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  #1  
Old 12-10-2009, 23:34
fair_gamble88 fair_gamble88 is offline
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Bubbles when injecting heroin?

SWIM cant seem to ever prep a shot without there being a bubble left in the shot. Not big, bout the width of one of the 0's on the side of those 1CC insulin needles. Hasnt had any trouble yet and really doubts it is a problem but just wanted to get other opinions.

SWIM holds needle verticle but just as the bubble is the last bit of air it seems the gold shifts right around it.
  #2  
Old 12-10-2009, 23:38
chillinwill chillinwill is offline
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Re: Bubbles?

Hold the needle verticle with the tip of the needle pointing up and shake it. This should get the air and bubbles out. Red Rock likes to pull back the syringe first just a little bit before doing this so he can easily make sure that there are no bubbles in it and then pushes the mix up to the tip of the needle after shaking. Other people might suggest flicking the needle but Red Rock likes to just shake it a couple of times.
  #3  
Old 12-10-2009, 23:45
Dicemanstyle Dicemanstyle is offline
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Re: Bubbles?

Swim doesnt worry too much about little bubbles. It would take a whole syringe full of air to really damage you. Dont forget air is just nitrogen, oxygen and carbon dioxide ( i think) most of which your blood contains anyway. Seriously, swims never worried about a tiny amount of air.
Swim normally holds pin vertical, flicks it, pulls plunger up and down a little until no bubbles.
But swim guesses if swiy is really worried then just smoke it or snort it if possible.
  #4  
Old 13-10-2009, 05:21
MsBrownstone MsBrownstone is offline
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Re: Bubbles?

William S Burroughs said that, "if air bubbles could kill, there wouldn't be a junkie left alive.." small ones are no big deal..

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Cool quote, thanks for that
  #5  
Old 14-10-2009, 22:42
Picass035 Picass035 is offline
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Re: Bubbles?

Keep into consideration that a small bubble left in the syringe won't even make it into the bloodstream b/c it's impossible to get every last drop out anyway (think the region between the plunger and the tip of the needle). That is where the small bubble will go.

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good point
This isn't correct information, see the next post down pls.
  #6  
Old 20-10-2009, 01:41
Helene Gold member Helene is offline
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Re: Bubbles?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Picass035 View Post
Keep into consideration that a small bubble left in the syringe won't even make it into the bloodstream b/c it's impossible to get every last drop out anyway (think the region between the plunger and the tip of the needle). That is where the small bubble will go.
This isn't strictly true at all.

Syringes are medical-grade equipment, (at least they should be) perfectly calibrated to deliver an exact dose. So a 1ml syringe delivers exactly 1ml of whatever happens to be in it, heroin, water or air.

But regardless, such a small amount of air in a bubble really isn't something you should worry too much about. But try to get into the habit of ensuring all air is removed from the syringe before injecting. It's not a great idea to start getting lazy with your IV technique. Even if there isn't a huge risk involved with this particular issue, laziness will spread to other, more vital areas of your IV practice.

H

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the right info, like always!

Last edited by Helene; 25-10-2009 at 14:04.
  #7  
Old 20-10-2009, 20:29
Esmerelda Esmerelda is offline
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Re: Bubbles?

Agreed that small bubbles aren't really a danger. It would be hard to inject enough to cause a heart attack with a small syringe. There's a higher risk for people injecting in the neck or groin, or anywhere that requires larger syringes. But to be on the safe side always remove as much air as you can - it's good practice and sloppyness in one area can lead to general sloppyness and poor injecting technique.
  #8  
Old 24-10-2009, 01:54
deltakilo deltakilo is offline
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Re: Bubbles?

Just out of curiosity, how much air exactly would be required to cause a catastrophic health issue? If one were to inject a small amount of air, say .1cc, where would it go? How/when would it leave your body?

Thanks.
  #9  
Old 25-10-2009, 10:36
tourniquet tourniquet is offline
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Re: Bubbles?

The point in all the air bubbles phobia is that that bubble will reach your heart and make it stop (cardiac arrest). BUT...it takes a huge bubble to really make it stop, I read somewhere something like between 100 and 300ml of air all at once, so...minor worry.
This is said to be the best method to murder someone(they cant detect the reason at autopsy), the only problem is that it's close to impossibleto do it.
  #10  
Old 25-10-2009, 12:15
fnord fnord is offline
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Re: Bubbles?

As said venous air embolism (VAE)(air injected into a vein) air into a VEIN is nothing to really worry about in small amounts,it would take a very large bubble making it's way into the heart in order to casue any damage,larger amounts can lead to severe neurologic injury, cardiovascular collapse, and even death. The factors that determine the subsequent morbidity and mortality in VAE include the rate of air entrainment, the volume of air introduced, and the position of the patient at the time of the embolism.

However if you are one who injects into arterys(note: DANGERUS) then air bubbles can cause damage in small amounts,air bubbles in the artery can stop the flow of blood to that artery/region of the body.

Last edited by fnord; 26-10-2009 at 11:02.
  #11  
Old 25-10-2009, 12:34
Helene Gold member Helene is offline
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Re: Bubbles?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fnord View Post
However if you are one who injects into arterys(note: DANGERUS) then air bubbles can cause damage in small amounts,air bubbles in the artery can stop the flow of blood to that artery/region of the body.
Er.... no-one injects heroin into arteries intentionally..! It's pointless, dangerous, unbelievably painful and really rather stupid for many more reasons other than just air-bubble related risks.

Just to clarify: injecting heroin into arteries is not an option. Firstly, it won't work - you won't feel the hit. Also, your whole arm will turn red and swell up to twice its size, you'll risk necrosis of tissue, loss of the limb, and, more to the point, it is unbelievably fucking painful. So even if you wanted to, you wouldn't be able to inject a whole hit into one.

For more info on hitting arteries, how to avoid it, and what to do if it happens, check out this post here:
http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/sho...62&postcount=9

H

Last edited by Helene; 26-10-2009 at 21:21.
  #12  
Old 26-10-2009, 11:04
fnord fnord is offline
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Re: Bubbles when injecting heroin?

Nope most users wont be injecting into arterys on purpose but im sure there are some users who've already destroyed all there veins use intrartial injections so i put the warning out there.

Grandma knows one person who injected into there neck once,so im sure there's more idiots out ther who will do anything it takes to get that hit into them.
  #13  
Old 26-10-2009, 14:55
tourniquet tourniquet is offline
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Re: Bubbles when injecting heroin?

One can't "use" intra arterial injections, for the simple reason they dont work, AT ALL. They wont even take your WD away, so it's not a use thing, it s a miss thing.
Felt the need to underline this
  #14  
Old 26-10-2009, 16:24
fnord fnord is offline
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Re: Bubbles when injecting heroin?

I always thought they were just as effective as IM shots but far more dangerous. Can you find a reference for this?
  #15  
Old 30-11-2009, 00:40
Psychonautica Psychonautica is offline
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Re: Bubbles when injecting heroin?

the problem with arteries, besides all the above mentioned problems is that the blood pressure pushes back on the needle so you can't really push the plunger down. Swim hit an artery once, and knew something was wrong when the plunger was "stuck". But yeah, arteries are a no go. Definitely.
  #16  
Old 01-12-2009, 00:13
Naked Lunch Naked Lunch is offline
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Re: Bubbles when injecting heroin?

A few little bubbles wont hurt you, swims seen a bubble the size of half of a 1ml insulin syringe being injected into a vein and the person lived. It "apparently' takes more than 1ml of air to kill you...."apparently"!
  #17  
Old 17-12-2009, 05:31
speedfreakkk speedfreakkk is offline
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Re: Bubbles when injecting heroin?

swim knows of a doctor who committed suicide via a venous air embolism. sir used a very large needle, probably 10 units (swim is considering the typical insulin rig as one unit). it is very difficult to do accidentally, and is actually more a concern of neurosurgeons- a nicked artery will literally suck air in as a result of gravity. i digress,

"The key factors determining the degree of morbidity and mortality in venous air emboli are related to the volume of gas entrainment, the rate of accumulation, and the patient’s position at the time of the event"

swim was quite fascinated with vae's.
  #18  
Old 17-12-2009, 05:50
pinksox pinksox is offline
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Re: Bubbles when injecting heroin?

Quote:
A few little bubbles wont hurt you, swims seen a bubble the size of half of a 1ml insulin syringe being injected into a vein and the person lived. It "apparently' takes more than 1ml of air to kill you...."apparently"!
Into a vein a LOT more air. A few bubbles in a syringe is absolutely nothing to worry about. Every now and again, someone will set up an IV drip beforehand and for whatever reason not run the saline down to the end of the line. If the person hooked up the IV later doesn't check and catch it, that usually results in an entire IV tubing line of air being put into the patients. SWIM's never seen any ill-effects from these little mishaps and the patients don't even feel it--and that considerably more air that a few bubbles in a 1cc syringe. The whole air-bubble thing is pretty much an old wives tales. If one really worries about it, point the needle upwards, make an ok sign with the thumb and middle finger and give the barrel a few sharp taps by flicking the middle finger against it. That should cause the bubble/s to rise to the top where they can be expressed with the plunger.

Now a large airbubble in an main arterial vessel would be another story. But again we're talking large here. And, if its big enough to cause death, than an air embolism most certainly would/could/can be detected on autopsy 9 times out of 10.

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air in syringe, heroin use, injecting help, intravenous help, intravenous heroin, iv heroin, venous air embolism

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