How do Effects of Amanitas Compare to Psiloc(yb)in Mushrooms?

[Richard_smoker]

Always wondered why so many shops sell the Amanita muscarina variety of "magic mushroom."

I learned in college that these were toxic (not in the 'hint, hint' they're toxic bro', get it!? they make you trip balls!)

No, I distinctly remember that these were discussed in detail as being toxic in the sense that they have deadly alkaloids and muscarinic agonists (i.e. mustard gas is a muscarinic agonist). they were popularized in european cultural kid's stories like alison in wonderland. (red with white dots on caps)

Will someone clarify to me what the desired effects are from ingesting this species... I'm finding mixed results on the searches I've done. Too bad we can't all synchronize our suppliers and report on which dried products have what effects/sides.

Am i just confused? am I making this more complicated than it needs to be?

[Richard_smoker]

Seriously, I wanted to know the answer to this question.

I know that the amanita are WAY easier to come across (legally), but the toxicity and possible permanent ill-effects are at stake right??

someone please set me straight, before SWIM eats a bag of "free trial" amanita muscaris that was sent to him free with some kratom last month!

[Phungushead]

Amanitas are not like psilocybin mushrooms at all... and a major detail that
most people who use them notice is that every experience can vary
drastically in effects - one time you might have a good experience, the
next may not be so good. There are a lot of people who do not like the
effects of amanita at all.

Effects of Amanita Muscaria:

POSITIVE

• euphoria: feelings of peace and well being
• marked analgesia (pain relief)
• physical relaxation / dream state: (during the sedative effects) can be highly detailed, colorful, and have a great sense of clarity and lucidity. Some people describe these as being similar to Lucid Dreaming. Some describe them as Out of Body Experiences (OOBEs). As with normal dreams, the Amanita Dream State can consist of a wide variety of experiences.
• internal dialogue: some people report a strong sense of an internal discussion, a feeling of being able to think through personal issues. Others report a significant reduction of internal dialogue, sense of peacefulness, and internal quiet.
• synesthesia: is somewhat common, smelling words, tasting colors, etc.
• clarity: Often no interference with memory or logic: many report strong "clarity of thought" and "stillness of mind". Others report mild to strong confusion.
• internal focus: Difficulty in focusing concentration on external tasks. Increased focus on internal imagination, imagery, day dreams.
• sociability: Group interaction can become incoherent: "conversational weirdness", frequent changes in topic, "non-linear conversations"
• sexual feelings: Some people report increased sexual feelings, others report very unsexual emotional and sensual distance / coldness.

NEUTRAL

• sedative or sleepy effects. others report excitation and extreme energy bursts.
• changes in body perception: effects may include dramatic shifts in body perception and motor skills including perceived changes in size of body parts, increased strength, dizziness, clumsiness, change in proprioception.
• slightly blurred vision, watery eyes, runny nose.
• loss of Equilibrium
• pupil dilation, glassy eyed stare

NEGATIVE

• Mild to moderate to extreme nausea or stomach discomfort/cramps, increases with dosage.
• muscle twitching and trembling (not convulsions)
• increased salivation and perspiration.

-(erowid)

[Richard_smoker]

Thanks phungus. SWIM got some of this stuff for free, and he has been too scared to even look at!

Funny how different reality can be from what you're taught by scientists who write scientific texts!

[Alfa]

From magic-mushrooms.net:

The (red with white dots) Amanita Muscaria can cause a very unpleasent experience and health problems. Potential symptoms of Muscarine, an active alkaloid of Fly Agaric and other Amanita's, followed after ingestion as described by The Merck Index are: nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, headache and bronchospasm. With larger doses: acrimation, incontinence, bracycardia, hypotension and shock. Ibotanic acid, also an active substance of the Amanita's may cause brain damage as described by various authors on Public Medline. Muscimole is another active alkaloid in Amanita Muscaria. Its symptoms after oral intake are described by Richard Schultzes and Albert Hofmann as confusion, disoreantation in situation and time perception, disturbance of visual function and hearing, muscle twitching, weariness, fatigue and sleep. Psychic performance and learning are diminished. Jochem Gartz, a well known mushroom specialist warnes in his book 'Magic Mushrooms around the world' that Amatoxins contained in the Amanita's may be lethal!

Note: Amanita's in general is not the same as Amanita muscaria in specific. Amanita intoxications are responsible for 90% of the total mushroom deaths.
With amanita muscaria many experience drowsiness, dizzyness, sleep, nehanced mood, activity, tremors, agitation, misintrepretations, hallucinations. Ataxia(inability to co-ordinate muscles), difficulty to speak, headache, muscle spasms, hyperkinesia(An abnormal increase in muscular activity), vomiting, and euphoria may occur. Intoxications usually end in a deep sleep of 4-6 hours.

[Richard_smoker]

thank you Alpha,

seriously... I knew that something wasn't right. Luckily I didn't allow anyone I know or care about to INGEST those poisonous things!

thank you. that's what this community is for--clearing up misconceptions that are OFTEN-TIMES propagated by the very so-called ethnobotanical companies. thanks for telling me where this free bag of trash belongs and reminding me that 'free' usually equals 'sucks'.

[Bajeda]

Originally Posted by Richard_smoker

thank you Alpha,

seriously... I knew that something wasn't right. Luckily I didn't allow anyone I know or care about to INGEST those poisonous things!

thank you. that's what this community is for--clearing up misconceptions that are OFTEN-TIMES propagated by the very so-called ethnobotanical companies. thanks for telling me where this free bag of trash belongs and reminding me that 'free' usually equals 'sucks'.

I doubt you have the poisonous ones if someone gave them to you, unless someone really doesn't like you. There are many different types of Amanitas. Amanitas Muscaria is the commonly used psychoactive one. I can't vouch for liver problems and what not as I have limited experience with them, but I can assure you I didn't die after taking them.

[psyche]

Well I haven't studied amanitas for a long time, but as far as I see they are a bit harmful to liver in a way like alcohol, but they don't pose a serious thread to your healt if you don't do them on daily basis. And no deaths, or one, to my knowledge. Is this correct? It's more of a I-feel than I-know.

Yes, they act at a muscarinic Ach receptors, but not as antagonist. Still that acetylcholine activity always worries me a bit. As stated before, I haven't done a lot of research on this one.

SWIM could give them another shot this fall as they are extremely plentyful in these areas. Last year he got very mild effects if at all, smoking also caused little euforia but could be placebo. Swim first got intrigued when he read from erowid about these really mystical experiences with amanitas. Well, those are yet to come.

[Alfa]

Check out the Amanita mushrooms section of the file archive for many case studies about amanita intoxication. The liver toxicity of amanity should not be underestimated and goes beyond that of alcohol. A full overview of the exact dangers of amanita's would very welcome. I'd certainly hit such a post up with a major reputation bump.

[scyrusurcys]

Alfa - if Amanita Muscaria mushrooms are so toxic, why have they been used and worshiped for thousands of years?

[Forthesevenlakes]

Originally Posted by scyrusurcys

Alfa - if Amanita Muscaria mushrooms are so toxic, why have they been used and worshiped for thousands of years?

probably because the experience is so intense and shocking, possibly even frightening. amanitas and most other ritual hallucinogens (peyote and ayahuasca come to mind) are capable of producing profound changes in the reality of the user, and are not taken casually in cultures that revere them. usually consumption of these drugs are part of a larger religious ritual, and it is probably the fact that they are overwhelming and (sometimes) unpleasant that they are worshipped..when you think about it, most things that are worshipped don't play nice 100% of the time.

[Alfa]

Originally Posted by scyrusurcys

Alfa - if Amanita Muscaria mushrooms are so toxic, why have they been used and worshiped for thousands of years?

Because they where given to cattle, of which the urine was consumed. The Ibotanic acid was filtered out this way.

[psyche]

Check out the Amanita mushrooms section of the file archive for many case studies about amanita intoxication. The liver toxicity of amanity should not be underestimated and goes beyond that of alcohol. A full overview of the exact dangers of amanita's would very welcome. I'd certainly hit such a post up with a major reputation bump.

Well I meant A. Muscaria in case I didn't make myself clear. AFAIK there's almost no deaths or poisonings.

[Alfa]

Originally Posted by scyrusurcys

Alfa - if Amanita Muscaria mushrooms are so toxic, why have they been used and worshiped for thousands of years?

Because they where given to cattle, of which the urine was consumed. The Ibotanic acid was filtered out this way.

Originally Posted by psyche

Well I meant A. Muscaria in case I didn't make myself clear. AFAIK there's almost no deaths or poisonings.

There have been a few Amanita muscaria deaths. Poisonings are more common. This case is a good example IMO:
Fly agaric (Amanita muscaria) poisoning, case report and review
Most Amanita deaths are due to other amanita species then amanita muscaria. Some of those species look very simular to amanita muscaria. That also answers bajeda's statement about not getting the more poisonous amanita's.

I hope it is clear that Amanita's are not to be consumed without the utmost care. Care towards the right method of consumption & getting the right species. If you have liver problems, amanita muscaria can cause dramatic problems.

[psyche]

Alfa - if Amanita Muscaria mushrooms are so toxic, why have they been used and worshiped for thousands of years?

Is datura non-toxic because it has been used long..

[Nagognog2]

Last Analysis Department: If the only thing available to get one high is a mushroom that can cause sickness, even occasionally death, to it's user while causing a pleasant alteration of conciousness - guess what? The drive in people to alter their consciousness is so powerful that people are willing to run that risk.

With much safer and less toxic alternatives (and much more enjoyable by most accounts) available, there really isn't much reason to experiment with something that can make you so sick that you wish you would die.

[craigy2oo6]

swim has just bought 40 g of washington red caps fly agaric ive posted this question a good few times now just wondering if any 1 could give swim a bench mark 2 start with swim was thinking 10g ive also heard numeours mixed reports of plp dieing from this fungus in excessive doses i personally know i person who did not come through the other end is there any real solid evidence surrounding this little fucker it all seems to be myth like pls help before swim takes the whole 40g

[scyrusurcys]

A 'medium' trip for A. Muscaria is around 8-10g. dry. Strong doses may require up to 20g.

[J. Muscaria]

I'd like to clear this up for you all right now.
Amanita Muscaria does not cause liver damage. The psychoactive alkaloids are water soluable and are easily flushed out by your kidneys in moderate doses. Here is a short article about this specific question

http://www.erowid.org/plants/amanita...as_info7.shtml

The bottom line is that the only deaths related to A.Muscaria are due to people mistakinly eating one of two other related species; Death Caps and Death Angels. While these are related to the Fly Agaric, they are very different looking and anyone who takes the time to study them will see that they are quite distinguishable. The Fly Agaric (A. Muscaria) has a red to orange cap and white spots all over. The two deadly relatives have white or grey brown caps and no spots.
There is a lot of great info out there about Fly Agaric mushrooms for anyone interested. They have been eated and revered for thousands of years by many different cultures.
They are also probably the most succulent and flavorful mushroom I have ever eaten. Just one from one mushroom can flavor a whole pot of soup!

Reputation Comments on this post:

very interesting. thanks.

[lloydsLSD]

All the posts are night and day apart in terms of difference of opinion. WTF?