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Opiate addiction Support for coping with Opiate addiction and Opiate addiction treatment.

 
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  #1  
Old 24-10-2009, 21:25
BDN67 BDN67 is offline
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has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

SWIM is currently tapering off of methadone. He started tapering from 115 MG and went down to 55 within 5 weeks. He paused there for 6 weeks and then resumed at the rate of 5 MG a week and is now at 40 MG.

He hasn't really had any type of WD symptoms to note. He is getting confused because of the horror stories that people write about......getting terrible pains by a 5 MG reduction when they are over 100 MG. He is starting to think it is either going to hit him really hard sometime around 15 MG or it will be totally easy all the way down.

Has anyone here had a really easy time tapering off? Has anyone had a really easy time until they got sub 20MG?
  #2  
Old 25-10-2009, 04:26
ex-junkie ex-junkie is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

once swim had a blind taper. her opiate specialist would communicate the dose with her pharmacist via phone, and it was unknown to swim the whole time. her dose was written on the back of the form that she signed after each dose, and she never once looked at it or felt any symptoms.

this was until a relief pharmacist came to fill in, and swim explained that the dose was on the back, and that it was a blind taper and the stupid fuck turned around and said, "oooooooh 1MG, right gotcha".

swim lost it and immediately started withdrawing bad, drove around the corner and scored to fuck off the nasty withdrawals. thus setting her back to square one.

the pharmacist had been putting a diluent into it, and she didnt notice a taste difference or anything during the whole time. she went from approx 60MG down to 1 unnoticed.

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Excellent example, SWIy talked herself into WD before she got them. "Blind detox" can only work if the user is blind to the amount they're using. It's an important point.
  #3  
Old 25-10-2009, 07:33
Cooki Gold member Cooki is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

The simplest answer to that question is almost cetainly: NO.

Swim has heard it on the grapevine that OPs who have reduced over 18 months to 2 years get through the 1ml- 7 days clean in relative ease, but others believe drawing your taper out like this is more detrimental and counter-productive. We all knew what we were getting into. I think this 'not rattling phenomena' swiy speak of is down to the dose you're on. Going from 100ml to 0 QUICKLY- you're right- these withdrawals would be v.unpleasant, but most people find lowering doses in small increments relatively* easy untill they get to around the 20-30ml mark. (*Relative to cold turkey!). It's these lower doses that can cause problems.

BUT..swiy has done REALLY well!!!!

Swim too, know the power of fear!! Swim thinks you have the strength to keep going and who knows? Maybe you'll be the one to make it through! (PLLLLEEEASSSE let Swim know if this is the case; she will follow your taper schedule to the letter!!).

Good luck,

Cooki



Wow, ex-junkie, this is amazing... because swim thought they must have to do it without your knowlege..in which case- well; they couldn't do THAT, right?! I've heard of this but thought that because you knew it was happening/going to be happening, you'd end up constantly 'looking out' for negative effects? I'd like to read a thread on this....(don't worry- I'll UTFSE before I ask you to start one!). Fascinating. Never 'met' anyone who'd had it done.

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awesome advice and very supportive post.
  #4  
Old 25-10-2009, 07:37
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

To be honest when Sparkles quit methadone she did it in a similar way to the OP, although not as quickly.
She was on 150 mls.
She reduced her dose by 10mls a week until she was down to about 70-80 mls.
When she got to 70-80 mls, she reduced by 5 mls every 4-7 days, depending on how comfortable she felt until she got to 50ml.
Then she reduced quite quickly, by 5mls ever 4-5 days until she got to 30 mls.
She stayed on this dose for 7 days then went for three days on nothing, then made the jump to bupe.
She was on 32 mg and reduced by 2mg per week, until the last 2 mg, which she stayed on for 2 weeks, then she stopped.
To be honest it wasn't as bad as quitting methadone alone. It was much more comfortable.
She does think a quicker, rather than a longer drawn out reduction, worked better for her. She needed to feel she was moving forward, not stuck at one specific dose.
She was studying at college from September (when she began her reduction) until the following September (when she'd quit) having something to focus on, a goal, took her mind off how uncomfortable she felt at times.
But she also found the fear of quitting far worse than actually doing it.
She also had lots of support, so if she was ever wavering, she had lots of people to give her positive re-enforcement, point out how well she'd done.
That was extremely important for her.
Sometimes we look for things to stress over, after all, if life is tough, it gives us an excuse to use.
Not saying the OP is doing this, but Sparkles knew she used drugs to alter her moods, and any excuse was good enough.
Just be aware of that.
The other thing that reduced the fear around quitting was she reduced her dose a week before her doctor was due to review her reduction. Knowing that she could cope with the amount her doctor was cutting her down by made her feel less scared.
At one point she did stay on the same dose for an extra week, she knew she wasn't ready to reduce that week.
Also by doing it this way her reduction was in her own hands, she was in control, that empowered her a lot.
Remember, you've done awesomely well to get this far. Just wait and see how it goes.
Quitting drugs is so personal to everyone, you may find that because you seem so focused and positive, it will help.
Good luck for the future, and well done again.
Sparkles.
  #5  
Old 25-10-2009, 07:45
ex-junkie ex-junkie is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cooki View Post



Wow, ex-junkie, this is amazing... because swim thought they must have to do it without your knowlege..in which case- well; they couldn't do THAT, right?! I've heard of this but thought that because you knew it was happening/going to be happening, you'd end up constantly 'looking out' for negative effects? I'd like to read a thread on this....(don't worry- I'll UTFSE before I ask you to start one!). Fascinating. Never 'met' anyone who'd had it done.
it wasnt a quick taper, in fact it was 1MG a week, and 2 MG the next week, and continued until it was down to 1MG. swim isnt sure that made sense so shell put it in these terms...


start dose: 60MG (approx)
week 1: 59MG
week 2: 57MG
week 3: 56MG
week 4: 54MG... and so on..

in all honesty swims perception of time was shitty, so she had no idea she was on such a small amount. she honestly thought she was on approx 25-30MG by then.

Last edited by ex-junkie; 25-10-2009 at 23:51. Reason: OMFG FORGOT TO SWIM!
  #6  
Old 25-10-2009, 16:34
BDN67 BDN67 is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

SWIM is actually on the methadone program for the second time. He got off the first time after a year, about the same amount of time as this time except he got up to 140 then. The first week then he dropped 25 MG and didn't feel anything. He went 5 MG a week until he got down to 5 MG then jumped off after a week. He doesn't remember it being bad at all.

anyone else go 5 MG a week all the way down? what was it like?

The first time he did the drop it was really easy....so easy he thought that everyone was crazy for saying it was hard. He thinks that it is because he was very positive and really wanted to get off. Just like you said the blind taper was really easy, I think the mental portion of it plays as big of a part as the physical addiction.

SWIM kind of fears that this time it is going to bite him in the ass since last time was so easy. Your body should react the same though, right? He was actually up to a higher methadone level the first time so with less MD this time for a bit shorter time period he should have similar results, right?

SWIM was hoping to hear from other people who have heard about similar experiences. He is hoping that this time is just as easy and is very motivated and positive towards the taper. He wants to be prepared, though, and hopefully hear some things that will confirm his confidence.
  #7  
Old 25-10-2009, 17:10
Dickon Dickon is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

Ah,

The perennial methadone tapering speed question! I think ex-junkie's experience of the blind taper and research on this (check the file archive or failing that google it) seems to show how much of the withdrawal is related to expectations.

My cat has tapered down from 150mg to 30mg (or was it 25mg?) once by 5mg a day with no problems whatsoever. He more recently quit from 225mg a day by cutting down by roughly 5mg a day (faster at the beginning), and it really wasn't bad at all until he got below 40mg/day. However, after he quit he had a fairly bad time for some weeks. I've written about it here: Screaming in the night air.

I do think the bottom end of a taper is in general the worst part. One happy story is that I have a friend who quit from an 85mg/90mg a day script by tapering down over 18 months. He claims it was painless, using a little lofexidine when he jumped from 5mg/day at the end. I don't think this would ever have worked for cat as he's too impatient for this method, and I guess it's a case of matching the speed of taper to your own psychology. Cat once quit from 200mg/day with only one day at 100mg and then nothing. This wasn't pretty, but was doable with some clonidine.

If you are sure this is a one time thing and you'll never go through a withdrawal again, I think it will be easier to go through. Your confidence is great to see and will really help you get through.

My cat is now over a year away from his last taper and is so glad to be away from it. Life is so much better for him without methadone! Think positive and get yourself free.

All best wishes

Dickon

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Nice advice for the OP.
  #8  
Old 06-11-2009, 04:46
w//e w//e is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

SWIM had a very easy time tapering. The dose went down 2 mgs per week on 2 separate days- 1mg + 1 mg. Never noticed a thing because in swims mind it is all in the mind.
The issue began when the taper was forced to stop at 8 mgs. due to an unforseen hospitalization. Thats when the nightmare began but that was 3 years ago and all is great now.
  #9  
Old 29-12-2009, 18:47
Crackedup Crackedup is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

SWIM has been tapering off methadone for the last 6 months from 100ml in 5ml a week steps until 20ml, then 2ml steps every 4-5 days. They are now down to just 2ml a day, and coming off completely in 3 days time.

It has been fairly easy the most difficult time being around 25ml then easier below that.

The issue SWIM's found with methadone is that unless on a very high dose the effects seem to wear off a few hours before the next dose is due. Luckily the dose can now be taken home as it was always a bit uncomfortable before the daily pickup at the chemists.

It has been a much easier ride since then as the dose can be taken before getting out of bed each morning. Also on a dose below about 40ml they've found it useful to split the dose to stop from rattling later on, taking about 2/3rd in the morning and 1/3rd later in the day.

Having the odd diazepam on hand always helps to get through the rough times too! Hope this helps.

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thanks for sharing-swiy is spot-on about low doses not holding(good 'swimming' too!)
thanks for postingsharing swiy's experience- helpful and answers question well
  #10  
Old 30-12-2009, 06:06
ex-junkie ex-junkie is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

you know, people dont have to get down to 20MG. why prolong the agony for any longer than is necessary.

one way of doing it, is to switch to a weaker opiate for a week and then commence short bupe taper.

or do what swim did, she went 3 days without methadone, then commenced bupe- she was on 55MG when she did this, but also purchased street doses. her dose could have been anywhere between 55-120MG daily. it only took swim 5 days for the bupe part of the detox and it was easy! that took 9 days of her life, and she was able to go onto naltrexone on day 9.

im not sure how they work naltrexone induction around the world, but i do know they flush people with narcan which has the same effect- only the naltrexone is longer acting, making it better to use for "flushing" than narcan. (small naltrexone doses= 1-2MG every couple of hours). **please note for anyone silly enough to try this on their own, that benzos, clonidine, promethazine injection in the butt enabled swim to do this transition without hanging like a motherfucker.


read this thread for dosing, medication combinations.. http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=112851

Last edited by ex-junkie; 30-12-2009 at 06:12.
  #11  
Old 07-01-2010, 09:58
jloops jloops is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crackedup View Post
SWIM has been tapering off methadone for the last 6 months from 100ml in 5ml a week steps until 20ml, then 2ml steps every 4-5 days. They are now down to just 2ml a day, and coming off completely in 3 days time.
Way to go, swiy. Swim guesses this answers the OP's question more or less in the affirmative. Swim always thought it was possible... 20 and counting (down!) for swim's part...
  #12  
Old 08-01-2010, 06:11
moda00 moda00 is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

great to hear, as swim is in the early stages of tapering off mmt. she is supposed to decide when and how to decrease, each week having the option for that week's doses, and can go down by 2-6 mg at a time per 24 hour period (1-3 mg per dose, but on a split- q12 hr- dose that is) she has made a couple 2 mg reductions and has honestly felt really awful, but thinks a lot of her symptoms which may feel like withdrawal are due to her inadequately treated thyroid issues and changes in another medication she takes as opposed to the small mmt reduction, but it sucks having the psychological aspect and wondering/surmising how she could feel such a small reduction so strongly- she has to think that she is not feeling the methadone at all but it is other health/medication stuff going on and hopes that her endocrine appointment this week will help with some of the other concerns, as will catching up on sleep (that really does her in).

When swim came down 30 mg over the course of about 5-6 weeks, very rapidly, she didn't feel a thing, but once she got to the point where she did start feeling it, that is when she restabilized for awhile. Her current taper is the continuation of that, so she is already down 30-some from her highest dosing point, but is taking this portion of things really slowly as it's not worth feeling crummy or struggling with schoolwork or parenting or god forbid, relapsing, and she is cutting herself some slack now since the other minor medical issues/meds are getting sorted, but in the meantime, she just wanted to let OP know that she did drop 5 mg at a time (each week) and not feel much of any WDs, and will keep ya posted.

Swim also knows of others who have had fairly painless tapers from higher doses, but agrees that many say to slow down the rate of taper if/when one starts feeling it and when one gets into the lower dosing ranges (seems that between 20-50 mg and on down is that point for many people). But listen to swiy's body and think positive!! Glad things are going well, and this is encouraging for swim to read during her taper as well.

The blind taper seems intriguing to me too.. I like the idea of being able to control swims taper, but also think that a lot of it is indeed psychological and that could circumvent that. But I do think if one can be really in tune with their needs and their body without the addictive mindset skewing things (perhaps someone who is generally in tune with their body via exercise, yoga, etc. and who has been off heroin for some length of time in mmt prior to tapering?) may be better off regulating their own, whereas some people might be better off having someone else design a schedule for them or do so blindly? I will have to check out the research referenced as I had not heard of that concept before. i guess for swim she finds it important to regulate since in the past the recommended doses and pace of increases or decreases did not fit her very well, perhaps just because of her body and the fact that she is a rapid metabolizer and has some other health conditions, maybe that affects it? but yeah, she just finds that she does not often respond to the same standard increments or plans well- ex. needing a split dose, sometimes needing to go up or down in smaller increments than most report ideal to gauge ideal effectiveness, etc.

sorry sorta off topic.. but swim would be interested, OP and others who have shared experiences, in what research was read, what doctors and friends told swiyou, and what swiyou swiyourself expected before commencing a taper, and how the taper did or did not meet those expectations? how long one had been on it, motivation for getting off, etc. and how one thinks that may have affected their experience tapering or their symptoms?

take care~! and hugs and congrats to those who have successfully tapered or are in the midst of it!

edit to add: crackedup references a sort of splitting of dose- swim does this all the time, except instead of 2/3 and 1/3, she takes equal ratios at a 12 hour interval- but she wonders if even for those who do not need split dosing when on the normal, higher maintenance dose, may benefit from splitting when getting towards the lower doses in a taper? I will do some research and see if I can't find any studies on this and post them up- I know splitting has been addressed as useful during pregnancy and as necessary for some individuals throughout entire course of treatment, but exploring it's use as a tool in tapering is a new one to me... it makes sense purely in swim's head though, that maintaining more stable levels of mmt in the body by more frequent, lower doses, would create more stability in the body and thus possibly lessen potentially uncomfortable symptoms during taper.. anyone else utilize plits for this purpose or have info on this idea??

Last edited by moda00; 08-01-2010 at 06:28.
  #13  
Old 16-01-2010, 01:23
deltakilo deltakilo is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

ISHO it's F'ing impossible. SWIM'd rather go ct off of H than taper off of M. SWIM went from 120mg to 20 in 6 mo on his own and the entire time was hell.
  #14  
Old 23-01-2010, 01:05
EastCoastAndy EastCoastAndy is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

Methadone is worse to come off of then heroin. It really has been in all swims experiences being on it

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  #15  
Old 23-01-2010, 10:09
Trapped_under_ice Trapped_under_ice is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

The truth is that it's generally easy to taper down methadone from large doses. It's easy to go from say 150 to 50. However the lower you get the harder it becomes. The last few mg's are going to cost you some pain.

Generally methadone is very difficult to taper from, it's best to get on another opiate when you're low enough and then take it from there.

Eventually when you reach 10 mg, it will be hard(at least if you need to do it fast). Also, you'll have to dose multiple times a day because the metabolites don't accumulate. SWIM had to dose every second hour when going from 10 to 2 mg. However going from 150 to 10 was pretty easy in six months.

If you want to do it fast, take a small dose DXM along with the done. SWIM used about 5 mg dxm powder along with liquid done(if you have tablets it's easy to make). SWIM used orange juice to mask the taste.

EDIT: The key to doing a taper is to do it by percentage of dose rather than milligrams. Cutting down 5 mgs from 150 to 145 is nothing but if you cut 5 mgs down from 10 mgs, you'll pay for it. Try to split the doses up as much as you can to get the blood levels stable. It's a little annoying to wake up in the night to dose but anything is worth getting off this crap.

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thanks for sharing experience and novel suggestions

Last edited by Trapped_under_ice; 23-01-2010 at 10:21.
  #16  
Old 22-11-2010, 14:34
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

AFOAF was on methadone for 7 years due to an automobile accident and subsequent back surgery. Since he was in recovery for alcohol he was against taking any mind altering opioids for fear of relapse. His misinformed doctor told him methadone was perfectly safe, he would not get high off of it and he would not experience cravings. Nor did he mention the addiction factor.

After 7 years of unpleasant side effects; weight gain, sweating, insomnia, constipation, etc. he decided to kick.

He tried the slow taper and just could not stand the near constant withdrawals. He tried cold turkey and it was too much for him so he opted for a naltrexone rapid detox. This, regardless of what the websites say, is NOT a magic bullet and there is quite a bit of recovery time involved. 2-3 weeks, sometimes a month or more.

There are posts about others whom have had a relatively easy time kicking methadone. Everyone is different and these posts are few. So my answer would be NO. There is no easy way to taper off methadone. Further, there is no easy way to kick methadone.

From observing AFOAF I believe methadone to be the hardest substance to detox from mainly because of its long half life and saturation levels in the body.

I realize methadone has gotten a lot of heroin addicts off the streets and I am not saying don't use methadone. I am merely saying examine and research all your options before even trying to take on this monster.

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Promsing first post;shares own experience in detail,adds to discussion and uses AFOAF!Thanks
  #17  
Old 22-11-2010, 16:35
Killa Weigha Killa Weigha is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

^^Exactly what the fuck SWIM talking about. The posts where "oh, that shit was easy" and "tapering is the best way"? ONLY if one has access to an arsenal of drugs for methadone side effects, drugs for the drugs for methadone side effects' side effects, drugs for depression, drugs for upset stomach, ad nauseum. Why anyone thinks it's better to start feeling increasingly shitty (during taper) for however long it takes then transition to absolute and complete shittines (after all the methadone has metabolized and the brain begins it's twisted mindfuck of a detox process) is WAYYYYYYYYYYYYY beyond swim's comprehension. SWIM stands behind his signature (below) 100%. Unless, of course, one has unlimited pharmaceutical access.
  #18  
Old 22-11-2010, 18:00
kailey_elise Gold member kailey_elise is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Killa Weigha View Post
Why anyone thinks it's better to start feeling increasingly shitty (during taper) for however long it takes then transition to absolute and complete shittines (after all the methadone has metabolized and the brain begins it's twisted mindfuck of a detox process) is WAYYYYYYYYYYYYY beyond swim's comprehension.
The point is, lots of people DON'T feel "increasingly shitty" during a methadone taper, and some people have put all their recovery processes & support systems in place so that when they ARE finally off of methadone, they DON't feel a "twisted mindfuck" at all.

Everyone's different. Some people come off of methadone easily, some people don't. People come off of methadone for different reasons as well, which affects their mindset and how they feel during the process and afterwards.

There ARE people, plenty of people, who have pretty much painless detoxes off of opioid maintenance drugs. Asking currently active opioid addicts if they had a good experience coming off of methadone or buprenorphine will probably garner you a "Hell no!" answer, whereas asking the same question of someone who is in a stable place in life, who also feels at ease with themselves and comfortable in their own skin will get you very different results.

~Kailey
  #19  
Old 22-11-2010, 18:18
Killa Weigha Killa Weigha is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

Quote:
Some people come off of methadone easily
With absolutely no pharmaceutical help? Cold Turkey? Really?.... REALLY?
Not sayin it ain't true but SWIM's known lot's of addicts who've tried (some even succeeded incl. SWIM). The word "easy" never came up in conversation about the ordeal. Do tell.
  #20  
Old 22-11-2010, 18:28
missparkles missparkles is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Killa Weigha View Post
With absolutely no pharmaceutical help? Cold Turkey? Really?.... REALLY?
Not sayin it ain't true but SWIM's known lot's of addicts who've tried (some even succeeded incl. SWIM). The word "easy" never came up in conversation about the ordeal. Do tell.
This word "cold turkey" gets used so much, when really once anyone stops using their DOC, even if they do a taper, its still cold turkey. I believe cold turkey to mean using your DOC one day, and then just quitting the next day with nothing to aid you, that's cold turkey. As far as tapering off methadone and feeling ok, I did it. I reduced gradually from 150 mls and made the jump to Subutex when I'd reached 30 mls of methadone. Then over a few weeks reduced the Subutex. I have to say there was so little pain that I hardly noticed I'd quit. Just a few hot and cold flashes, the odd sleepless night, but nothing I can really remember now. But it was 6 years ago.

Kailey Elise makes an excellent point, if you use the time you're reducing on methadone to get the thing and support in place for when you actually stop the methadone, it will make all of the difference. If you're in control and proactive in your own detox it can make all the difference, cos you're sending yourself that positive message, that you can do this. And that's what its about. I have to say if you're really not ready, or don't really want to quit, no amount of planning is gonna make it easier. Cos you're gonna feel deprived, and your mind will take you to places you just don't wanna go.

Get what I mean love?

This post explains exactly how she did it...

https://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/sh...84&postcount=4

Sparkles.
  #21  
Old 22-11-2010, 19:12
Killa Weigha Killa Weigha is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

Totally get what you mean and have more respect for Miss Sparkles and KE than self for sure. Now,
Quote:
I reduced gradually from 150 mls and made the jump to Subutex
is reinforcing the point we were making that,
Quote:
ONLY if one has access to an arsenal of drugs for methadone
Have to point out that's one of the weapons in the pharmaceutical arsenal. The fact is many are disillusioned by "doctors" who fail to mention that methadone "maintenance" is really methadone "replacement" in that they will simply be switching addictions. Nor do many "doctors" mention to the client that withdrawals upon cessation will, in many cases, be at least as severe as a heroin detox AND that most of the time it lasts longer.

May have to do with perspective, me thinks. In the US many do NOT have the resources available to us that the rest of the "Western" world do and that's SWIM's perspective. SWIM knows many Americans, including SWIM who have no access to health insurance (rehab is prohibitively expensive at around 20K) and we cannot simply "pop round to the neighborhood drugs clinic". For that we need to have substantial documentation of chronic poverty, prison or psyciatric facility release or health insurance.

Wow, this got log winded but merely trying to impress a different point of view on this (otherworldly) conversation. One from below, if you will. SWIM just don't want anyone thinking methadone withdrawal is a walk in the park if they are assed out (skint). Unless...(see the posts above).
  #22  
Old 22-11-2010, 19:51
kailey_elise Gold member kailey_elise is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

You are getting off topic here. Plus, there is state-sponsored health insurance for those who are "skint". It's different everywhere.

Some people use lots of "comfort meds", others just use clonidine (which is cheap as hell even if you don't have insurance), some use no comfort meds at all. The idea that an "arsenal" of pharmaceuticals is needed no matter what, by everyone who comes off of methadone, is a fallacy.

No one thinks coming off of methadone is a walk in the park - see the first post in the thread, where the OP was having such an easy time & was surprised, thus asking if such a thing happened to others. And then read replies, some of them from people who said "yes, it was" perhaps with the addition of a comfort med or two. Why do you feel that someone who has come off of methadone using perhaps clonidine for a week, has a less valid method? Or somehow lessens the "painlessness" of the process? It doesn't. It's never going to be a fun day at the amusement park, but with the right set & setting, maybe a comfort med or two (clonidine -or lofexidine if one's in the UK- & promethazine seem to be the best combination for easing the transition), it can soon be a thing of the past.

But, like Missparkles said, if someone doesn't want to quit drugs, or isn't ready to come off methadone, no amount of preplanning will make it a "painless affair".

Don't make judgments on the whole world based on one small area's experience.

Oh, and my best friend, Girlie, says that her pain doctor didn't tell her diddlysquat about methadone before putting her on it for 7 or so years (though Girlie knew about it on her own, thank goodness), and told her she'd be fine with 60 clonidine tablets when she abruptly took her off the methadone (& hydromorphone (Dilaudid)) all those years later. However, the doctor she had to speak to before starting the methadone maintenance clinic was VERY upfront about the fact that it's substitution, and that coming off of it isn't as quick as a Heroin detox & has to be done slowly and when the patient is ready and STABLE IN HER LIFE, with a good support system in place to ensure success. No doubt about it, so there are doctors & MMT clinics out there that WILL let the client know upfront what the deal is.

It's still better than hustling on the street, living in the gutter, never knowing where one's next anything comes from. It allows someone to get their life together without having to worry about scoring or being sick. It can be a lifesaver like that.

Just kicking methadone will suck, like kicking heroin will suck, if one doesn't have a plan & support system in place for the after.

~Kailey, who is intimately familiar with being poor, homeless & addicted - and managed to get by anyway...
  #23  
Old 22-11-2010, 21:38
Killa Weigha Killa Weigha is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

Quote:
Why do you feel that someone who has come off of methadone using perhaps clonidine for a week, has a less valid method
N,n,n,n no. Quite the contrary it's a much better way. Just one not available to all. If it were they'd have been all over it like white on rice. OK, just want people to know that it's not impossible to do no matter one's situation, accesswise.
Quote:
state-sponsored health insurance for those who are "skint".
Very happy for those living in bespoke states and wish it were country-wide. It should be but, alas, is not.

Can we agree that getting off methadone with absolutely fuck all is hard or not? That "method" is not covered well enough in DF and feel it should be. Maybe SWIM should do that? BTW, never seen OTC clonidine or met a doc that will just see, much less write a scrip for, someone who just rolls up outta nowhere.

Sorry to veer off-topic. Just need to clarify misunderstandings. SWIM was afraid that some would interpret his remarks as back-patting or looking down on others' methods (guess it was) but lemme assure yas all it is not the case. SWIM wants someone coming here (DF) who is in his former shoes to NOT feel like they can't quit without those "aids" and just continue using, whether it be street OR state-sponsored opiates.

Yeah, way off topic, sorry. Won't post to this thread any more.

Quote:
getting off methadone with absolutely fuck all is hard or not? That "method" is not covered well enough in DF and feel it should be. Maybe SWIM should do that?
Defendant has done that and hopes everyone reading can contribute helpful comments, warnings and advice to addicts of little means who know they need to get clean but may not think they can do it "on their own".
http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/sho...284#post921284

Last edited by Killa Weigha; 24-11-2010 at 19:38.
  #24  
Old 23-11-2010, 10:51
missparkles missparkles is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

Killa...

I appreciate your input a lot, cos unless we hear all of the stories, get lots of experience reports on just how hard or easy it is to detox from methadone, we can aid or support anyone. I do agree that it seems that detox med like clonodine and lofexidine are easier to obtain from a doc in the UK. We have the NHS which, for all of its failing, does seem to provide a lot of help and support for addicts. And that's across the board, unlike the US where free health care varies from state to state. I think that's the tragedy, we hear so many varied stories cos treatment is so different, depending on location.

I do think the question of getting off methadone does come down to willingness to quit ones DOC. I've seen people back in the day when methadone wasn't available as a common detox meds go through hell quitting heroin, but they were successful simply because the desire to be drug free was so strong. But lets bring it back to today, find an example that everyone can relate to. Have you seen Dickons thread "Screaming in the night air?" That journal is a testament to a persons determination, whatever it takes,come hell or high water, to quit methadone, at a horrendously high dose.

Here is a link to that...

https://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/sh...ad.php?t=69742

See it as getting your life back, and it does seem to be less painful, simply because you're going into it with a positive attitude about the outcome. Believing that you WILL quit methadone. See it as a deprivation, a loss, and you will quit, but kicking and screaming, and it will be more painful. Simply because you believe its futile, no one can successfully quit methadone.

Apologies if this post has been a little repetitive, but sometimes I like to emphasize what I'm saying. I think your posts have added to this discussion Killa, cos we need all opinions and ideas. Cos who knows, that one little thing that you include in your post might be something that a person holds onto when quitting, that gets them successfully through a methadone detox? We can never ALL agree on an issue, but its our diversity that makes us human.

Sparkles.
  #25  
Old 23-11-2010, 11:33
Rightnow289 Rightnow289 is offline
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Re: has anyone had an easy time tapering off of methadone?

Pacman came off 80mls in two weeks. came down 10ml a day for 6 days then. 5ml for 3 days. then the really bad wd kicked in so last 5ml 1ml a day day. its those last remnants that are pure hell. Not to mention the insomnia that lasts for months. pacman still isnt over it but didnt help himself doin it. so quickly over short period. all he cud think was get it out of system asap. not sure if this relevant. he never thinks of h now just dreams about it

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