Saving money through potentiation of opiates

[G_nome]

My pet's recently found Nigella Sativa oil to be very effective at potentiating his poppy pod tea.
He's found nigella sativa oil to be much more effective than grapefruit juice, ant-acids and/or diphenhydramine.

See this thread here if ye wanna read his experience with this seemingly magical substance:

http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=100671

[RxSurf]

SWIM would also like to bring another topic up: Inhibition of the cyp450 enzyme system fro the purpose of potentiation only works for drugs with low extraction ratios ( <0.3). SWIM has not been able to find any information regarding the ER's of opiates, but from what SWIM has seen/felt, SWIM would think it's safe to say that the aforementioned opiates do in fact have a low enough ER for this to work.

[wreakreational_addict]

just swims 2 cents, but for anyone who takes opiates orally, tums/antacid is the easiest, cheapest, and best potentiator around. swim NEVER doses without them anymore. swim usually takes 5-10 extra strength tums 5min or so before chewing up and swallowing his oxy, then takes another 1-2 tums right afterwards. it causes the oxy to kick in faster & harder, producing a true "rush" of sorts. highly recommended!

[Creeping Death]

SWIM doesnt know if someones already mentioned this. A potentiator that really works is taking antihistamine-pills (allergy) and dipenhydramine-pills (motion sickness). This works regardless if you swallow, snort or shoot your drugs!

SWIM takes a couple of OTC allergy pills and motion sickness pills at right before the peak of the opiate buzz, and it both potentiates and prolongs the buzz. It also works to take them at the same time as, or before taking the opiate.

Its something SWIM really found to work (way better than grapejuice) and it only costs about 3 dollars for the two packs of pills.

[rysko]

whitegrapefruit juice is the only way to go. it is fact that ruby red grapefruit juice or any other variation besides juice made from white grapefruits will not help increase your rush, high, make the comedown better, make it last longer, nothing... period. hope this helps.

[Creeping Death]

Does anyone know about Proglumide? This medicine literally reduces your tolorance. I read people who use 60mg hydro only need to take 5mg(!) to feel the same effects, after taking Proglumide. But SWIM cant find much info or where to buy it!

[MAX POWER]

Originally Posted by Creeping Death

Does anyone know about Proglumide? This medicine literally reduces your tolorance. I read people who use 60mg hydro only need to take 5mg(!) to feel the same effects, after taking Proglumide. But SWIM cant find much info or where to buy it!

google search for "buy milid," very first link

MAX POWER added 642 Minutes and 21 Seconds later...

wow thanks for this post. swim is trying this with tums/hydro as we speak, will look into picking up some white grapefruit juice as soon as he researches the effect it will have on his atenolol and primatene tablets (ephedrine/guaifenesin) that he takes every morning.

swim is not going to bother trying this with antihistamines, he thinks the grogginess they would bring on would just ruin the opiate effects

swim is going to research that proglumide (trade=Milid) also, it is inexpensive and if it works as suggested here, would be worth it many times over for sure

[Handle]

Originally Posted by Creeping Death

Does anyone know about Proglumide? This medicine literally reduces your tolorance. I read people who use 60mg hydro only need to take 5mg(!) to feel the same effects, after taking Proglumide. But SWIM cant find much info or where to buy it!

Damn proglumide! Stop tormenting me! Isn't it like an anti ulcer thing or something?

Anyway, good luck finding it, there's always these beautiful sounding perfect answers but then you find out they were a communist bloc specialty, last known/heard of being used in some goddamned nursing home in Czechoslovakia!

if it was available, I'd agree with you. I get a little hepped over these sort of, beautiful shimmering oases, where you dive in to a faceful of sand.

The real tragedy is that in theory I know you are right, and it must be out there, somewhere...

[barbaby89]

SWIM can verify that DXM definitely potentiates the experience. If SWIY has access to Benzos the experience can be even better if you take one an hour or so into the experience. Antihistimines effectively negate many of the negative side effects as well.

[theendperson]

Persumaby the juice wont help pro-drugs like codeine etc?

SWIM has found that about 60mg DXM can reduce the amount of a drug needed to produce the effects by almost a half. Studies have shown that DXM can interfere with addiction (!?)

[deltakilo]

For optimum potentiation of one's opiates, SWIM recommends the following:

@ T-1 hour - SWIM will usually ingest 1 Tagamet/ 1-2 glasses of grapefruit juice
@ T-10 mmins SWIM will usually ingest an alka seltzer or a few tums

SWIM always notices a huge difference in the intensity/speed of the onset and duration of the high when the aforementioned steps are followed.

Happy pill popping.

[radagast]

Swim would normally take 1/2 a teaspoon of bicarb dissolved in 1/2 pint of water 10 min or so before popping cos he believes its a more potent antacid than tums/rennies but has never really done any tests as such so it might not work at all!
Any thoughts?

[returntozero]

swim just took a benadryl and 2 tums extra strength about 10 mins before popping 45 mg hyrdro

dont feel anything yet surprisingly

returntozero added 13 Minutes and 38 Seconds later...

swim is feeling great now. potentiators are working in his opinion

[Realization]

About an hour and a half ago swim ingested about .5 liters of grapefruit juice with a first time attempt at poppy seed tea. Swim feels slightly euphoric and "high" but nothing signifigant. This is most likely due to swims slight tolerence (usually takes 20mg oxycodone then 20mg more 20-30 minutes later for an average dose) and the fact swim only used 200g of poppy seeds. Swim has come across 2 vicodins 5mg/500mg. Swim knows that the grapefruit potentates the opiates as well as the acetaminophen and swims question is really this; is swims liver going to be ok if swim pops these 2 vicadins? Swim did some searching and couldn't find anything specific on a time frame for how long after ingesting GF juice you can take acetaminophen, so sorry if this has been asked already. Swim would do a CWE but doesn't want to risk losing any of the precious opiates since things have been dry recently. Any advice is greatly appreciated!

Realization added 1223 Minutes and 18 Seconds later...

Well swim took them, and is still kicking. Swim feels completely fine today, actually pretty damn refreshed. Swim is getting some Tasmanian Pods tomorrow, cant wait to try those! =]

[YellowViolet]

SWIM has a question about tolerance ....
They take 40 mg Opana ER 2 x day plus 10 oxycodone 3 x day for breakthrough pain.

After they read the threads on potentiation to save medicine she found that if she crushes and snorts or uses anally (Opana) she only needs to use 10 mg which gives more relief than 40 mgs used the right way. Hypothetically, doing this 1 pill could last 2 days, thereby saving 3 pills every 2 days.

The question is: reducing the dosage from 80 to 20 mg per day, does this reduce tolerance or does it increase tolerance because the bioavailability is so much more?

I'm not sure if I've explained my question but we'll see. Thanks.

[Handle]

Originally Posted by YellowViolet

SWIM has a question about tolerance ....
They take 40 mg Opana ER 2 x day plus 10 oxycodone 3 x day for breakthrough pain.

After they read the threads on potentiation to save medicine she found that if she crushes and snorts or uses anally (Opana) she only needs to use 10 mg which gives more relief than 40 mgs used the right way. Hypothetically, doing this 1 pill could last 2 days, thereby saving 3 pills every 2 days.

The question is: reducing the dosage from 80 to 20 mg per day, does this reduce tolerance or does it increase tolerance because the bioavailability is so much more?

I'm not sure if I've explained my question but we'll see. Thanks.

Good question. It will not really be reducing tolerance, because your "feeling" -the mental state you get from a drug is the best measure of effects.

What I'm saying is, even if you take less, if you don't deny you needed quite a bit by mouth, and now you're getting the same effect, well, you wouldn't be lying and saying it worked for you if it didn't.

And since tolerance and to some degree dependence requires, to some extent, the delivery to the brain of the same amounts of drug, your good feelings are telling you, they are the best indicator that your brain is probably receiving the same amount of drug. [When I say the same, of course I mean, according to your subjective brain, it is not upset, kicking and screaming and making you feel the dose is inadequate, so if you're feeling just as good, the amount of drug getting through to your brain must really be not much less than you were getting as the end result by mouth]

There are complicating factors such as the faster onset of alternative routes, that give a subjective feeling of more effects when actually they are simply the more rapid onset. This can give rise to short term estimations that you feel just as much effect, when actually you begin to realise you are just front loading their intensity.


But anyway, if you're feeling just as good from less, you are better off all round. You're exposed to less of the side effects that won't get you any higher, less impurity and filler is going into your body for each period of analgesia [even though you're not injecting, this is still a minor benefit]

and of course it saves you money.

So even though your brain might be receiving the same amount of drug, because your smaller dose is getting through better than a large stomach dose which is partially degraded,

this may mean tolerance is not decreased

nevertheless you are getting through less of your supplies each time, and you are better off.

[YellowViolet]

Originally Posted by Handle

Good question. It will not really be reducing tolerance, because your "feeling" -the mental state you get from a drug is the best measure of effects.
.............

So even though your brain might be receiving the same amount of drug, because your smaller dose is getting through better than a large stomach dose which is partially degraded,

this may mean tolerance is not decreased

nevertheless you are getting through less of your supplies each time, and you are better off.

First, Swim thanks you for your in depth response - Swim thinks she understands what you're saying ... but actually the smaller dose isn't just equal, it feels much more relief from pain, not just faster, with the 10 mg dose taken rectal or nasal method than the 40 mg by mouth. Taken by mouth 40 mg swim still has some residual pain whereas the smaller dosage the pain is almost instantly gone. Swim also takes less of the oxycodone for breakthrough pain so swim understands what you're saying that it's better for her all the way around by using less; however, the guilt swim has associated with the alternate delivery methods is very hard to deal with.
So does swim understand correctly that it's not really decreasing her tolerance and that if swim was to take the smaller 10 mg dose rectal or nasal for a few weeks and then if she were to return to taking it correctly (40 mg by mouth) that that dosage wouldn't work better like it did in the beginning having taken only the 10 mg dosage?

[gmeziscool2354]

yeah, if one body can handle it, opiates are a great thing to pump one body full of after a tough work out session. this may be terrible advice to some people, on par with telling a complete noob to take 40+ mgs of oxycodone (saw that once recently here)

with the excercize potentiation, if you don't work out regularly, don't start and the go get doped out right afterwards. you probably wont die or have any major health effects, but you will likely get terrible stomach cramps that nothing will eliminate

but, if you regularly work out, planning your opiate use around your workout schedule is a very good 'natural' potentiation method

[Realization]

Originally Posted by gmeziscool2354

but, if you regularly work out, planning your opiate use around your workout schedule is a very good 'natural' potentiation method

To add, swim finds that working out while buzzing on opiates, specifically oxycondone in his experience, makes him able to do more reps than normal. But be careful the anti-pain aspect of this drug may cause you to over exert yourself to the point of cramps or even a tear. Swim finds that he normally does 20-25 reps curling and can increase up to 35-40 reps, and even do another set later, when he normally wouldn't be able to.

[gmeziscool2354]

another one here, kinda funky, but it seems to work quite well.

Swim has found if he loads up on fiber (chewable fiber tablets for him) before dosing opiates, it increases the high and decreased the nausea for him greatly. i believe it does so by iritaing the lining of the intestines, thus producing more of the stuff that makes turds break up and not stick together. maybe its purely mental, as swims gut don't hurt from digestion being virtually stopped, who knows, but it seams as potent as GFJ for him

[Handle]

Originally Posted by hoodabudda

or some pepper spray in the face. thats usually a rush.

!
Tony: I dunno, George, bowling....there's no 'rush', man.
George: Rush! Rush?! You want a rush, you drop a ball on your foot my friend, talk about a rush -you'll be seeing VISIONS!!!

Hey, on capsaicin, the stuff in chillis and chilli spray, the way the body reacts to it is actually integral to our perception of pain and inflammation. There is a thing in our nerve endings in our skin called substance P, and it gets released in massive doses when capsaicin is applied. Similarly, when sub P gets injected, it causes the same redness and inflammation as chilli. Now, the theory out there is, that while endorphins areheavily implicated in our response, there is also evdence that after the initial saturation with substance P when chilli is first applied, that pain thresholds rise. This is separate from euphoria, it is more about the simple direct physical perception of pain. It's almost like if a nut goes into a building and starts shooting, [the first chilli pain] then all the people in the building run out screaming {the substance P signal/response}, so then if another madman goes in 15 minutes later trying to do the same thing, well there will be many fewer people left in the building to transmit the second warning signal [the substance P has raised the threshold of pain].
I know it seems like a kooky analogy, but that is [partly] why chilli eaters may feel good after eating a chilli [real pain blocking as opposed to emotional euphoria] so that, even if endorphins are released, there is an added benefit which has the same antinociceptive effect.
Also, I might not have the name right, but I think there is a receptor for substance P called NK1, [correct me if I'm wrong] and that is actually deeply involved with serotonin as well! It even got to the point that substances developed to block substance P were even trialled as antidepressants, by merck, but they were never marketed.
The only way I can justify this longwinded irrelevant nonsense is by adding that I have also heard of people eating chilli with opiate drugs, thinking this will help. SWIM supposes that this must be just to speed up blood flow, which some peppers can definitely do, like cayenne. Hell, just yesterday I saw even chocolate at the supermarket, mixed with chilli