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Concerta & Ritalin About Methylphenidate.

 
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  #1  
Old 06-11-2009, 05:58
doctordiddle doctordiddle is offline
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Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

Swim was heard from her pharmacology prof a couple interesting facts and am wondering if anyone has any input.

1) Apparently, underneath your tongue is highly vascularized (lots of blood vessels), so under the tongue administration of drugs should deliver a higher effective dose of the drug. (Taken orally, ~70% of the effective component of Ritalin is made inert by the liver, so only 30% enters the bloodstream to deliver the desired effects). Has anyone tried this?

2) Snorting. Clearly any Ritalin that would enter the lungs would go straight into the blood, upping the effective dose similar to 1). But how much actually enters the lungs? Is there a significant amount of the powder (ground Ritalin) that gets trapped in the nasal cavity? Could one use a saline nasal spray to wash the remains into the throat, essentially ingesting the booger-ritalin orally (so as to not waste it)?

3) Swim also learned from a drug information reference, that caffeine is suppose to enhance the effects of Ritalin. Any experiences to confirm or deny? And how much caffeine are we talking about? Swim has taken vitamin R with a soda with caffeine, but hasn't noticed any improvement.

Thanks for any tips/advice guys.

The Diddler

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interesting question & thread starter!
  #2  
Old 06-11-2009, 06:14
caltrain208 caltrain208 is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

1) SWIM isn't sure about the effectiveness of sublingual (under the tongue) Ritalin, although it's true that most drugs are more effective when taken this way. I'm sure a search for "sublingual bioavailability of methylphenidate" or something to that effect would yield more results though. If SWIY can't find anything, try it and let us know how it goes!

2) Insufflated drugs are actually absorbed by soft tissue in the mucous membrane of the sinus cavity (taken from Wikipedia), NOT the lungs. It may be a good idea to use the saline spray before snorting the Ritalin to clear out the nose though.

3) Caffeine changes the effects of Ritalin, but SWIM wouldn't say it enhances anything. Caffeine + Ritalin feels very jittery and sometimes anxious (for SWIM anyways). SWIY said he tried Ritalin with caffeine in a soda though- perhaps the caffeine in a soda wasn't enough to notice any effects.
  #3  
Old 08-11-2009, 00:43
doctordiddle doctordiddle is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

Thanks caltrain.

So SWIM tried all three and to be honest, SWIM couldn't tell much of a difference between the three methods (oral, nasal, sublingual).

Granted SWIM is relatively new to Ritalin and only interested in using it for studying and in conserving R as much as possible so is taking low doses (20mg every two hours), but has anyone else had this experience?

Thanks.
  #4  
Old 12-11-2009, 15:27
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

SWIM thinks the following:

Sublingual Ritalin is slightly more effective than an oral dose, IMO; still, the only real drawback of sublingual ritalin is the horrible taste of the pill.

Insufflated Ritalin is much more effective than either oral or sublingual ritalin. It has a higher bioavailability and the effects are far stronger. SWIM usually combines a small oral dose with a insufflated dose to lessen the negative comedown of the nasal dose. 10-20mg orally and 20-40 mg (sometimes more) nasally works for SWIM but he has a high tolerance.

Caffeine does have some mild potentiation effects on Ritalin but would agree that it can also increase the jitters, anxiety, etc. SWIM finds that these side effects to only be a problem at very high doses of either caffeine and/or Ritalin.

Finally, in terms of potentiation, SWIM feels that L-Tyrosine has the most potential as a real potentiater of methylfenidate. SWIM always makes sure to take it in the morning, on an empty stomach, about an hour before breakfast. It seems to add a healthy booste to the Ritalin with few negatives (price of the supplements for example).

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interesting theories, thanks for sharing them
  #5  
Old 17-11-2009, 05:01
doctordiddle doctordiddle is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

Cool. Thanks guys.

bunker, where can SWIM get L-Tyrosine? Is it OTC? How much should SWIM take?
  #6  
Old 17-11-2009, 05:28
Nnizzle Nnizzle is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

L-Tyrosine can be bought at most health stores and SWIM says it is sold at many grocery stores too. Not OTC, can buy it off the shelf. It's pretty expensive though.
  #7  
Old 17-11-2009, 06:14
Trogdor Trogdor is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

Another good potentiator of methylphenidate is guarana. This can be found in most energy drinks(Amp, Rockstar, etc.), diet pills(not reccomended), and is in some "energy" pills. Best bet for the pills is an herbal supplement type of store.

Although unpleasant the best way to take the ritalin would be up the ass. Sorry for that crude expression. Rectal bioavailabilty is usually the highest other than the obvious injecting.

Swim has also found smoking ritalin to be a very effective method of administration. This method does require a fair bit more preparation though since the methylphenidate should be extracted then converted to a smokeable base. Swim is a bit unsure of how to extract, but here is the process of turning methylphenidate to a smokeable base.
Materials:
methylphenidate powder*
baking soda
aluminum foil.
1. Take methylphenidate powder and mix it 1:1 with baking soda.
2. Cut the aluminum foil into squares that are about 6"x6"
3. put a small pile of the mixed powder onto the foil. This pile should contain the ammount to be ingested in one sitting. If that's a lot of powder then split it up on a couple pieces of foil. swim has found the best amount to use is the amount of powder that 1-2 pills make when crushed.
4. Slowly drip water onto the powder and then mix. Make sure to add enough water so all the powder is damp, but not so much that it gets runny. Too much water is fine, it will just take longer to dry out.
5. Leave this goop out to dry. If swiy got the amount of water right it should take no more than 30 minutes to dry under a light.
6 Once this is dried it can be smoked. Just run a lighter under the foil until it produces smoke. careful not to burn it as methylphenidate does decompose in overly high heat (200C). breath in the smoke through an empty pen shell, or, swim preference a plastic bottle cut in half.
Credit for this belongs mainly to others, but swim can't for the life of him remember who those people are.

Taking the ritalin in swiys favoured method could also be done midway through a weed "comedown". I could be a bit mistaken on this one, but if I'm not mistaken the active components of MJ(namely thc and cannabinol) potentiate ritalin through some enzyme. Swim has found that this does seem to work for him with adderall and since they are metabolised by the same enzyme I'm pretty sure it would also work for ritalin.

Did some quick checking, the anzyme is the hepatic enzyme CYP2D6. Not quite sure what that means though.

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thanks for sharing this interesting TEK
  #8  
Old 23-11-2009, 06:41
Zgill1990 Zgill1990 is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

swim takes 20mg focalin xr pills and crushes the beads up into a fine powder and mix it with a shot glass with water and down the hatch it goes swim has a sister who tried to smoke it with foil and baking soda and it made her throw up after her first puff
  #9  
Old 23-11-2009, 06:55
promnthevs promnthevs is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

SWIM has taken ~60 mg of methylphenidate sublingually. I was pretty incredible. A noticeable improvement from oral.
  #10  
Old 23-11-2009, 13:54
bunker bunker is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

doctordiddle - SWIM gets supplements of 500 mg l-tyrosine at GNC. Normal doses range from 500-1,500 mg.

SWIY might want to start off at a low dose of l-tyrosine - i.e. 500 mg until SWIY's comfortable with what it does to SWIY's body. SWIM has heard from both sides of the tyrosine debate and knows that the jury is still out on its "usefullness" as either a methylfenidate or amphetamine potentiator. SWIM knows his body and he doses either pre or post methylfenidate with very good results...but that's SWIM; and everybody's unique
  #11  
Old 23-11-2009, 14:37
gmeziscool2354 gmeziscool2354 is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

magnesium hydroxide can give a little boost to some MPH. swim chews a rolaid sometimes either before or just after having taken MPH and this boosts its effects some what. not sure how, 2 theories, one being akaline it slows the excetron of MPH ect ect. the other, more likely theory is that the Mg increases the neuron activity that MPH induces. i think i read somewhere that kids on concerta/adderal xr were recomended to be supplemented with Mg in order to increase the effeciency of the medicine over its full course of action
  #12  
Old 23-11-2009, 14:49
Combination Combination is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

Drink large amounts of a strong alcoholic beverage before administrating ritalin
  #13  
Old 01-12-2009, 10:29
gmeziscool2354 gmeziscool2354 is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Combination View Post
Drink large amounts of a strong alcoholic beverage before administrating ritalin
thats called ethylphenidate. more info can be found here

https://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=63610

and many other threads if swiy looks.


but on the topic of potentiation, a bit of antacids will help, but swim would really like to know of some other methods. MPH is different from amphetamine, potentiation methods should be different. If not, i'd like to hear some experience from other about this topic
  #14  
Old 01-12-2009, 14:03
bunker bunker is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

MPH is different from amphetamine and adding baking soda and antacids will not do much in terms of potentiation of MPH (and, technically, doesn't act as a "potentiator" of amphetamines either, but rather decreases their excretion).

SWIM sees that this thread has neglected one of his favorite MPH potentiators - grapefruit juice. There have been other threads on this so SWIM won't bother with the details...just UTSE and give it a try.
  #15  
Old 27-01-2010, 20:58
serdalcomlekci serdalcomlekci is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

alcohol and ritalin best combo

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Please try to contribute more in a post.
  #16  
Old 20-07-2010, 22:31
MageYouLook MageYouLook is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

swim has taken ritalin through snorting oral and sublingual. sublingual seems to treat swim differently than oral and snorting. swim notices more euphoria and not the normal energy boost from taking orally or snorting.

sublingually even with 5-15mg there is a great deal of euphoria
  #17  
Old 22-07-2010, 09:18
MissAmorousPlay MissAmorousPlay is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

I am too impatient to read through all the replies....so if it wasnt covered already taking them on An empty stomach makes a HUGE difference. and try to go as long as possible without eating after taking it, eating tends to bring you down....
  #18  
Old 01-08-2010, 03:08
tjk13 tjk13 is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

Purifying the pills with a simple ethanol filtration (see my thread https://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=137524) will concentrate the active ingredient, making the nasal route much more enjoyable and feasible due to the lack of inactive pill binders like Talc.
  #19  
Old 03-08-2010, 15:28
sarahsweets sarahsweets is offline
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re: ritalin dexedrine and soma

Ok swim is probably in wrong place but got a new smart phone and can't figure out how to post new threads. (Any info on that would be good too) anyway swim is rx'd generic ritalin ir generic dexedrine spansule 15 mg and has soma. Swim wanted to know if she could take the soma with the add meds to cut down on the side effects of these meds. Not for coming down because that's ok for swim but just to loosen the jaw calm the anxiety and still reap the benefits. Swim snorts the ritalin and eats the dexedrine and swallows the soma when used. Any info would be great and swim knows she's a retard for not figuring out the smart phone yet.
  #20  
Old 30-08-2010, 02:38
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

SWIM gets scripted ritalin and SWIM finds that since he started supplementing omega-3's and b vitamins that he feels the effects like he once did. They worked for SWIM and make his medication work alot better

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nice alternative booster suggestion that DEFINITELY wont harm!
  #21  
Old 19-09-2010, 15:39
naz_ naz_ is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

the addition of alcohol to the Methylphenidate, within the body, leads to a process called transesterification - this is the process of exchanging the organic group R" of an ester with the organic group R' of an alcohol.

Mixing i.e. coingesting Ritalin (Methylphenidate) with booze (Ethanol) creates Ethylphenidate via hepatic transesterification - just as cocaine and alcohol form Cocaethylene when coingested.

AFOAF definitely finds Ethylphenidate to be more potent!!
  #22  
Old 31-10-2010, 14:22
Oxy Moron Oxy Moron is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

Quote:
Originally Posted by naz_ View Post
the addition of alcohol to the Methylphenidate, within the body, leads to a process called transesterification - this is the process of exchanging the organic group R" of an ester with the organic group R' of an alcohol.

Mixing i.e. coingesting Ritalin (Methylphenidate) with booze (Ethanol) creates Ethylphenidate via hepatic transesterification - just as cocaine and alcohol form Cocaethylene when coingested.

AFOAF definitely finds Ethylphenidate to be more potent!!
Which is not why this question is asked. People ask about potentiating with the goal of increasing the drug's effects without increasing the dose. You're explaining how to get fucked up. People here already know how to do that just fine. Manipulating their body's chemistry makeup correctly to nteract with the compounds of a drug to successfully maximize the strength and length of the effects? That one's a little more difficult.

SWIM doesn't know the answer but does know one extremely important detail about potentiating: Keep it simple. Every time any cocktail is made it's eventually modified, for better or for worse. If you get something elaborate going you're basically asking for a quasi-placebo effect more than anything. The entire point of potentiating is to be efficient. If you spent more time trying to potentiate than you did enjoying the effects, you failed to do that.

The empty stomach is universally effective. In other words, you'll get further by not doing something than the guy with the chemistry set did...
  #23  
Old 02-11-2010, 19:20
Slipin Slipin is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

on the l-tyrosine topic

jeff has herd that to much can cause a reverse effect by the brain chemistry trying to rebalince itself ...

jeff was has lernt to beleve that l-tryrosine is a pre-cursor to i-dopa witch then increses dopimine . but to much can causes a reverse effect as the brain od's on i-dopa and tends to rid the od of i-dopa causing less dopimine to be available .. although i could be wrong ?

also l-tyrosine ive also been told mixed with magnesium produces the perfect breeding ground for i-dopa ..

also have found some where that it takes about 1 hr for the whole prosses from injestion of the l-tyrosine +magnesium to activate and produce ideal levels of dopimine .

but jeff was using this as more off an anti depression natural mix

but as jeff knows methamphetimine releses mass amounts of dopimine as the feal good drug and high associated with meth

but jeff is not sure about the full way ritilin works but thaught it would be similer being amphetimine based ??

any way food for thaught ... but with the l-tyrosine im sure i read that 2 much does tend to have a negitive effect ...

jeff would just start with the usual 3 times a day recomendation on the powder or pill form and go from there depending on ur dopimine relesing habits

Slipin added 16 Minutes and 21 Seconds later...

jeff has just found the "l-tyrosine " thred witch explains it in much more detail

but still finds it rather hard to read as its verey chemistry based detail..

and as jeff has found on other thred .seems to work better in a sittuation like jeffs where depression and fatigue were his issues at the time ...

but 1 would also say if u rec use rittilin u would suffer fatigue and depression like withdrawll like effects .. so having said that .. although u may not get a super high ... im sure 1 would find it usefull to ease the withdrawll like effects .

Last edited by Slipin; 02-11-2010 at 19:20. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
  #24  
Old 13-12-2010, 17:48
MageYouLook MageYouLook is offline
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

swim has tried sublingual ritalin as well as have posted about it before. The experience is much more euphoric. Quite similar to snorting; swim has found it to be more euphoric and less speedy than snorting though.

swim suggests taking some orally and the majority of the dose sublingually. Doing so will reduce the side effects of the comedown. sublingually is more intense and shorter lasting than oral but also taking an oral dose prevents having such as harsh a comedown in swims opinion.
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Old 23-05-2011, 21:54
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Re: Imrpoving Ritalin's efficacy

Quote:
Originally Posted by gmeziscool2354 View Post
magnesium hydroxide can give a little boost to some MPH. swim chews a rolaid sometimes either before or just after having taken MPH and this boosts its effects some what. not sure how, 2 theories, one being akaline it slows the excetron of MPH ect ect. the other, more likely theory is that the Mg increases the neuron activity that MPH induces. i think i read somewhere that kids on concerta/adderal xr were recomended to be supplemented with Mg in order to increase the effeciency of the medicine over its full course of action
My cat just figured this one out today by accident. Swim had snorted about 40mg of MPH and then felt like he was getting heartburn. So my cat took 3 Tums which are made out of calcium carbonate. He took the ultra 1000 kind. He doesn't know why but it changed the high feeling, and made the high last longer.

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alcohol, amphetamine, bioavailability, caffeine, cocaine, comedown, drug, drugs, drugs forum, ethanol, ethylphenidate, euphoria, guarana, insufflated, magnesium, methylphenidate, potentiation, potentiator, ritalin, ritalin dose, snorting drugs, soma, stimulant, sublingual administration, tyrosine

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