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  #1  
Old 01-03-2011, 07:06
RussellMania RussellMania is offline
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Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

I know someone that sells Mephedrone along with other research chemicals such as AMT, JWH products, and ext. He sells them as plant feeders. When someone calls him, they just say they need some stuff to help their garden grow. Most people in my area have no idea even where to get this products. He buys them online in bulk and turns around and sells them for a nice profit. I don't understand why drug dealers would sell illegal drugs like coke and X, when they can just sell legal research chemicals, make lots of money, and don't have to worry about going to jail. I believe that as long as you don't advertise its for human consumption, then their is nothing the DEA, or police and do, so basically you are taking no risk. After all, its all to help the plants grow.

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AMT has been scheduled in the U.S. since 2003. So it negates that nothing illegal is going on.
  #2  
Old 01-03-2011, 09:08
Phenoxide Phenoxide is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

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Originally Posted by RussellMania View Post
I believe that as long as you don't advertise its for human consumption, then their is nothing the DEA, or police and do, so basically you are taking no risk. After all, its all to help the plants grow.
You are falling into the same complacent trap that many Web Tryp vendors did and that some of them are still sitting behind bars for.

Simply slapping a 'Not for human consumption' label on everything does not mean that the feds cannot make a case where intent for human consumption is demonstrable. Even seemingly mundane and minor details can be used to form a case, and where the DEA has done so they have generally been successful. Most failed prosecutions under the Analog Act were the result of failing to demonstrate structural similarity to a controlled substance rather than failing to demonstrate intent for human consumption.

So is it legal to sell research chemicals? Yes and no. It's a grey area in every respect when it comes to US law. With regard to mephedrone specifically, a few states have already controlled this compound and several more have legislation progressing. The DEA has also invoked the Analog Act to bring a prosecution against one mephedrone distributor. It's certainly not a good time for anyone based on US soil to be moving large quantities of these compounds.
  #3  
Old 01-03-2011, 21:49
EzekielCain EzekielCain is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

My lab has sent out emails today saying that new additions have been included in the proposed RC ban, and until further notice they are suspending all sales until their legal team extensively checks out the new language that wasn't included in the original ban.

It could just be kids that the shit has hit the fan. I certainly hope everyone is well stocked up...
  #4  
Old 03-03-2011, 12:08
PhoenixPie PhoenixPie is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

Quote:
Originally Posted by EzekielCain View Post
My lab has sent out emails today saying that new additions have been included in the proposed RC ban, and until further notice they are suspending all sales until their legal team extensively checks out the new language that wasn't included in the original ban.

It could just be kids that the shit has hit the fan. I certainly hope everyone is well stocked up...
I just reviewed the full DEA news release and reviewed the listing in the Federal Register and found no language suggesting that other agents could or might be included in this ban. My understanding is that at least 30 days notice would need to be given if additional compounds are to be included. Can you please provide a link to the new language in the ban that you are making reference to which suggests new compounds might be added? Thanks.

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Good work, this needed to be asked-- thanks for being the one to do it.

Last edited by PhoenixPie; 03-03-2011 at 12:20.
  #5  
Old 03-03-2011, 18:49
Terrapinzflyer Terrapinzflyer is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

Whats the saying... "people that don't know history are doomed to repeat it"...?

Swiy mentions AMT- this is a schedule I drug in the US (emergency scheduled april 2003, final permanent scheduling in september 2004.)

As Phenoxide mentioned the DEA is moving ahead with prosecution of a vendor of mephedrone under the analog act: Federal Analog Act Charges for Mephedrone Vendor

And the mentioned Operation Web Tryp which cast a dark cloud over RC's in the US for years.
DEA arrests most Research Chemical vendors under the name 'Operation Web tryp'

Disposition of web tryp cases

and the related UK arrests of Operation Ismene Dawn raids mark crash of online designer drugs trade

Or maybe read this story about felony prosecution for sales of 2c-i , a substance not explicitly "illegal" in the US : 'Born Illegal' -- Exploring the Powerful Advanced Psychedelics Invented by the Father

Or this story of DEA/FDA raids on a vendor. While ultimately the prosecution was dropped, it certainly did not prevent raids, incarcerations, or seizure of money and property. Online store raided for manufacturing, distributing trafficking controlled substances

And one need look no further then the newspapers and peirodicals to know there is blood in the water. Somewhere around 18 states have banned some synthetic cannabinoids, and another half dozen or so have banned mephedrone, mdpv and or others. And many more states are in the process of banning these chemicals, with many states also adding more chemicals to those they previously banned.

The legislative branch of the government is looking at outlawing mephedrone, mdpv and other substances independent of the DEA : US Senator wants ban on drug-like bath salts

Further, there have been indications the DEA is looking at exactly when/how the analog act can be applied, and whether the law needs strengthening. And more and more states are looking at adding analog act type of language to their drug laws. (and some states do already have analog acts- Texas and California come to mind)

Research chemicals have become a very hot topic for both legislatures and law enforcement- not just in the US but internationally. The UN International Narcotics Control Board just released their annual report this month and have called for far more sweeping controls. Designer drugs are escalating out of control, according to International Narcotics Control Board

Really, if someone is knowingly selling a research chemical as a drug, no disclaimer is going to protect them. Does one really want to be in court explaining why they possess these chemicals? Or try and provide a single scientific reference for these chemicals being useful as "plant food"? Do they think, that if so motivated, the police would not be able to find a person who would testify that one had given dosage or effects information or otherwise knew their intended purpose? Or not be able to find a search history, email, forum or social media posting or some other information indicating they knew its intended purpose? Or do they have a sufficiently good reason for when customs discovers a bulk quantity in a shipment and starts asking questions?

And as phenoxide said- it is a dangerous time in the US for anyone to be distributing research chemicals. The writing has been on the wall for some time, and really I can have little sympathy for those that ignore it. It is in no small part the greed and ignorance of vendors that have brought this situation to a head, and their refusal to heed the warning shots are damning us to going down an ugly road. We will end up loosing many chemicals to explicit bans, and many more to the grey area of the analog act.

The fact is these are drugs, and everyone knows what they are for. In terms of personal use the whole "wink, wink, nudge, nudge, know what I mean?" bit has generally been sufficient. But sales/distribution has been another story.


The fact that swiy's friend seems to be playing with AMT, a schedule I substance, and mephedrone, a substance currently being prosecuted under the analog act without knowing this tells me they don't have the grip on the reality of the situation they think they do...

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reeeealy nice and comprehensive answer
Wow. This is perfect. Should be stickied.
Fantastically well-written & well-sourced informative post regarding the current climate around RCs & "legal highs"
  #6  
Old 03-03-2011, 20:57
Thirdedge Thirdedge is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

Its worth remembering that in operation web tryp most of the key players were very stealth, using very discreet research and industrial themed companies such as pool cleaning chemicals, yet they all went down . . . big time.

Some of the customers 'stoner themed' email addresses were enough for the DEA to claim the chemicals were obviously for consumption, as any legitimate research company should have got suspicious and refused sale to anyone with those sort of email address.

In other words, the latest headshop/youth culture shop/legal high type vendors selling to college age youth do not stand even a minute chance of convincing the DEA that there products were not for consumption. No way, not gonna happen.
  #7  
Old 09-03-2011, 16:40
EzekielCain EzekielCain is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

Phoenix: I'd written a reply before but not sure why it didn't post....

[MOD EDIT: Passage omitted for the same reason that your previous post was deleted; discussion of vendor stocklists contravenes the forum rules regarding source discussion.]

So there's obviously some shit going on, especially in light of that 18 year old kid who just recently smoked (supposedly) K2 and committed suicide. It was a yahoo top story yesterday, you could still probably find it. I believe he was in Florida. They need to make this stuff like alcohol: if you aren't 21, you CAN'T BUY IT.

So while there's going to be a crack-down on some compounds already out there, there's always going to be more sprouting up in it's place. They already know that it's impossible to control and schedule all of them for a ban...it just won't happen.

Get your favorites while you can.

Last edited by Phenoxide; 09-03-2011 at 17:49. Reason: source discussion
  #8  
Old 09-03-2011, 16:54
Terrapinzflyer Terrapinzflyer is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

Quote:
Originally Posted by EzekielCain View Post
They already know that it's impossible to control and schedule all of them for a ban...it just won't happen.

I would sadly beg to differ. It is entirely possible for them to pass a variant of the Analog Act law that would essentially ban any substance that gets one high- all they would need to do is change the analog act so that it requires "similar in structure or similar in effects rather then requiring both. And even if things are not taken to this extreme, what exactly is the alternative? Loosing 5, 10, 20 of the best substances at a time, then having 6 or 12 months with the next, and usually inferior, replacements?

Thee vendors and users who think they can always stay one step ahead are simply forcing them in this direction... It is hight time for people to step back and lick their wounds, keep this out of the public light, and give things time to blow over.

They may not be willing/able to kill the RC scene in one blow, but they can surely bleed it to death with multiple blows....
  #9  
Old 10-03-2011, 04:39
EzekielCain EzekielCain is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

Loopholes are wonderful for this very reason. It would be possible to circumvent a "wrapper" law like what you're explaining but in all reality it would be expensive and time-consuming not to mention the resources it would take to legally enforce a country wide ban on all RC's. Sure they could say "any substance similar or effect similar to..." but the truth of the matter lies within the synthesis itself. Yes, IF the critical blow is made there will be spells of inferior RC's (but since we're not the ones consuming them that's fine) but history will repeat itself, the RC's will get stronger and the next new one is on the drawing board in preparation for the next ban.

The truth of the matter is that the government, the DEA, the city council: NONE of them will be fast enough to stop the next thing from coming to fruition.

Now I'm NOT a chemist but I believe there are some pretty smart cookies out there who can get some things rockin' AND it would be well within the scope of the law. So while 5, 10, 20 substances are sure to get lost in the mix you have to consider the 20, 30 and 50 others that will sprout up in their place. And like in the past it'll take time to perfect...and we'll all gather up notes of our lab rats and sip some coffee while we compare them, just as we do today.

And Phen: My bad on the previous post; I wasn't trying to break any rules I just thought it worth noting those specific compounds weren't being offered, as well as the states that aren't being sold to any longer. Sorry!!
  #10  
Old 01-07-2011, 06:42
Freedom of Mind Freedom of Mind is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

As long as they are sold as research chemicals not intended for human consumption I think its legal. These companies who sell them as legal drugs and advertise them for their effects, then they might be crossing a legal boundry, also selling it on the same site somebody sells spice and other products meant as a legal alternative to illegal drugs might not be so bright. The chemicals themselves are legal and also need to be accessible for researchers who want to do legitimate research to see if it has potential beyond just a research chemical. Research chemical vendors who just sell pure chemicals are essential to the overall scientific advancement of a civilization. Trying to ban selling research chemicals is the same as trying to ban science, only something a backwards society would attempt.
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Old 01-07-2011, 13:39
Shampoo Shampoo is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

Quote:
Originally Posted by EzekielCain View Post
Loopholes are wonderful for this very reason. It would be possible to circumvent a "wrapper" law like what you're explaining but in all reality it would be expensive and time-consuming not to mention the resources it would take to legally enforce a country wide ban on all RC's. Sure they could say "any substance similar or effect similar to..." but the truth of the matter lies within the synthesis itself. Yes, IF the critical blow is made there will be spells of inferior RC's (but since we're not the ones consuming them that's fine) but history will repeat itself, the RC's will get stronger and the next new one is on the drawing board in preparation for the next ban.
I think you missed the point of the post to which you are responding. If the analogue act were changed to cover compounds "similar in structure OR effect" as opposed to the current "similar in structure and effect" then the only way to circumvent such a law would be to create an entirely new category of altered-states, which hasnt been achieved for hundreds, if not thousands, of years.
Quote:
Now I'm NOT a chemist but I believe there are some pretty smart cookies out there who can get some things rockin' AND it would be well within the scope of the law. So while 5, 10, 20 substances are sure to get lost in the mix you have to consider the 20, 30 and 50 others that will sprout up in their place. And like in the past it'll take time to perfect...and we'll all gather up notes of our lab rats and sip some coffee while we compare them, just as we do today.
Again, I think the above post by Terrapinzflyer addressed this point. There have been dozens and dozens of MDMA-analogues in an attempt to replace the substance post-scheduling: has a single one been able to reliably mimic or surpass the quality of effects and lack of major side-effects? By and large, no.

And moreover, you have to remember that these compounds are not being synthesized by any "smart cookies" with the intention of making them recreational drugs. The RC scene is a product of semi-intelligent literature digging. A quick dig through the literature provides hundreds and thousands of potential compounds which act in a similar pharmacological manner as those which have been scheduled already. Anyone with even an undergraduate degree in pharmacology can decipher scientific literature and determine what compounds have potential for recreational abuse. There are several thousand cannabinoids in the literature which have not even been touched- it will be quite a while before we see any "smart cookies" who go out of their way to actually create new substances for recreational abuse.
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Old 01-07-2011, 14:31
Seaquake Gold member Seaquake is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

freedom_of_mind legitimate research institutions don't need to buy their chemicals from a website that says the substances are "Not for human consumption", they either make them themselves or get them from a proper supplier who don't need that sort of warning on their wares.
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Old 01-07-2011, 16:16
Phenoxide Phenoxide is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

Quote:
As long as they are sold as research chemicals not intended for human consumption I think its legal.
The whole hiding behind 'Not for Human Consumption' tag has always led to a farcical overconfidence by some vendors in thinking that they are legally bulletproof. Federal cases really don't need much of anything to demonstrate intent for consumption as we found out during Web Tryp. In some cases just a transaction with a person with a drug-referencing e-mail address was taken to be sufficient proof. There's any number of other ways they could nail a case quite easily. Generally they've had a harder time in years past proving that the chemicals being sold were structural analogues of a scheduled substance, but I think the explosion of awareness of designer drugs in the US only serves to strengthen their cases for analogue law enforcement.

If you compare the way legitimate chemical houses such as Sigma-Aldrich operate and manage documentation on their customers to the way RC vendors do it becomes obvious to everyone how illegitimate the business is. Jurors are sympathetic to the DEA position and tend to believe their version of events over that of, let's face it, what the whole world and its mother can see is just drug dealing by proxy. It's a risky business.

Quote:
The chemicals themselves are legal and also need to be accessible for researchers who want to do legitimate research to see if it has potential beyond just a research chemical.
And I'm sure they are. The synthesis routes are generally in the public domain, a number of legitimate chemical suppliers stock a whole range of psychoactive substances, both uncontrolled and controlled for research use. I'm sure if legitimate researchers want to investigate a Nichols lab compound for example that they could also simply contact him, discuss their research and he'd send them some to test out. Legitimate research aren't buying these unregulated chemicals from backwater vendors because they are generally well below par in terms of purity for research purposes.

Quote:
Trying to ban selling research chemicals is the same as trying to ban science, only something a backwards society would attempt.
I totally disagree. I think it's a backwards society that controls and prohibits drugs that are relatively well characterized and of low harm potential, but allows an industry of entirely untested and unregulated drugs to flourish. That's a ridiculous double standard if the law exists to protect the individual and the society.

Controlled substance status doesn't hold back science much at all either. If an illicit substance is of genuine interest then legitimate researchers will apply for the licenses to work with them. The cream will always rise to the top regardless of regulatory status, which is probably why cannabis and its constituent parts, LSD, MDMA and psilocybin are all currently being heavily researched for therapeutic potential.

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concise and strong arguments

Last edited by Phenoxide; 20-07-2011 at 11:37.
  #14  
Old 01-07-2011, 16:23
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

I hope this is not to far off the thread point, I was reading some replies and it seems that it is not.

They have an "epidemic" because of mephedrone and now are looking for ways to stop it from being sold. However the thing that gets me is how ephedrine was banned in the U.S. and it's only because of people who did not know how to use it safely that people like myself cannot buy it anymore. From what research I have done into this, mephedrone has caused more deaths because of the lack of knowledge and care people had when using it than ephedrine even got close to. It was the high profile (sports athletes, military, poloticians, ect....) people who got ephedrine banned. So there is a substance that people think "not for human consumption" means it's okay, and keeps getting a bad rep, while the other one cannot be bought at the store anymore.

Sorry for the ramble, I miss my ephedrine and don't even have a place to buy mephedrone.
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Old 01-07-2011, 16:36
Freedom of Mind Freedom of Mind is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

Quote:
Originally Posted by trdofbeingtrd View Post
I hope this is not to far off the thread point, I was reading some replies and it seems that it is not.

They have an "epidemic" because of mephedrone and now are looking for ways to stop it from being sold. However the thing that gets me is how ephedrine was banned in the U.S. and it's only because of people who did not know how to use it safely that people like myself cannot buy it anymore. From what research I have done into this, mephedrone has caused more deaths because of the lack of knowledge and care people had when using it than ephedrine even got close to. It was the high profile (sports athletes, military, poloticians, ect....) people who got ephedrine banned. So there is a substance that people think "not for human consumption" means it's okay, and keeps getting a bad rep, while the other one cannot be bought at the store anymore.

Sorry for the ramble, I miss my ephedrine and don't even have a place to buy mephedrone.
Pretty sure ephedrine was banned because it was being used to make methamphetamine.
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Old 01-07-2011, 16:54
kailey_elise Gold member kailey_elise is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

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Originally Posted by Freedom of Mind View Post
Pretty sure ephedrine was banned because it was being used to make methamphetamine.
Not quite; people were having problems (with the liver, iirc) from ephedra/ephedrine in "body-building supplements" and "weight loss supplements".

However, ephedra & ephedrine are NOT banned in the United States; they are prohibited from being added to dietary supplements.

I can go to the herbal store down the street (I live in an area associated with witches/witchcraft/Wicca, so these stores are quite common) & purchase a few different types of ephedra (Mormon Tea & Ma Huang, at the very least).

Additionally, ephedrine is available to treat asthma, it is behind the counter of any pharmacy.

Basically, they can't sell "EC/ECA Stacks" anymore, but you can purchase ephedrine tablets (Bronkaid or Primatene tablets) and caffeine tablets & ingest them simultaneous & create the same effects.

Of course, yes, they can also be used to manufacture methamphetamine.
*****

On-topic, I think reselling RCs to people, even if not in capsule form and labeled "not for human consumption" is a very very dark grey area. I certainly wouldn't risk it. And as stated, there could be NO communication WHATSOEVER in, say, your computer or cell phone that hints that they could/should/will be used as psychoactives - including visiting websites like this. Also, it would be easy for them to make a case that they're being used as drugs, as I'm sure the people purchasing them don't have labs - if they did, they could order purer samples from legit chemical houses. And legit research surely would use more product than end users typically purchase at a time.

"Bath salts" & "plant feeder" are NOT going to hold up - especially when there's no research at all as to how these chemicals are helpful to plants (which they probably aren't; if mixed with water & placed in a houseplant's soil it would probably kill them).

Just a reminder again for people: THESE ARE *NOT* LEGAL SUBSTANCES! If there's any inkling that they are intended for human consumption in some manner, they are illegal. In a gelcap? Illegal. On a blotter? Illegal. These are not consequence-free chemicals across the board. And it's people treating them like they are & advertising them everywhere, etc etc that's causing so much attention to be brought to them, which is what's going to be their downfall. No one cared when you could only get them through quasi-obscure websites...

Also, selling/giving people something as a drug (even if it's soap bits you said were crack), gets you the same penalties as ACTUALLY selling the drug. So, selling someone an RC as "Ecstasy" gets you the same charge as actually selling MDMA; even telling someone it's like Ecstasy/cocaine/methamphetamine could be a BIIIIIG problem, esp if the buyer remembered it as you telling them "it's cocaine" or whatever & says so to the cops...

~Kailey
  #17  
Old 01-07-2011, 17:03
trdofbeingtrd trdofbeingtrd is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Freedom of Mind View Post
Pretty sure ephedrine was banned because it was being used to make methamphetamine.
It was banned because of health reasons, the "official" reason could have been said because it was used to make mathamphetamine, that was happening WAY before all the athletes, military, and teens started dying left and right. It was only then that it was actually banned. Kailey, I know you know your stuff, so I will take your word for it, but I cannot find ephedrine in anything, even in a pharmacy now. Bums me out because I would get it and use it for therapeutic reasons, not just to get high.
  #18  
Old 20-07-2011, 08:44
Freedom of Mind Freedom of Mind is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phenoxide View Post
The whole hiding behind 'Not for Human Consumption' tag has always been always led to a farcical overconfidence by some vendors that they are legally bulletproof. Federal cases really don't need much of anything to demonstrate intent for consumption as we found out during Web Tryp. In some cases just a transaction with a person with a drug-referencing e-mail address was taken to be sufficient proof. There's any number of other ways they could nail a case quite easily. Generally they've had a harder time in years past proving that the chemicals being sold were structural analogues of a scheduled substance, but I think the explosion of awareness of designer drugs in the US only serves to strengthen their cases for analogue law enforcement.

If you compare the way legitimate chemical houses such as Sigma-Aldrich operate and manage documentation on their customers to the way RC vendors do it becomes obvious to everyone how illegitimate the business is. Jurors are sympathetic to the DEA position and tend to believe their version of events over that of, let's face it, what the whole world and its mother can see is just drug dealing by proxy. It's a risky business.
While the DEA can break the law to try preventing a legal substance from being sold and arrest someone who has broken no laws, then try to manipulate the jury into thinking the DEA's actions were just, the same could be said of almost any business owner breaking the law if they get on a law enforcement agencies bad side without actually breaking any laws.
  #19  
Old 20-07-2011, 09:32
EscapeDummy EscapeDummy is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Freedom of Mind View Post
While the DEA can break the law to try preventing a legal substance from being sold and arrest someone who has broken no laws, then try to manipulate the jury into thinking the DEA's actions were just, the same could be said of almost any business owner breaking the law if they get on a law enforcement agencies bad side without actually breaking any laws.
What's the point you're trying to make? Sure, but the pertinent business in this case is the RC business, and the DEA tends to get what it wants, whether that includes employing scientists who falsify data like George Ricaurte, or incarcerating people like operation web tryp.

Also, I read Terrapinz's link about web tryp on DF. Wow, a lot of deaths. I was wondering, is it possible that some of these guys were nipped because they weren't paying their taxes, or enough taxes? It says one of the vendors was making around $20,000 per week; thats a million a year, if they were paying heavy taxes to the govt is it possible they wouldn't have fallen? Also, it says one vendor was distributing to US Navy personnel... sounds like a stupid move to me.

Last edited by EscapeDummy; 20-07-2011 at 09:48.
  #20  
Old 21-07-2011, 02:44
Thirdedge Thirdedge is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

From: http://anonym.to/?http://www.deadive.../21usc/811.htm

Section 811. Authority and Criteria for Classification of Substances:

(3) The Attorney General may, by regulation, exempt any compound, mixture, or preparation containing a controlled substance from the application of all or any part of this subchapter if he finds such compound, mixture, or preparation meets the requirements of one of the following categories:

B) A compound, mixture, or preparation which contains any controlled substance, which is not for administration to a human being or animal, and which is packaged in such form or concentration, or with adulterants or denaturants, so that as packaged it does not present any significant potential for abuse.

The above is about controlled substances (an analogue is a controlled substance btw) and gives an example of the type of packaging that would be required to prove a substance was not for human consumption.

I am positive a vial of white powder sold in a headshop would fail to be believed to not be for consumption. Libocaine, Caffiene, Creatine etc would not be considered as adulterants or denaturants preventing abuse potential.

Last edited by Thirdedge; 21-07-2011 at 02:57. Reason: anyonomize link
  #21  
Old 27-10-2011, 08:42
Krellogg Krellogg is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

A colleague of mine shared some refreshing information regarding this topic the other day at lunch, however it was not 100% reassuring. He told stories of his travels to Detroit...Chicago...New York...and a few other major cities. In the stories he made note of certain people who were caught at said locations during festivals or concerts with random assortments of research chemicals, from mxe to methylone to the 2c series. One in particular was even booked into the drunk tank with capsules of methylone on him. While most were smart about telling LEO of the actual contents or what was being sold, others were less careful saying they were distributing certain drugs. However, after testing of each substance in each story, every individual was released with the charges being dropped.

Yes, this story isn't 100% relevant to forum users either, as this is a situation regarding street smuggling, whereas the internet is a larger domain likely causing a stronger stir of the shit pot's contents.
  #22  
Old 03-10-2012, 22:21
Quijibo Quijibo is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

I live in south Florida so I understand the question, but that doesn't change that fact that whoever this guy is he's breaking the law in a profoundly stupid way. In Florida UR-144 can be legaly bought right down the street from me as a bonsai tree fertilizer. The owner of the store who happens to be a long time friend of mine has shown me lab reports and research papers he has written himself to constitute UR-144 being sold as an effective bonsai fertilizer. In Florida it's particularly difficult to get away with selling RC's because the cops will find a way to prosecute even if they have to lie and "produce evidence. It's not a matter of legality regarding most substances in Florida, it's a matter of whether or not you can back up your bullshit. Obviously this guy mentioned in the initial post is selling controlled substances so that would be a pretty bad example. I can go to the classifieds section of my newspaper and find atleast a dozen examples of "vendors" just like this guy, the difference is their not stupid enough to list schedule 1 substances in their stock. So no selling RC's is not illegal in Florida anymore so than any other state, you just have to do a little reading (there are many links to the neccesary research just on this page) and make sure your not involving yourself in distributing illegal substances.
  #23  
Old 03-10-2012, 23:02
profesor profesor is offline
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Re: Is it legal for someone to sell research chemicals?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quijibo View Post
the difference is their not stupid enough to list schedule 1 substances in their stock. So no selling RC's is not illegal in Florida anymore so than any other state, you just have to do a little reading (there are many links to the neccesary research just on this page) and make sure your not involving yourself in distributing illegal substances.
UR-144 is not a Schedule I substance, by the way. I'm not sure if that is clear in your post.
I'd also add that from Operation Logjam it seems it doesn't matter if substances are actually legal or not, law enforcement will still try to harass vendors.

Last edited by profesor; 03-10-2012 at 23:11.

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