Dose - Monster doses

[Insomniacsdream]

Why do people never seem to take more then the equivilent of around 7g of psylocibe cyanescens. Can't you do the equivilent of a thum print with mushrooms? Anyobody care to share and experiences with doses higher then 7g as SWIM is looking to do a monster dose soon.

Reputation Comments on this post:

one year and 25 posts, and you're still self incriminating?

[ianzombie]

Swim has no idea what 'equivilent of a thum print' means?

[SullyGuy]

Originally Posted by ianzombie

Swim has no idea what 'equivilent of a thum print' means?

It means taking a "heroic" dose of LSD.

My orangutan thinks this kind of behavior isn't worth the risk. If no swimmers go above 7g normally... perhaps this is a sign that anything above is a bad idea?

[fugazi32]

SWIM has munched about 12g on an empty stomach before......went to Alpha Centuri and back.....won't be doing that much again! Stick to around 3-6g otherwise you'll end up tearing a whole in the fabric of reality.

fugazi32 added 1 Minutes and 27 Seconds later...

Oh, and they were quite strong Mexican Blues too!

[JesseXTC]

It's not that no one doses like this -- it's that not many people do because it must not be safe or smart for one to do. Not sure about tolerance with mushrooms, but everything should be consumed in moderation, and "too much of anything" is never a good idea. If one decides to dose over 7g, be sure to have a trip sitter or to at least be around other people who know what swiy is doing so that if something does go wrong, they can take appropriate actions such as taking swiy to the hospital. Stay safe and have fun!

Jesse

[Potter]

Known a number of people who have gone over a 1/4 ounce of dried mushrooms in a session. None of them reported any unexpected side effects or long term issues.

I should point out that in this group of people "unexpected side effects" did NOT include any of the following:
Abject Terror
Things that once seen were never able to be forgotten
Periods of inability to communicate with anything animate
Repeatedly getting lost... while sitting
The total lack of recognition of one's own body parts/voice/thoughts
The inability to recall how to operate; zippers, doors, hats, pencils...
Receiving the horrific knowledge concerning one's immanent demise at the hands of an unspeakable entity for being so foolish as to have done what they did.
Having their soul/mind/world view, shredded to pieces and reassembled in a different pattern then it was to start.
Reintegration process lasting weeks, if not months
Discovering what you wanted and what you NEED are two very different things
Discovering what you wish to be doing and what it is you NEED to be doing, are not only different things, but often at complete odds with each other.

Long term effects that were ALSO NOT unexpected:
Total change in paradigms
Loss/gaining of religion
Rather drastic changes in life goals
Feeling uncomfortable dealing with people who have not gone through that sort of ordeal
Other people feeling uncomfortable with you
Alienation from friends, family, loved ones, pretty much everyone who doesn't share your new world view, and even those who do.
Difficulty finding meaning in activities you are used to doing.

These lists go on and on. What I am getting at, is the people involved, knew what they were getting into, they understood this was not a game, but an ordeal, one with great rewards, but one that comes with a price. These events were well planned, the yoga's and rituals started days, weeks, months, years ahead of time. Body's and minds were trained and disciplined so as not to break in the wrong way...yes, you WILL break, the question is do you become a holy man or a babbling idiot?

I can not recommend this for anyone, especially with out further background into their education, practices, beliefs, mental/emotional history, physical world living situation, there's too many factors at play. The people mentioned above, were by and large, free of all responsibilities at the time they undertook this ordeal. They had the time to come back, reintegrate, deal with what they had learned, learned how to deal with the world again. They were not alone in their ordeal, having not only each other, but other initiates and loved ones who understood what they were undertaking and were willing to support them through the process. Tripp sitting doesn't end when the drugs effects are done, but when the person is back to ground state, in this case, it was quite some time after the event.

I should also point out that all these people are considered, by and large, to be madmen, ner-do-well's, disappointments to their families, paupers, and rarely find themselves comfortable with the rest of society. Then again, they were like that before this event too.

There's things you can do that you can't take back, your first break through psychedelic tripp, loosing your virginity, having a baby, initiating into a religion, giving up everything you feel comfortable with to a giant pyre and hitting the road. There is a good chance that a dose of mushrooms is going to be one of those events.

Reputation Comments on this post:

Good, thorough analysis.

[nnizzle]

http://www.a1b2c3.com/drugs/mus05.htm
Check out this. 40g dried. Read this a couple years ago, sounds fucking intense. Dunno why people don't do it though... probably requires quite a strong mind.

[Routemaster Flash]

SWIM has no idea what the actual dose was the first time he did mushrooms, but it was a *lot* - a dose you might call a 'heroic' or, depending on the context, 'downright fucking retarded'.

If fresh P. cubensis contains a similar proportion of water to other mushrooms, then the equivalent dried weight SWIM consumed that time could well have been a lot more than seven grams. Though this is ultimately conjecture.

[podge]

Firstly one needs to know the strain - particularly when it comes to high doses. For example - cubensis doses (strain depending) usually tend to be between 20-30 grams fresh, which when dried will be 2-3 grams. While a dose of Hawaain mushrooms fresh is 10 grams which when dried equals 1 gram. So right here a person could eat 3 times an already "decent" dose by accident.

This usually isnt a danger because people up the black market drugs food chain (usually) know their strains, and dont usually sell triple potency mushrooms for the same price as regular mushrooms. But its worth keeping in mind.

Why dont people often go above 7gs dried with no tolerence ?.... firstly the majority of people want to trip but not "breakthrough", basically they still want to know at some level that they are still in this dimension and they reside on planet earth. High dose trippers tend to be psychonauts - people who have great respect for psychedelics, use them very cautiously and with purpose. Other high dose trippers tend to be idiots trying to impress other people,people not fully appreciative of what a strong trip can do, or people who have misjudged a dose.

Mushrooms at very high doses, will blow the mind - this is obvious and i will not elaborate. But what swim noticed when he started upping the doses was that the body load and other side effects became almost unmanagable, i dont mean stomach upset/vomiting, i mean uncontrollable full body tremors accompanied by deranged high pitch frequency shifts in his audio perception. Like a radio dial being tuned in, swim is very used of this with psychedelics and dissociatives and usually its not a problem but with mushrooms it became close to painful and jarring. And this was in a room which was completely silent. Swim wasnt afraid for his health at any point but was turned off higher dose mushroom trips.

Maybe swiy will fare better with high doses, maybe not. Swim can only speak for his own donkey after all.

But do be very careful - taking larger mushroom doses doesnt just add to the funny/visual elements , it can really turn the trip into an entirely new beast.

[Budha]

Originally Posted by podge

Mushrooms at very high doses, will blow the mind - this is obvious and i will not elaborate. But what swim noticed when he started upping the doses was that the body load and other side effects became almost unmanagable, i dont mean stomach upset/vomiting, i mean uncontrollable full body tremors accompanied by deranged high pitch frequency shifts in his audio perception. Like a radio dial being tuned in, swim is very used of this with psychedelics and dissociatives and usually its not a problem but with mushrooms it became close to painful and jarring. And this was in a room which was completely silent. Swim wasnt afraid for his health at any point but was turned off higher dose mushroom trips.

Maybe swiy will fare better with high doses, maybe not. Swim can only speak for his own donkey after all.

But do be very careful - taking larger mushroom doses doesnt just add to the funny/visual elements , it can really turn the trip into an entirely new beast.

This!

Last time Fredrick, my favorite little mouse, ate shrooms he did 25 DRIED grams. It was anything but bliss, and as the above poster mentions the body load is tremendous. Visuals are in a whole other arena and since that day, poor little fred hasn't been able to look at a mushy without getting nauseous. Other than that Fredrick is a totally happy, cognitive and functioning mouse, with a bit of an obsession with his female counterparts.

Fred would recommend however, if in the future he intends to partake at these doses again he will use an equivelent extraction of psylocibin.

[ianzombie]

Swim has never attempted to go above the 6 gram mark with dried Cubensis. He has found a great reduction in both enjoyment and enlightenment in higher doses and does not feel the need to put himself through it for the sake of saying he did.
Swim knows his personal limits and understands that everyone is effected differently, Swim has seen people talking large 'Heroic' doses with little or no effect and he also knows a couple of people who are very sensitive to Psilocybin and require very little to get a full on effect.

When Swim took a 6 gram dose he found himself to be totally immobile for several hours and in a state of confusion for a lot of that time which Swim found to be a waste of time and very irritating and at times frightening.

[BloodyMuffin]

because... it's a psychedelic. you dont play with psychedelics. you'll get your ass handed to you, possibly in a literal sense...

a massive dose like that would likely have very troubling lasting psychological effects whether there was actually any danger or not during the trip.

to put it simply, your mind will be blown. with a dose like that it wont matter how comfortable you are in your emotional state, you wont remember who ou are during it anyway.

[EscapeDummy]

Have any of you heard of R. Gordon Wasson? He's the guy that brought psilocybin mushrooms into the knowlege of the western world, in 1957. He went to a village in mexico and did mushrooms in a velada. The ceremony had a curandera, who gave mushrooms to those who needed spiritual guidance or healing (and Wasson) and then took a massive dose for herself, every time. I think Wasson wrote details about the doses, if you care to dig it up. So most people's high doses pale in comparison to the mushroom healer!

[nobbieq]

Monster doses huh. How about small doses? At 0.5 grams SWIM didn't feel a crazy comeup but was more chatty and did feel weird thoughts racing in his head. He was driving down his street and it felt eerie. In front of SWIM's house having a smoke it seemed as if all the trees were staring at him in a bad way eee...but this 'mini trip' did turn good again when on Facebook he saw pics of ppl partying and laughing it up. He then felt the zany, goofy thoughts going through his head but it wasn't as intense as it gets on higher doses.

Shrooms is a nutty trip!

[Phungushead]

Originally Posted by Insomniacsdream

Why do people never seem to take more then the equivilent of around 7g of
psylocibe cyanescens.

Note that psilocybe cyanescens is generally far more potent than psilocybe
cubensis.

Psilocybe cyanescens Wakefield, a markedly bluing species, is another
popular mushroom (it inhabits landscaped yards containing ground bark
rather than meadows and pastures) and is usually even more potent than
Psilocybe semilanceata. Psilocybin levels were found to range from 4.9
mg/g up to 16.8 mg/g dry weight with total psilocin plus psilocybin levels
reaching 19.6 mg/g dry weight — nearly 2% of the dry weight!

PSILOCYBIN AND PSILOCIN LEVELS IN TWENTY SPECIES FROM SEVEN GENERA OF

WILD MUSHROOMS IN THE PACIFIC NORTHWEST, U.S.A.
MICHAEL W. BEUG and JEREMY BIGWOOD
The Evergreen State College, Olympia, Washington 98505 (U.S.A.)
(Received October 20, 1980; accepted in revised form June 18, 1981)

Samples of Psilocybe Cyanescens Astoria Ossip (from outdoor natural
culture) and also Psilocybe Cubensis (cultivated on straw, indoors) and
Psilocybe Semilanceata (collected from their natural habitat) were found to
contain the following amounts (in % of dry weight) of alkaloids:

These results are in very good agreement with the estimated relative
potencies published in part 1.

All samples had been dried below 30 xC, and stored refrigerated in airtight
containers. Analyses were performed very recently by Dr. Jochen Gartz -
certainly "the" European expert in this field - at the University of Leipzig.
An American edition of Dr. Gartz's book "Narrenschwaemme", which
contains a lot of information not to be found anywhere else, should be
available this spring (3).

NOTES
(1) After ingestion, psilocybin is hydrolized to psilocin pretty rapidly and completely. 100
mg of psilocybin (C12H17N2O4P, MW=284.3) are equivalent to 72 mg of psilocin
(C12H16N2O, MW= 204.3), or - in oth"total" here refers to the (thus calculated, and
rounded) equivalent of psilocybin.
(2) Ps. Semilanceata also contained 0.2 % baeocystin (others only traces). Baeocystin
has effects on humans very similar to those of psiloc(yb)in, but is weaker (per weight)
(J.Gartz, pers. comm.)
(3) and prob from: LUNA, 6160 Packard St., LA, CA-90035-2581

So the equivalent of 7g of psilocybe cyanescens could theoretically mean
14g+ of psilocybe cubensis. Just wanted to point that out.

Anyway, I've shared Labrat's own "monster dose" (15g dry cubensis) here
before... here are a couple threads with that and other SWIMmers' high
dose experiences and discussion.

Magic Mushrooms and Overdosing
Taking a High Dose of P. Cubensis Mushrooms?

[rawbeer]

SWIM dabbled with fresh mushrooms, eating 30 grams once, and came to regard psilocybes as weak. Later he bought lab-grown mushrooms in Switzerland and he and a friend split 15g. Needless to say lab-grown mushrooms were much stronger than wet, field growns from Texas. Podge's comment about the side effects becoming almost unmanageable struck a chord - the predominant feeling is one of having been poisoned, and the "i get it, totally" of a good mushroom session is replaced by confusion. Full-blown hallucinations occur...SWIMs friend had a terrible experience, SWIM barely managed to hold on.
Every medicine and every patient have limits - for most people, it seems, even a 1/4oz is just too much. Heroic doses may have their places but in SWIMs experience they tend to lead to total loss of self-control, and the trip usually turns out to be something you don't want it to be. These kinds of experiences are perhaps best left to the dead and dying.

[Nature Boy]

In SWIM's experience, very high doses do bring about that uncomfortably obvious body load. It feels like a fever and you might very well want to dishevel (we have a thread about this: Psychedelic streakers; nudity and psychedelics) and maybe take a cold shower. On SWIM's highest doses, he basically hit a point of utter dissociation. He threw a party in his folk's house and drank a few cups of shroom tea too many. Basically glued to a chair for an hour, he barely noticed all the madness going on around him because everyone else was off their heads too. Senses got really mushed up. He was barely able to speak, couldn't really function because he was too preoccupied with the open-eye fractal visuals.

I wouldn't recommend this to an inexperienced tripper. Overwhelming is only describing it mildly. The huge ego loss can be stunning and this might frighten the life out of people who aren't prepared for it.

[nobbieq]

I think if people can handle an intense Salvia D. trip they can pretty much handle any psychadelic although SWIM has not tried acid nor mescaline. SWIM doesn't get how people get bad experiences from shrooms but it's cause maybe SWIM hasn't tried crossing the 3.5 g mark for shrooms

Reputation Comments on this post:

Dont post matters of opionion when SWIY has very limited experience; it adds little to the thread

[ReAlitY-HoLds-NonE]

SWIM's very first mushroom trip (long before he was part of the forum) involved a share of the first harvest he had been on with a friend: It was an epic few days out, and the harvest was left in his friends shed (heated) to dry out a bit faster.
The loot was shared roughly in half between the two harvesters; the plan was for the two of them to meet up later that week with girlfriends, and a four way trip was to be had between them.
Turned out, when the time came, something for SWIM's friend had turned up; he had to call it off but said it was cool if SWIM would like to carry on with his own tripping. SWIM rang his girlfriend of the time, to which she said she would be round soon; but didnt want to trip so hard first time round, and thinking as SWIM did, said that those "two portions" should be shared between the two with SWIM trying out a larger amount before she arrived.

So SWIM consumed roughly 2/3rd's of the dried shrooms, and began feeling experiences within around fifteen minuites (***RHN needs to remember to find a trip report SWIM rote in a diary the day after). These came on, VERY hard; he couldnt see anything beyond 2 meters ahead of him; the stereo he had music playing out of was, for example, beyond the basic understanding of "double vision" ~imagine vision to the power of eight, and you have a BASIC grasp of what SWIM was going through.
So SWIM sat down in his room, everything was fading in and out of reality, his rooms, his walls, his computer, the music he was listening to.
He suddenly was hit back into reality when his girlfriend called him saying she couldnt come by; something to do with lifts (neither of them was old enough to drive). SWIM then knew he was going it alone. He told his sister how intense his trip was, but she was tired, so went and got the dog for him to keep him company in his room. The next "phase" then ensued, where all the previous effects where had, where SWIM's dog seemed to fade in and out of the dimensions he was in, as would SWIM, there were times it felt as if they were moving through time (Imagine a psychadelic induced version of Mr. Peabody and Sherman).
Everything was moving out of time. No, this isnt the typical misunderstanding of time you get on psychadelics; if you imagine Dr. Manhatten; where he see's everything happen at once, oh yes, that was what this trip was like... All possible emotions SWIM felt that night, the whole disappointment it had been, and the whole overwhelming, overjoying experience of going through this, melted into one super emotions, where he was left crying, but, as quickly as he seemed to be crying, it suddenly ceased, a sudden disconnection was felt, and he was left with a rather philosophically talking dog for the next 2~3 hours of the comedown (which strangely occured in every trip he has had with his dog since)....

Next day SWIM measured his dry dosage he had left.. of which it occured to be just over 6 grams, meaning SWIM had just under 9 grams dry for his first trip. SWIM, unaware at the time of dosages, thought he simply had a strong batch or took a bit to well to the shrooms. He shortly found this forum afterward...

It took SWIM a LONG time to fully recover and comprehend what the hell he saw, what the hell he heard, and what the hell he thought; hell, it took him a long time to even consolidate the subject matter he and his dog had rather vigourously debated about. He felt "superemotions" that caused him utter confusion, and resulted in a great paranioa of almost every other human, as the chances are they are unlikely to have experienced such an obtuse emotion...

In short, it was an experience; an experience SWIM was stupid enough to have gone through due to sheer ignorance. While he doesnt regret doing, he recommends the opposite of doing such a thing.

Do your research. Anyone who does a "Herioic Dose" on purpose, is, in RHN's (+his dogs) eyes, not worthy of such an experience, and as a result, will not, at the best, enjoy the experience. If anyone wants to go beyond 7g, they should do so after experience, and preperation...

(RHN apolagizes for the brief nature of SWIM's report; he feels it was well suited for this thread, but wishes to find the original "skeleton" SWIM had wrote up the day after/a few days after the trip... Hopefully he will find that when he is back from uni next weekend)