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SWIM is a very experienced opiate user (oxy- and hydro- codone, heroin, poppy tea, etc.) and SWIM injects dope (H) very frequently. SWIM has 2 main sources and quality/bag weight rarely varies. SWIM's main source provides "raw" (that light tan/brown stuff). Recently, SWIM has been buying this "raw" and subsequently banging (injecting) it consistently. Everything's been normal; the dope has always sat brown in the water and mostly dissolved after a few seconds, turning the water that beautiful brown: normal - until today.
Today, SWIM picked up some more from Mr. Raw Provider. SWIM returns home, and the usual ritual ensues - spoon, empty out a bag in it, prepare a little cotton, grab a new rig (needle) from the bag, get some water, fill the rig with it, and this is where the peculiarity occurs: SWIM begins filling the dope-filled spoon with water, and immediately upon contact, the water begins bubbling and foaming like crazy. This has never happened before with the stuff SWIM gets from the provider of 'raw', but that is irrelevant - it's happened this time. SWIM assumes (or is guessing) that this particular batch has been cut with baking soda. (Think 5th grade science project: the volcano with baking soda in it, you add water, and a foamy, bubbly substance erupts from the volcano). I know baking soda mixed with water has this effect, hence my suspicion.
SWIM is going to attempt to get a replacement batch, since SWIM knows baking soda is safe to snort or smoke, and SWIM suspects his raw provider blows (snorts) his product, and does not inject it.
Now for the question: before calling to ask for a replacement batch, I'd like to know: is baking soda unsafe to inject? I assume it must be (to the point of being lethal), due to the potentiality of bubbling/foaming in the blood-stream. But when the dope-filled water is burned sufficiently, the 'baking soda effect' ceases (although SWIM assumes most of the dope is burned away along with it). Does anybody have any technical or scientific information on the hazards of injecting product that is (possibly/most likely) cut with baking soda? SWIM has searched the internet through and through and has (not surprisingly) found no information on (the most likely extremely rare situation of) baking soda injection.
Note to future respondents: SWIM is an extremely experienced drug user/opiate user/intravenous user. I do not need to hear that "injecting is stupid", that "drugs are bad for you", or that "heroin kills". SWIM knows his limits, and I am most certainly aware of the hazards associated with any intravenous drug-use.SWIM is only interested in any information knowledgeable and educated D-F members may be able to provide. SWIM would like to affirm that injecting what is most likely baking soda is extremely dangerous before calling SWIM's source for a product exchange. If the dangers are possible yet minimal, SWIM is likely willing to take the risk. If the dangers are probable-certain, then (needless to say) SWIM will refrain from consuming the product intravenously.
Thank you in advance to all who respond to this post. Your information, thoughts, and (educated, realistic) advice is greatly appreciated.
well after it bubbled, was there chunks of dope stil in the water? If it was cut with baking soda, a base, then the heroin would have gone into its base form instead of the salt, and thus been insoluble in water. In this case, SWIY could simply add an acid and then it would be shootable again. However, if after the bubbling the solution was clear, it was something else and SWIM would dtrongly advise against injecting this solution.
No, after the bubbling ceased, the water was still brown - it was hard to see if there were still chunks at the bottom, as the brown water became extremely murky, but SWIM would say that yes there were still chunks at the bottom. I have been reading about purification methods, but am hesitant to try these as SWIM has absolutely zero experience mixing chemicals. SWIM is intelligent and quite capable of following instructions for a purification recipe, but this process still makes SWIM slightly nervous. Wouldn't the Hydrochloric Acid (HCl) needed for purification be also dangerous to shoot?
SWIM has also been reading about Sodium Carbonate injections - SWIM knows that Baking Soda is Sodium Carbonate...could this potentially mean that Baking Soda itself is not harmful to inject? SWIM read what Sodium Carbonate injections are for..(changing the blood's pH levels, etc.)...SWIM is hesitant...
SWIM is in possession of a large quantity of this baking-soda infused dope. Something must be done, or hundreds and hundreds of dollars will be wasted =C
swim just looked up that baking soda IS water soluble in water, but he is unsure if it is harmful to inject, but would assume it would. he couldn't find a decent source on google if it is bad to inject. swim would say to snort or use anally if swiy is going to get sick without his dope. perhaps an IM, but that still sounds risky with the whole baking soda thing. good luck sorry swim cant help more.
Note: This is unusual. Usually, when SWIM adds water to the dope-filled spoon, the dope sits at the bottom, brown and grainy. After burning, the water becomes more brown and murky - but not nearly as much as it is right now (normally, after burning, the grainy non-soluble garbage is still visible at the bottom). But with this batch, when the bubbling calms down, the brown water looks somewhat like it does after being burned normally - SWIM burned the post-bubbly solution to see what happened and the solution began to bubble slightly again (bubbles were not on the surface - it almost looked like water in a pot that is not quite at a boil yet - SWIM could just see agitation within the solution) but otherwise, relatively normal.
however, since the heroin is in its salt form, it will react with the baking soda in the water, forming into a base, causing precipitation and possibly bubbling
try adding some lemon juice to the solution and seeing if it clears up, but dont shoot this crap when SWIyou've done it. If it does clear up though, find some citric acid and add it to your next shot so that the gear dissolves in the water.
So...SWIM adds lemon juice when, exactly? While it's bubbling? Or before adding water? And if this works, where does one find Hydrochloric Acid? And what is the procedure for using the HCl? Is it the same as the purification process?
skibum0316 added 58 Minutes and 43 Seconds later...
I mean...SWIM has been snorting some tonight and it's not too bad to blow it..SWIM just infinitely prefers booting it. Infinitely. But snorting will get the job done, especially if SWIM is feeling froggy...so SWIM can live with it - he just feels like he wasted his money.
Oh well, SWIM supposes it's simply an implicit cost of business (or cost of being a opiate fiend, rather - SWIM hates the word "junkie" - it has such an unjustly negative connotation to it. The common misconception is that a junkie (or any heroin user) is a despicably dirty, thieving degenerate; the lowest form of humanity. A perfectly functioning, intelligent, educated, stable opiate-user (even a heavy opiate/heroin user) is most certainly not a "junkie" the way most envision one. SWIM wishes he could alter the general public's view of an opiate user, but decades of government propaganda, Hollywood characterization, and media bias has desecrated any chance of opiate-users being seen as potentially normal, contributing members of society. (SWIM is certain that anyone who knows him would be astonished to discover he is highly dependent on and fairly severely addicted to opiates).
Ha okay sorry - that was SWIM's little rant. SWIM just finished blowing a bag and a half of this mysterious bubbling dope. Despite it being cut (quite honestly, a first for this supplier), it is still relatively effective. Seeing as SWIM hasn't snorted dope since he was in his early 20's, it is hard to distinguish whether the minimal effects are due more to it's being cut, or it's method of intake: snorting, vs. the usual method of injection. Probably a bit of both. Yeesh snorting hurts. SWIM prefers piercing veins.
Thank you all for your help. SWIM truly and greatly appreciates it. Stay safe. And f*** the societal norms - if SWIY wants to get high - get high.
Last edited by skibum0316; 05-04-2010 at 06:51.
Reason: Automerged Doublepost
Even if SWIY says he's snorting it, if he has a large quantity of this batch, at some point he will inject it most probably. Snorting is a very welcome vacation on SWIY's veins though, so if he thinks he'll stick to snorting until finishing all he's got, then he should do so!
Lemon juice is NOT a good choice as an acid for heroin-related dissolving !
Lemon juice contains a bacteria/fungus that, if injected into the mainstream, might settle around SWIY's eyes, causing even blindness in worst cases! It could happen on 1st time using it or on 100th, so don't take chances on it !
The best acids for dissolving purposes are Citric Acid and powdered Vitamin C .
Always add the smallest possible amount of acid, as injecting acid in the veins will anyhow shorten their lives by aggressing the vein's walls -> the more acid, the more damage!
Best way to do it and minimize potential damage is to add more water than SWIY usually does and a very little amount of Citric/Vit C in the beginning and start the heating - not continuous flame but rather heat a bit-stop-heat a bit again. If there are still chunks inside the solution after few heatings, add a little bit more Citric/Vit C and do the process heating again until you're getting a clear solution. This way you don't burn away your dope and you make sure there's just enough acid for the reaction to complete.
Any more acid that doesn't react will just be left in its acid form, provoking damage to your veins!
The reaction of the acid (citric/vit c) with a base (baking soda in this case, H3 usually) is a neutralizing reaction, so that means the PH of the resulting solution will be a neuter one - ideally.
Injecting baking soda into one's veins is not a bright idea and shouldn't be done on a regular basis, but it won't kill either, if the amounts injected are small enough.
SWIM has done H3 all her "career" so she knows what she's talking about. She also had baking soda as a cut in cocaine and mephedrone, the bubbling is very annoying.
Citric Acid is sold among Vanilla Sugar, Baking Soda, etc in common supermarkets, as it is used as a preservative for home-made marmalade & stewed fruit (compote). Powdered Vitamin C is to be found in pharmacies and is sold as little satchels, one is definitely enough.
If after doing the process above SWIYs resulting solution is not looking like normal clear heroin solution, DO NOT INJECT THAT CRAP! It means the cut is NOT Baking Soda and SWIY definitely doesn't want unknown crap cuts in his blood!
If SWIY has the chance to ask for replacement of the bags he got, he should do that without any further thinking! If he's having the great chance of having H4 available and doesn't need to get acids in his veins, why do it ?!
NO THREADS ON HEROIN CUTTING AGENTS/ TECHNIQUES HERE PLEASE
An increasingly large number of threads are being opened in the heroin forum requesting information on the cutting of heroin.
Threads discussing cutting techniques are against DF rules. People should refrain from including details such as these within their posts, or from starting threads on the subject of cutting drugs. Any overt reference to cutting techniques and/ or advice on the use of cutting agents will result in a warning or infraction being issued.
"Cutting" refers to adding a "cutting agent" or "cut" to the substance, in order to increase its weight or decrease its potency.
A cut is an adulterate, which both increases the dealerís profit margin and renders a substance less safe than it already is, and can in some case have dreadful, even fatal side effects. Cutting is a criminal practice which is always motivated by greed/ profit issues, is absolutely unethical, and is NOT ACCEPTABLE in this forum.
The only threads related to the subject of cuts and adulterants accepted are those dealing with CUT REMOVAL, or product purification. Purification, i.e. the removal of adulterants/ cuts is part of harm reduction, and information and techniques relating to product purification are perfectly acceptable. However, discussions of the various qualities/ types of cuts are not helpful from a harm reduction point of view, since no user can really tell what black market products are cut with, unless they are subjected to a chemical analysis.
And remember that greed/ profit motivated choices such as cutting products, leaving potential users to deal with adulterated, unsafe, black market products of unknown quality or concentration, are often behind some of the worse consequences of substance use in the current circumstances.
WE WILL NOT ACCEPT THREADS RELATED TO THE FACILITATION OF HEROIN CUTTING, CUTTING TECHNIQUES AND CUTTING AGENTS.