Spiritual - Bella Donna, How does one know when they are ready?

[LysergicButterfly]

SWIM has tried many mind altering drugs including, LSD, 2C-C, 2C-I, 2C-E and DXM.
She has enjoyed all of them very much, unfortunately, she is looking for a darker experience and is wondering when the right time to go over the edge is? Does she try substances she knows well at higher doses for a while? Can anyone recommend something darker with potentially less physically debilitating effects/potential death? or is set and setting the key to gaining this kind of experience?

[Neosapien]

No! No! Never use belladonna or any nightshade because the alkaloid content varies widely from plant part to plant part and one could easily kill themselves or go stark raving mad.
There I said it.
Now, I'm not sure what you mean by dark, but you might not really be talking about the darkness that comes with nightshades. For a deeper immersion in other worlds, a better bet would be strong doses of tryptamines like DMT and psilocin. Most of what you mentioned as having experienced is more in the feel good rather than visionary realm.
If you're really committed to nightshades though, I would start out with henbane seed burned on a charcoal pellet and inhaled, that's a good way to dip one's toe in the water and get an idea of the direction in which these plants will take one. One can move on to pipe hits if they choose - of foliage and seed of the various plants - those that contain the most hyosciamine are best for this as it seems to come over in the smoke more than atropine and scopolamine do.
I wouldn't use any of these plants at visionary doses orally on a bet, but some interesting things have been said about small doses of datura stramonium seed being used to potentiate mescaline. If a person felt that they really needed to work with these plants, the only close to safe way would be to make a standardized extract and start at ridiculously small doses spaced a week apart so that tolerance isn't an issue and once one arrives at a dose that dilates the eyes, proceed even more slowly because the differences between that dose and one that is visionary and one that could fuck one up for life and one that will kill you could be tiny.

Reputation Comments on this post:

	Great harm reduction advice
	rather hysterical and inaccurate, death is rarely a result here.
	points are exaggerated- "harm reduction" is not the same as saying not to do it

[Potter]

If someone needs to ask that sort of question, then they are clearly not ready by any stretch of the imagination.

These aren't "darker" experiances, unless you consider waking up in the back of a police car naked, butt hurt, covered in peanutbutter, with no idea of how you got there, a "darker experiance."

[LysergicButterfly]

Originally Posted by Potter

If someone needs to ask that sort of question, then they are clearly not ready by any stretch of the imagination.

These aren't "darker" experiances, unless you consider waking up in the back of a police car naked, butt hurt, covered in peanutbutter, with no idea of how you got there, a "darker experiance."

Well...hopefully the situation wont go that far, SWIM's girlfriend is very willing to be SWIM's sitter. She wouldn't let SWIM go that far.

[Potter]

What exactly is the patient looking for? Do you want to be scared? If so, why, and what type of afraid? Does the patient wish to encounter dangerous entities and challenge them?

The Doktor might recommend going into the Sage Lands asking for something "Alien, something unknowable, to be violated, made unclean." But that's not really a recommendation, THAT was a dark trip, one that took many weeks to cleanse and recover from. If there's one thing the Lady of the Sage is good at, it's providing answers to foolish questions.

The tropanes, they don't let you remember what's going on, they make the patient black out, at least in mid to high doses. There's been a bit of discussion on the use of micro doses of these plants as a dream aid or admixture, where the risk of poisoning is nonexistent. We're talking 3-6 seeds, at most, smoked, carefully. When one goes vie oral consumption,dose becomes far more difficult and the effects can last DAYS, it's a path for fools. Researching henbane beer will also result in some well tested recipes, but heed the warnings or, well, as I said, fools...

So what exactly does the patient want? Write it out, be detailed, give some back story and we'll go from there.

[LysergicButterfly]

Okay, well, SWIM wasn't planning on doing it for quite a long time, SWIM was planning on spending potentially a few years reading up about the plant, making very careful decisions, her girlfriend is willing to be a sitter and help out with research.

SWIM, as stated has taken quite a few hallucinogenic drugs and whilst they were wonderful experiences, there is still a need to go to the furthest plane with an awareness that it wont be pleasant, however SWIM wants to experience this for herself, almost a morbid curiosity that needs to be satisfied. It goes deeper than that though, SWIM wants to get in touch with that darker place inside of herself and she has been very attracted to the nightshade through a strange instinct. Another reason is that SWIM feels a fondness with the symbol that is "The Crone" and feels that she can get closer to "her" through confronting the furthest plane you can reach. She is not affiliated with any religion but that particular symbol is something she strives for and finds beautiful. She feels like she has a strong enough mentality to deal with the experience during and afterwards.

However, if this truly is a path for fools, then SWIM wont take it. Instead she will experiment with set and setting and never touch the nightshade. Tell her definitively now, if this is a no, then atleast she can stop the craving

[Neosapien]

I still say that it sounds like DMT is more what SWIY is looking for.

[LysergicButterfly]

SWIM has been wanting to do DMT for awhile, she knows someone who can obtain crystal DMT, we'll only know when SWIM has done it. It sounds wonderful though.

[Lady Codone]

Slightly safer but equally "dark" would be AMT, DPT or amanita mushrooms.

[LysergicButterfly]

SWIM loved Amanitas, I don't think she took enough to bring out the proper experience, it was very strange though and definitely awesome.

[Neosapien]

Originally Posted by Lady Codone

Slightly safer but equally "dark" would be AMT, DPT or amanita mushrooms.

I wouldn't agree that AMT is dark, my friend says that it's speedy and euphoric with a hell of a body load the next day. He is contemplating DPT and wondering why you refer to it as dark.

As for amanitas, I'm scared shitless of them - they're all over the place I saw two of them in a park right in the middle of town yesterday, the biggest one was the size of a dinner plate. There's a colony of pantherinas in another spot where I go walking. They're a deleriant like tropanes though, so they'd be much closer to the tropane experience than the substances SWIY previously mentioned would.
So if you like them...?
I won't get any closer than henbane seed and a charcoal pellet, thank you.