating back into society, and your pet can do the same when the mindframe and timing is right.

Last edited by ex-junkie; 12-04-2011 at 15:32.
  #10  
Old 29-03-2011, 16:17
kailey_elise Gold member kailey_elise is offline
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Re: swim cannot stop thinking about opiates...

What is M3fan doing to address his mental health issues? The anxiety, the depression, the potential PTSD? He may be "craving opiates" because in the past, he knows opiates gave him relief from those symptoms; if he took care of those symptoms appropriately, there's a damn good chance the desire for opiates would drop considerably.

It sounds like there's been a good deal of trauma in M3fan's short life; some weekly talk therapy & perhaps some medication could be very helpful.

In addition, this is still "early sobriety" time & the emotions are still going to be all over the place, yes, even being treated with opioid replacement therapy; keep that in mind as well.

Also, M3fan has to stop with that "I'm special because I'm a college student/graduate" shit. I know *PLENTY* of successful people in high paying jobs who are still shoving needles in their arm - opioid addiction knows no barriers.

Anyway, again, what has M3fan been doing to address his mental health issues? What does he have in place as his support system, and is he using it?

I think methadone is a fine medication & works very well. It's a pain to go to the clinic every day, but if one isn't doing any other drugs illicitly, it doesn't take long at all to earn take-home doses so that one doesn't have to attend every day. Not everyone responds well to buprenorphine. However, as M3fan seemed to respond well to it previously, I would look into the other aspects of mental health as well, try to get that taken care of & see if the cravings lessen, just because it's easier to be on Suboxone maintenance.

~Kailey
  #11  
Old 12-04-2011, 15:18
ChiselD ChiselD is offline
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Re: I cannot stop thinking about opiates...

Kailey hits this one on the head. My cat is a college graduate, and ONLY started shooting up AFTER he graduated from college...stupid, yes I know. I don't agree with what he does, but I can say, he is quitting(attempting). Addiction takes hold of all who fall prey, not just unintelligent folks.
  #12  
Old 28-04-2011, 05:19
polydoc polydoc is offline
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Re: I cannot stop thinking about opiates...

I definitely feel for everyone in this position, I have seen swim go through these situations and is still learning to live on suboxone. However, keep in mind that swiy are not exceptions in either their usage nor their struggles to stay clean. Swim was using up to 2400 mg/day of oxycodone and managed to ween down to less than half that before quitting. Mind you swim suffered like he never had before or since. Habit size does not really matter though, it is hell quitting and staying clean off any amount. Opiates (and all drugs) do not care what was going on in swim's life and will bring anyone down from the top to the bottom. Addiction usually creeps up on you.
One other thing, the information provided in this thread regarding suboxone/subutex and other opiate replacement drugs is very inaccurate. The action of naloxone is not entirely understood, as in suboxone it is nearly entirely inactive no matter what route of administration. Naloxone can influence depression even at minimal levels. It is the buprenorphine in subutex and suboxone that blocks the action of other opiates. Bupe binds to the receptors stronger than any realistic dosage of any other opiates. There are a few exceptions, but this is generally the case. Also, withdrawal will not be precipitated or even present if one takes opiates with bupe in their system. The whole point is that it blocks anything else trying to bind to the receptors. Precipitated withdrawal occurs when one takes buprenorphine while another opiate is still in the system of the user. The transition from full agonist usage to buprenorphine is not always as easy as some make it out to be for this very reason.
Also, keep in mind that our bodies do not quickly return to normal after stopping use, and it usually takes a long time and a lot of treatment for heavy users to feel "normal" again. Depression, anxiety, and any symptom that swim might have is most definitely due in part to not using. The use of antidepressants and other non-addictive medicines can play a vital role in balancing the chemicals within.
I could go on and on, but this post has been long enough. Its very hard for me to standby and see people with misinformation trying to make it through such difficulties. I am no doctor and I am speaking in generalizations of swim's experience and my knowledge. Feel free to add or correct.

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