Dealing with apprehension over DMT use

[freemynd]

Ok, first let me give you a little background about SWIM. SWIM has been overly obsessed with DMT for quite some time now (its almost scary.). He has spent hundreds and hundreds of hours online and in textbooks reading about it’s effects and the experiences that people have while doing it. SWIM also studies quantum physics/mechanics and is interested in the whole “mind” subject. This is what got him into DMT.

Finally after months of trying to acquire it, he broke down and extracted his own. By following TEKs to the tee his extraction came out perfectly and he was left with lots of DMT goodies.

Now comes d-day, time to experience it. First off, let me just say – SWIM has never really smoked anything – not even cigarettes. And he is not doing this to get “high” but to try to understand the fundamentals of the inner workings of the universe. SWIM had 2 friends over for a session and he wanted to go last. His first friend did it (having no prior knowledge to the substance) and had a terrible experience – the entities were laughing at her very deviously and she came back crying. Then his girlfriend tried it and had the time of her life. She went to a place that could only be described as “Santa’s workshop”. Now it was SWIM’s turn. He put the pipe to his lips (which he was VERY uncomfortable doing) and took a hit. The smoke was so harsh he couldn’t really hold anything in. He took another, and another. He started feeling fuzzy and got some SLIGHT effects (perfect symmetry forming, ect) but never “broke through”. He was very uncomfortable afterwards.

Ever since that night he has wanted to try it again but just CANNOT get over the fears of the paraphernalia involved. He also would feel more comfortable if he were doing it alone but I know that is strongly advised against. He is extremely uncomfortable and would like to make the next session a better experience.

Is SWIM just psyching himself out? How can he overcome this fear? What will make this easier for him? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. This is something that SWIM DOES NOT want to miss out on. Thanks!

Reputation Comments on this post:

great question.

[Nagognog2]

Buy SWIM a big, cheap cigar. Have SWIM light that hog up and toke and inhale and hold it in. After SWIM is through puking his guts and liver out - he'll be ready to smoke his DMT. Gladly!

Other than that, there are other routes of ingestion. Such as taking a MAOI and swallowing same. Some Native people have employed Virola powder rectally. Umm....just wait until SWIM chills out about smoking it if these don't appeal to him.

[Beeker]

Originally Posted by Nagognog2

Some Native people have employed Virola powder rectally.

Strange, I didn't know Natives lurked the Bluelight forums..

[Beeker]

all this philosophy bashing If I know one thing, it's that I don't know nuthin!

SWIM's got DMT theories up the wazzo that I'll post for him to see if they hold up to the debate of people who know the know of Someone they met once..

I'll go ahead and kill all the ones that align to well with McKenna or Ott or whoever..

Ever read so much that you can't help but be influenced in your own work?

[daeron]

um....NO do not smoke a cig for fucks sake. swim here has smoked a lot of shit in is dumb life, but a cigar or a cigarette even will send swim puking around. nicotine is for pussies. but lets get back to the topic:
Maybe a better solution is, having in mind that youre a physics student, that you construct a working dmt pipe, something like a sealed vial with a longer exit straw, or a hose that will be used to cool the smoke in a second bigger jar(can use water in it as long as the hose isnt submersed in it).

smoking nag, sheesh shame on you! (swims a hardcore antismoker)

Reputation Comments on this post:

good looking out as always

[psychedelaholic]

You could get some MAOIs either buy buying pure Harmine/harmaline and putting it in a capsule (I've seen a few vendors offering it), extract it yourself from peganum harmala seeds or banisteriopsis caapi, or simply brew up one of the afore mentioned plants in some acidified water and drink. Consume the MAOI followed a half hour later with a capsule of DMT. Not entirely sure of the oral dosage but I think 20 or 30mg would be enough.

If you go the pharma huasca way i.e. getting/extracting pure harmine or whatever and combining it with the DMT then you can can repeating the dose of DMT every 3 hours or so for a really long trip. Redosing of the MAOIs isn't needed unless you want the trip to go of for days.

You probably already have if you are obsessed with DMT, but if you haven't make sure you look up the drugs and foods you cannot combine with MAOIs if you decide to try that method.

[freemynd]

Yeah, SWIM was actually considering taking it in pill form with an MAOI, he just hasn't done enough research on MAOIs to know what's good and what's bad. But it seems like it's going to be the only way for him to experience this. *******
EDITED BY MARSOFOLD. NO REQUESTS FOR SOURCES IS ALLOWED HERE.

[triptonaut]

Swims friends also has this problem, and he does cigarettes. He just CANNOT inhale that bloddy harsh smoke. It's between the ears if you ask me. Just do it.

You also said 'you took another, and another'. If you just pull - inhale deeply - hold for 10 seconds - pull - inhale deeply - hold for 10 seconds - pull inhael deeply and hold for ten seconds, you should be in dmt-land by then.

[raven3davis]

There are two kinds of people in the world, those who can handle DMT smoke, and those who cant! haha not really but in SWIMs experience it sure does seem like it. Some people just cant seem to handle the smoke. Did you clean the DMT with ammonium hydroxide or by some other method? If not you may still have some NaOH left in the DMT which can cause the smoke to be much more harsh. If you didnt clean the DMT then cleaning the DMT might be the solution.

Now, if you didnt clean the dmt. SWIM has heard that sandwiching the DMT between two layers of parsley in a pipe makes the smoke less harsh. Hope this helps. DMT is a wonderous drug and SWIM has had many life changing experiences. The first experience was one of pure terror and fear followed by acceptance and astonishment. SWIM has experienced anthing from pure bliss to chemical terror and everything inbetween. The entities have loved him and also screamed at him in fury. You have to get over the fear. It only lasts a few minutes. It will be over soon enough if you arent having a good trip. SWIM recommends to finda way to smoke it because oral DMT + an maoi is going to last a hell of a lot longer. If you start to have a bad trip you will have a long way to go.

[freemynd]

Hey, thanks for the info! Yeah, SWIM did wash it and it came out almost pure white, so that's a good sign! Yeah, he was planning on using the parsley trick but does not have the right equipment for that, and he's broke. Unfortunely the parsley trick won't work with a glass pipe. He is going to give it another try Thur. Any other suggestions before he starts? He was planning on meditating for about 30 mins before, so he can clear his mind.

[raven3davis]

SWIM does a bit of meditation before, never 30 minutes though. He just closes his eyes for a bit until he is calm and ready for anything. You can meditate for any amount of time, whatever is most comftorable for you. Just make sure you are in a comftorable setting and you wont have anything to distract you. The setting is important and so is your mind set. Dont be nervous but brace yourself. No matter how much you have read about DMT nothing can prepare you for a true breakthrough experience....NOTHING. SWIM was an experienced tripper and had taken various kinds of psychadelics before DMT but dmt is by far the top dog tryptamine. The experience was a combonation of nothing swim wanted, everything swim wanted, nothing swim expected and everything swim expected. Just be ready for it and respect it. Once you feel adaquetly prepared take your hits. Hold them in and be ready to immedietly take another pull. SWIM hopes you enjoy the divine moment of truth. Your intentions interest SWIM and he hopes you find what your are looking for! Congradulations on the extraction! Peace out man be sure to contribute to the thread called nnDMT experiences.

[xpr´k]

Originally Posted by HotMonkeyAC

And he is not doing this to get “high” but to try to understand the fundamentals of the inner workings of the univers!

One of the reason i wanna try DMT is just the opposite really.
I think all this other reality, different dimensions talk is a big pile'O'hippiepoo.
Your taking substances that have a significant impact on how your brain processes stimuli. To attribute that to other dimensions and otherworldly experiences seems insane to me.
Just look at what your grey mass can do to you without any drugs. Falling in love, vivid dreams, euphoria, depression, etc, etc
Its so typical of men to try and explain things with a another big unknown instead of taking a sensible analytical approach.
Of course I got no rite claiming this because i got no experience with psychedelics .
I'm just curious if my current view would hold up after a live test .

[freemynd]

Originally Posted by xpr´k

One of the reason i wanna try DMT is just the opposite really.
I think all this other reality, different dimensions talk is a big pile'O'hippiepoo.
Your taking substances that have a significant impact on how your brain processes stimuli. To attribute that to other dimensions and otherworldly experiences seems insane to me.
Just look at what your grey mass can do to you without any drugs. Falling in love, vivid dreams, euphoria, depression, etc, etc
Its so typical of men to try and explain things with a another big unknown instead of taking a sensible analytical approach.
Of course I got no rite claiming this because i got no experience with psychedelics .
I'm just curious if my current view would hold up after a live test .

You mention dreaming, well several people suggest that endogenous DMT is produced in the human brain and is responsible for certain phychological and neurological states, such as dreaming or near death experiences. Also, following any laws of QM (or just an idealist's point of view) one might believe that the material world only exists because of the images we've come to know in our minds. If that's the case, DMT is simply a tool that allows us to use another area of our brain, which, in turn, changes our entire surroundings. This could be part of the reason people have such similar experiences (my opinion). Either way, I think it's a fascinating subject that ties in perfectly with everything I follow (Buddhism, Quantum Mechanics, Metaphysics of Philosophy, ect).

PS. I'm not a hippie!!

[xpr´k]

Originally Posted by HotMonkeyAC

PS. I'm not a hippie!!

wouldnt look down on you even if you were .
I kept my theory as short an gerenal as i could. The hippie remark is just my humour kicking in, people who know me know i can say really crude things sometimes but i got the best interest at heart for most people and i'm usually one of the last to judge. I just watched to much britisch sitcoms when i was little

[raven3davis]

Originally Posted by xpr´k

wouldnt look down on you even if you were .
I kept my theory as short an gerenal as i could. The hippie remark is just my humour kicking in, people who know me know i can say really crude things sometimes but i got the best interest at heart for most people and i'm usually one of the last to judge. I just watched to much britisch sitcoms when i was little

hehe it is all good friend! It really doesnt matter what you think of DMT, but it definitely has the ability to drastically change the way you think about some aspects of life.

[raven3davis]

You would just have to try it He doesnt seem to be talking about the different dimensions pile-o though. He seemed to be concentrating more on a quantum mechanics approach trying to figure out the innerworkings of the universe. SWIM never once heard him talk about different dimensions or another reality. He also says he is interested in the mind so he is probably taking a psychological approach also. Either way SWIM isnt too quuck to shut down other peoples theories. The angle you are taking on this seems self fufulling.

DMT really isnt about what others think. SWIM will have his own opinion about DMT which is rather meaningless to anyone else. DMT isnt always about different worlds and all this mumbo jumbo. Sure DMT has a significant impact on how your brain produces stimuli but there is much more to it that just "what it does."

Its all about what you do with what DMT tells you. You can just trip and think nothing of it and thats fine. Maybe it will change you, maybe it wont. SWIM took the complete opposite path. He let DMT ammuse him and teach him. Weather he was in another dimension or not, it really doesnt matter. Dont get my wrong, SWIM is interested in all the neurological actions behind DMT but there is a limited amount we can ever know about something as comlex as this.

SWIM KNOWS that DMT is a powerfull hallucinogen that strongly effected him. That is about all he can say about it. It will effect everyone differently but if you can get a few nice hits of DMT in a short amount of time you will be GONE. Now how you interpret the trip is completely up to you. This might be just what your looking HotmonkeyAC, or mayne not at all. You might come to many conclusions about the world, yourself and your interaction with others in the world, you might be able to relate your quantum mechanics studies to the trp, or possibly neither.

The best of luck to you. May you find what your looking more, and some, with a cherry on top.

[raven3davis]

Very true reality is just what you make of it. Our material world is made completely of symbols, and our ability to communicate depends on our ability to send and interpret different symbols. Objects hold no meaning. Be prepared to kiss our material world good-bye as soon as you are done with your third hit.

DMT can be used as a tool to help to view the world from a viewpoint other than your own. This is the fundamental thing that you must realize......every human being is going to have a completely different view of everything. Reality is in the palm of your hand. Pull the trigger and your gone, your reality will be possibly shut down. Your reality is completely different than someone elses depending on previous events in your life that enable you to have different interpretations of your reality.

The whole concept of I i just something we have made up to represent ourselves. You experience things as they are to YOU and nothing else. Reality is as you wish. The human mind is a highly complicated object that no human will ever fully understand. No matter how much research is done on the brain, and on different drugs, we will never know exactly the inner workings of some of these phenomenon.

DMT will completely change your surroundings and put you in an alien world where nothing has the meaning that it used to. Your brain will probably try to make sence of the chaos too, and try to make sence of what is going on by creating symbols that our minds are enable to interpret. DMT has showed swim exactly what he cannot use words to describe. DMT in fact is mearly a symbol we have created to represent dimethyltraptamine, a powerful hallucinogen in the tryptamine class.

Your intentions with DMT seem just as legitimate as anyone elses. DMT showed SWIM exactly what he wanted to know and more. SWIMS dream world has become much more interesting too. He notices his ability to remember his dreams has increased and that the level of arousment in his sleep has heightened. SWIM is aware of a completely different world than he was before his DMT use.

SWIM likes your ideas, hotmonkey. Five minutes in the DMT world can teach you something that you wouldnt have dreamt of learning in a thousand years.

May your studies lead you in the same direction they have SWIM...to a world where reality is in your fingertips. We are capablle of human beings to come together, and destroy the world, or to make peace with our selves and our surroundings.

Please dont be too quick to call this hippy dmt crap a bunch of bull. EVERYTHING IS BULL. NOTHING IS TRUE. I wish you the best my friend and may DMT show you the light. DMT has truly showed SWIM the light and portrayed to him the most pure sence of acceptance love and inner peace. May you figure the workings of the universe! The sky is the limit. You interests do move swim though please feel free to discuss your theories more with SWIM and with others too. Some may think its bull but it doesnt really matter what anyone thinks about ANYTHING execpt yourself. In the end it isnt going to matter what joe sittin next to you thinks about DMT that matters. You will be able to form your own hypothesis and beliefs about the world from your DMT trips and no one else will. You can make it to be everything, or nothing, but I SWIM as a human being do feel that all humans could benefit from exporuse to DMT.

DMT took swim to a place that felt like home when a world of symbols did not accept him. DMT shouldnt be used as an ecape but in a sence it is a temporary escape from our world. You can interpret your dmt trip however you please but SWIM is sure you will be able to utalize your trip to help you understand yourself and the world around you much more. PLEASE pm swim with experiences if you want he would be thrilled to hear how your dmt trips end up going.

good luck friend.......dmt will only teach you as much as you are willing to let it. SWIM hopes you find what you are looking for in your studies. You have come to a great place to share your experiences swim is always open ears to new dmt experiences. it is the one magical chemical in swims life he will never forget her. its like a love story......dmt gave SWIM everything he could ever imagine, beauty, explination, peace... dmt was the love of swims life. DMT explained everything to him but then again left him hanging. We will never really know as much as we want to about anything. There is only so much the mind is capable of. Until further evolution.....who knows what we will be able to do, just leave anything open as a possibility.

Reputation Comments on this post:

very knowledgeble and helpfull in this thread

[xpr´k]

Originally Posted by raven3davis

DMT can be used as a tool to help to view the world from a viewpoint other than your own. This is the fundamental thing that you must realize......every human being is going to have a completely different view of everything. Reality is in the palm of your hand. Pull the trigger and your gone, your reality will be possibly shut down. Your reality is completely different than someone elses depending on previous events in your life that enable you to have different interpretations of your reality.

Which is exactly why DMT has sparked my interest despite my inherant fear of psychedelics. Ive never tripped before, my viewpoints on the matter are purely hypothetical.
I just extend on how i feel people seem to handle the unknown and mysterious which led me to my current sober outlook on some these wild claims psychaunouts have made.
I'm just really curious if something like DMT would change that and how i would try and explain it all. There's no denying some aspect this drugs are very puzzling (like the similar trip experiences).
Would make for a nice project to have a sceptical bastard like myself try it

[raven3davis]

SWIM hopes to one day make a vault of things that portray who he was and how he lived. hopefully others can experience life in its fullest form so that they can stand at a viewpoint above everything and look at the world from on of the infinite viewpoints other than our own. In 200 years swim will be long gone, but hopefully his legacy will live on through others. Share what you can because when you are gone you are gone. Other SWIMs will surely come to the same conclusions as us......blah blah and the motha fucking cycle goes one. well i guess thats what it is, just one big cycle and we are but an insignificant grain in an endless ocean in comparison to the universe. your studies are really meaninless in comparison to everything.

SWIM has studied many subjects in his neinty or so years here! history, pyschology, pharmacology, sociloogy, mycology, biology its best to know a bit of everything. that way you are knowledgable and able to dicuss the matter from several different points of view. You can start with the most simple forms of life and work your way up and then identify how all these different forms of life work together and against each other.....ohh man your really arousing swim dont even get him started on some of this. peace

[freemynd]

Yes indeed, the world as we know it is far from anything we THOUGHT we knew. Raven, you've been a huge help in SWIM's prep. The next step is to leave this world (or part of the brain) and go to another world (or another part of the brain). This will be soon. It's all ready to go, SWIM just needs to wait for the right day. It sounds like SWIM has a lot in common with you. He looks forward to sharing his experiences with you! Hope to talk to you soon! In the meantime, check out this DMTish video - http://www.mikeisgod.com/movies/flashbackplay.asp (I'm sure you've seen it, but it's cool!)

[Voices]

Originally Posted by HotMonkeyAC

He started feeling fuzzy and got some SLIGHT effects (perfect symmetry forming, ect) but never “broke through”. He was very uncomfortable afterwards.

Ever since that night he has wanted to try it again but just CANNOT get over the fears of the paraphernalia involved. He also would feel more comfortable if he were doing it alone but I know that is strongly advised against. He is extremely uncomfortable and would like to make the next session a better experience.

Is SWIM just psyching himself out? How can he overcome this fear? What will make this easier for him? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. This is something that SWIM DOES NOT want to miss out on. Thanks!

Swim has noted that when he smokes too little, and only gets threshhold effects, that the experience is a little bit uncomfortable. The first time swim smoked DMT this happened to him and it did make him think twice about continuing to persue DMT. He thought that if that strange discomfort increased with the dose/effects, it could be hellish.

Anyway, Swim found that taking some codeine or poppy tea or something helps. One, it helps the anxiety and helps you relax into the experience. Two, it helps relax the cough reflex, remember that otc cough medications used to contain codeine.

[freemynd]

What about taking something like valume (sp) - or some type of relaxing meditcation? Maybe this would be helpful for getting so nervous? Aslo, are there any dangers doing so?

[Voices]

^^^Swim could not say for sure, as swim has never used valium in combination with anything. Swim was under the impression that some folks use valium to abort rough experiences. If that's the case then valium may detract from what you're trying to achieve. Swim only knows opium worked GREAT.

[kemistudent]

I think everyone is a little taken by DMT when they first use it. It is like no other. It comes at you so fast and hard it is mind blowing to try and comprehend it. After you know what to expect, it's not as shocking, but every once and a while... hehehe, a little too much was put in SWIY's pipe and WHOOOPIE! I think I finally did it!! I.. am going to die.. or am I? Maybe I will be like this forever!?!?

Ahh, one too many times over here. Even though big doses scare the shit out of ya, you still end up enjoying the last 5 minutes.

[Beeker]

The first time SWIM did DMT he went at it with years of SWIM doing heavy mushroom trips as well as LSD. He was fooled into thinking that it would be some 5 minute or so mushroom trip.

SWIM took the hits and BAM the world I knew was gone and in it's place was some sort of being showing him how to build an impossible hyper dimentional object and it all had a purpoose to SWIM it seemed as if he was someplace not only very important but inhabited by beings that found him to be the most interesting thing to pop into their world.

Then it faded back SWIM opened his eyes to see a room where the wall on the left was GONE, he letteral saw it was GONE and he could see the cars on the street below as well as other strong visuals like a candle flame spread out into a 3D pattern of morphing bits of some sort of unsensed energy source that was beyond just the chemical reaction of the flame and wax.

then it was gone.

All swim could do was look at my friend and said, "I..That.. not possible.. no words." he laughed and said don't bother trying to put language to it.

The only fear SWIM got for the experence was that he had believed he had seen it all and he was so wrong.