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Pharmacology How drugs affect the workings of the human body.

 
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  #1  
Old 17-05-2009, 21:03
NeuroChi NeuroChi is offline
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Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

My question is; what are the real short term and long term physical dangers of combining uppers and downers? I'm referring to cardiovascular problems specifically.

It's more clear why combining multiple uppers or multiple downers causes problems, like in the event of a combination of depressants where the heart rate slows down too much limiting oxygen supply to the brain, or in a combination of amphetamines which place a lot of strain on the heart.

EDIT: Scientific evidence and/or journal articles explaining this would be appreciated. It seems as though there are not many detailing the dangers of such a combination.

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Good specific information requested
Great idea for a thread!

Last edited by NeuroChi; 22-02-2010 at 05:11.
  #2  
Old 17-05-2009, 22:07
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants

I'm not an expert on the subject, but I believe mixing stimulants and depressants in high doses has the potential to cause acute (short term) heart failure, the reason being that both drugs send different messages to the cardiovascular system, causing dangerous arrhythmias. Not so sure about the long term effects, although it would seem the constant change in blood pressure and heart rate may wear out the heart faster.
  #3  
Old 13-07-2009, 03:06
NeuroChi NeuroChi is offline
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants

I am not educated in the subject, but I suppose that makes sense. Does anyone else have any input on the subject?
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Old 13-07-2009, 14:02
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

The supposed extreme danger with mixing powerful stimulants with "downers" is for the most part a fallacy. Generally opioids are the drugs that are mixed with various stimulants, often IV. The real danger is just as it would be with either drug taken solo, the danger of overdose. If someone were to IV a cocaine/heroin speedball the danger of heroin overdose would still be there, the stimulant effect of cocaine would not counteract it but it might serve to mask the signs of overdose.

It's not a good idea but it isn't quite as dangerous as the practice is often made out to be, celebrity deaths contribute to the myth around it I suppose.
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Old 22-07-2009, 20:36
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

In the 1960's-80's, a number of U.S. companies marketed just such drugs. Anyone remember "green and clears"? Dexostat I think is the only one still made. Most were designed for a smoother response or smoother come down. Bad press cost us a lot of good products.
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Old 22-07-2009, 22:19
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

Quote:
Originally Posted by nibble View Post
The supposed extreme danger with mixing powerful stimulants with "downers" is for the most part a fallacy. Generally opioids are the drugs that are mixed with various stimulants, often IV. The real danger is just as it would be with either drug taken solo, the danger of overdose. If someone were to IV a cocaine/heroin speedball the danger of heroin overdose would still be there, the stimulant effect of cocaine would not counteract it but it might serve to mask the signs of overdose.

It's not a good idea but it isn't quite as dangerous as the practice is often made out to be, celebrity deaths contribute to the myth around it I suppose.
Swim is new to all of this. But she thought a heroin overdose meant death? How could a stimulant mask that?
Thanks.
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Old 22-07-2009, 22:43
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

Quote:
Originally Posted by missparkles View Post
Swim is new to all of this. But she thought a heroin overdose meant death? How could a stimulant mask that?
Thanks.
Masking the signs to others is what I meant really, slowed breathing is less apparent and loss of conciousness seems to occur more suddenly. That leaves little time to do anything about it before complete respiratory depression takes over. A heroin overdose doesn't mean death if you can take action quickly and reverse it.
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Old 22-07-2009, 22:45
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

Quote:
Originally Posted by nibble View Post
Masking the signs to others is what I meant really, slowed breathing is less apparent and loss of conciousness seems to occur more suddenly. That leaves little time to do anything about it before complete respiratory depression takes over. A heroin overdose doesn't mean death if you can take action quickly and reverse it.
Thanks. I just couldn't work it out.
  #9  
Old 22-07-2009, 23:05
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

Operating rooms will use stimulants to reverse to much inhaled gas, versed, milk of amnesia, etc. Narcan is fine for opiates. Amps of methedrine, if it all, can only be found in O.R.'s. Some people come out from being put under too slow, or for some reason don't fit the dose response curve.
  #10  
Old 22-07-2009, 23:31
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

Swim remembers green & clears very well.In the uk they were triple strength `blues`(formerly they were known as `purple hearts` & whenever the press did a feature on amphetamines they were always the ones they focused on)
They were cheap & plentiful & they really did the job.A lovely buzz.Strong but smooth.And a few of them would keep swim high for hours.
These days in the uk,if swiys can find a doctor or clinic that will prescribe uppers(& its a pretty big `if`) its always for dexedrine.And no matter how many she takes,swims never had a really good,proper speed buzz from them.

Sorry this has strayed off topic.But when swim saw the words `green & clears`,they sent her off on a nostalgia trip.So potent,yet so smooth.No rough edges.
And swim never had any comedown.
  #11  
Old 23-07-2009, 14:56
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

Quote:
Originally Posted by nibble View Post
The supposed extreme danger with mixing powerful stimulants with "downers" is for the most part a fallacy. Generally opioids are the drugs that are mixed with various stimulants, often IV.
Under what circumstances are opioids and stimulants administered to a patient?
  #12  
Old 23-07-2009, 15:18
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richi View Post
Under what circumstances are opioids and stimulants administered to a patient?
Who mentioned a patient? Your original post mentions nothing about a clinical setting, I was referring to recreational use. An opioid combined with a powerful stimulant, like the classic "speedball" of IV cocaine and heroin.

I can't think of any circumstances under which a patient would be administered an opioid and a psychomotor stimulant simultaneously.
  #13  
Old 24-07-2009, 16:57
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

Quote:
Originally Posted by nibble View Post
Who mentioned a patient? Your original post mentions nothing about a clinical setting, I was referring to recreational use. An opioid combined with a powerful stimulant, like the classic "speedball" of IV cocaine and heroin.
That's what happens when you jump from one topic to another but the mind doesn't keep up. I thought we were discussing administering opioids as a painkiller, and was wondering which ailment would warrant the addition of stimulants into my IV drip. Crazyness.....

Anyway, back to topic if possible: the short and long term physiological damage caused by combining stimulants and depressants.
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Old 24-07-2009, 19:11
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richi View Post
That's what happens when you jump from one topic to another but the mind doesn't keep up. I thought we were discussing administering opioids as a painkiller, and was wondering which ailment would warrant the addition of stimulants into my IV drip. Crazyness.....

Anyway, back to topic if possible: the short and long term physiological damage caused by combining stimulants and depressants.
Both the long term and short term problems would be those of either class of drug taken alone. There is no interaction or combined effect that makes the combination any more or less problematic than long term "depressant" or stimulant use.
Depressant is also an ambiguous term, while all psychomotor stimulants (I assume you're not including caffeine or such) share somewhat similar pharmacology the term "depressant" could refer to a number of drug classes affecting different systems entirely.

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Good information, easy to understand
  #15  
Old 18-02-2010, 21:18
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First time GBL use (moved)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sushi View Post
Contrary to a popular believe there is nothing inherently wrong or dangerous in mixing stimulants with depressants.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sushi View Post
However, there is no risk of "sending contradicting signals to nervous system" or something like that while mixing stimulants with depressants. This is not the case.


False. I do not appreciate you stating that my information is incorrect without providing any source for your claims. Please stop spreading this dangerous information that "there is nothing inherently wrong or dangerous" about mixing stimulants and depressants. Furthermore, you decreased my reputation because you don't want me to "spread unfounded gossip about inherent dangers of mixing stimulants with depressants" but I am letting people know the mainstream view (which is that there ARE inherent dangers of mixing stimulants with depressants). Why is a Palladium Member telling me that I'm wrong (and giving me negative reputation over and over) without providing a link to ANY SOURCE backing up his point of view? The conventional view is that it IS dangerous to mix these things and the burden of proof is on you to prove that they are not. Behold the following text from Ask Erowid:
Quote:
One thing to be concerned about mixing strong stimulants with strong depressants is that with other drugs this can cause increased stress on the heart and vascular system rather than decreasing them. Many people have died mixing cocaine & heroin or amphetamines & alcohol because higher doses can be taken while still remaining conscious. Depressants can also reduce the perceived side effects of higher dose stimulants. This is generally considered a dangerous mix of classes, so tell your friend to be careful of increasing their dose.
See how it says "this is generally considered a dangerous mix of classes"? STOP telling people they can mix these things with "no risk". There is increased stress on the heart and vascular system when mixing these drugs!

Do not give me negative reputation, call my posts "gossip", or tell me that I'm WRONG when you provide no evidence to the contrary. Doing so is arrogant, offensive, and not useful to people trying to decide if it is actually dangerous to mix these drugs. If you have no evidence to the contrary, then you are speculating or "gossiping" yourself. In which case, you should not tell people it is safe to mix these drugs which are widely believed to be dangerous to mix.

Edit: And here is yet another solid link pointing to the fact that this practice is dangerous

Palo Alto Medical Foundation FAQ:

Quote:
Question

What does happen when you mix depressants and stimulants together and take it as one thing. (Please let me know theirs nothing on the Internet about it).

Answer

This practice is really dangerous - for several reasons. First, your body is receiving mixed messages and you may not be able to predict or stop its response. Second, one drug may change how your body deals with the second drug, again, taking your control away. Each drug affects your body differently - so every combo will have different effects and risks.

Answered By: Nancy Brown, Ph.D


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There have been numerous threads discussing this. The claim that mixing stims and downers is dangerous have never been backed up by peer reviewed articles

Last edited by incorrect; 18-02-2010 at 21:53. Reason: Added a second reference (this one from a Ph. D)
  #16  
Old 19-02-2010, 08:50
Sushi Gold member Sushi is offline
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Re: First time GBL - never again!

I plead guilty.
I had a bad day and my reply to the thread was a bit too vitriolic and scathing.
My fault and I don't feel good about it.

Other than that, i.e. in relation to the facts I've claimed to be true, I plead not guilty at all. As someone pointed in the rep comment above (not me, I swear), there are many threads discussing the issue. I'm extremely busy today and for a next few days very likely too, so if there is someone willing to look for those threads or otherwise support my thesis: go for it, will be grateful.
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Old 19-02-2010, 09:00
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Re: First time GBL - never again!

Alright everybody, please settle down or I'll start having infractions dished out.

@Incorrect, there isn't actually any scientific basis for the "mixed messages" warning. Try and find any valid research that actually supports that claim. For users who mix stimulants with CNS depressants there is a high risk of taking excessive amounts of either substance, which also can lead to complications if the other drug wears off, leaving the user either hyperstimulated or seriously CNS supressed. There is no additional physical harm from combining, say Heroin and Cocaine (speedball), than there is from the sum of both substances separately.

Famous speedball deaths have either been detailed as being the result of heart failure from over-stimulation of the heart, as a result of excessive stimulant use, or failure of the heart through a serious amount of CNS suppression because the stimulant effect wore off before the depressant dose, leaving the, previously tolerable, dose of the 'downer' to become a fatal overdose.

Drug combinations, other than the effects of excessive dosing, are only more harmful if there is a potential for drug interaction in-vivo, such as in the case of Cocaine and Alcohol, a very common recreational mix. Inside the body the two combine to create Cocaethylene, which *is* more harmful and toxic than the sum of harm from both drug separately.
http://www.informaworld.com/smpp/con...ent=a713620555

[EDIT] Actually I recalled an old thread where I raised the whole 'uppers and downers' myth of additional physiological harm and, as always, nobody was able to find any scientific literature that could support the claim. There was, however, an interesting article uploaded to the file archive that specifically reviewed the pharmacological aspects of combining GHB and MDMA. This, too, did not find any specific increase in harm, other than to conclude that the combination had a higher abuse potential simply because of the subjective effects (within safe dosing limits), were reported as being particularly pleasurable.

Last edited by MrG; 19-02-2010 at 13:49.
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Old 19-02-2010, 19:36
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Re: First time GBL - never again!

I appreciate the follow-up and your information definitely contributes to this thread. However I still feel like both of you are missing part of the point.

There are no peer-reviewed articles that we know of on the dangers of combining stimulants and depressants. However it is easy to find established websites with information about drug effects (such as Erowid and Palo Alto Medical Foundation, both of which I have already linked to) that indicate the combination is not advised and is "generally considered dangerous."

I appreciate that we must always question the validity of information like this that does not come from a peer reviewed source. However given that such a source does not appear to exist, we are left with no choice but to speculate based on the information at hand. I speculated that it was a dangerous combination based on information that is located on extremely reputable websites (namely Erowid and Palo Alto Medical Foundation). I am encouraging people to mix the two classes of drugs with caution because the limited information available points to a general wisdom that it is a dangerous combination. On the contrary, you all appear to be telling people there is no additional risk from mixing the drugs (aside from a tendency towards excessive dosing) based simply on the fact that there are no peer-reviewed studies showing it is harmful.

Once again, I find the opinions that I'm arguing against to be dangerous speculations that it is safe to mix these drugs when there is no research to cite and major medical/safe-drug-use authorities indicate that it is generally considered a bad idea. You all have provided no evidence for your claims other than to say there is a lack of evidence to the contrary.

I am further incensed at the reputation feature of this website where I get a negative reputation for bringing up commonly believed harm awareness information and well-thought out discourse to this website. The fact that reputation is so fickle here that I get negative reputation for "unfounded gossip" and then for not having peer reviewed articles to back up my claims is ridiculous since neither a Palladium Member not the Moderator of this forum had peer reviewed articles to back up their claims either. Am I supposed to start giving them all negative reputation for not citing peer-reviewed articles to be fair?! There are no peer reviewed articles that we know of on this subject! I expressed the common opinion that has spread throughout our society about mixing these drugs. I referenced major websites that expressed the EXACT same opinion. It is simply ridiculous that people here give me negative reputation for that but it's okay for another member to assert "there is no risk" with no proof whatsoever.

The paper MrG linked to is fascinating. I'm interested to learn more about the specific effects of those two chemicals. However, where in that study do they ever say there aren't potential dangers when mixing those two drugs? I repeatedly see them mention that they are commonly taken together and that the GHB helps with the subjective effects of the MDMA, but I don't see them say "we looked for any possible negative reactions but we couldn't find any and we don't think there are any." You only linked to that paper and a paper detailing how dangerous cocaethylene is. Doesn't that leave everything else you said as speculations? Why are you telling me to find valid research to prove my view (the commonly held view) but then you don't provide any valid research to prove your view? I can't find information about lots of drug combinations but that doesn't mean they are all safe.

I feel like I have been ganged up on in this thread. It is easy for everyone who believes it is safe to mix stimulants and depressants to just keep repeating "there is no risk involved. you can't find a peer-reviewed article 100% showing how it hurts you so you're wrong" while giving me negative reputation until I stop talking because I don't want to lose more reputation. I find this is a dangerous standard to set in this community and I am honestly quite saddened by my past twenty-four hours here.

Edit: I would like a private message from a moderator telling me why they think I deserve this or providing an apology. It is unacceptable to be treated like this for trying to inform people so they do not hurt or kill themselves while mixing these classes of drugs.

Last edited by incorrect; 19-02-2010 at 20:43.
  #19  
Old 19-02-2010, 20:54
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

Bump. Recent discussion brought this up to mind again, I'm curious if anyone has any additional information on the subject.
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Old 19-02-2010, 21:04
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

Quote:
Originally Posted by nibble View Post
Masking the signs to others is what I meant really, slowed breathing is less apparent and loss of conciousness seems to occur more suddenly. That leaves little time to do anything about it before complete respiratory depression takes over. A heroin overdose doesn't mean death if you can take action quickly and reverse it.
Yeah, SWIM had a scare like this just the other day. She was using crack-cocaine and heroin. She began at around 6pm on a Tuesday evening and continued right through to Wednesday night. She's been using crack for about 10 years - 7 more than she's used heroin for, so she's more experienced with that drug, and she's used to taking a lot - bingeing with it. In a 24 hour period she'd bought a good few hundred pounds worth of crack, which is nothing unusual but what she didn't realise was just how much heroin she'd been using. When she stopped to work it out she realised she'd spent almost £200 on heroin, which for SWIM is a lot: she usually spends on average just £60 to £80. This was a scare for SWIM because she knows that heroin needs to be treated with a lot more caution and care than crack does. She was fine however most of the time until she stopped smoking crack. It was only then, when she put the pipe down that she realised she'd overdone it: she started to find herself struggling to catch her breath. Luckily SWIM was ok, but it gave her a fright and she realised that the stimulant effect of the cocaine had most probably masked the effects of the heroin and allowed SWIM to put herself in danger. SWIM won't be doing anything like this again.

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  #21  
Old 20-02-2010, 03:06
gonegrowin gonegrowin is offline
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

I can tell you a few of my friends experiences. He combines uppers and downers a lot, for better and for worse.

Stimulants + drinking: Usually a bad idea. My friend feels the effect of the booze less, and drinks more, resulting is blackouts and severe hangovers. Unless you can control your alcohol intake, this is not recommended. And that is hard to do when one is super compulsive and not feeling the effects. He is essentially a wide awake drunk, and is alarmed somtimes to hear about things the next day. He thinks that this could also result in alcohol poisoning, hence his TERRIBLE hangovers (puking ALL day, not eating, feeling like he has the plague). Benzos help him for hangovers, especially the when he gets the shakes.

Stimulants + opiates: My friend says this is fun. Opiates make my friend nautious if he moves around a lot and doesnt chill. And stims make him wanna move around... Usually results in vomiting. But generally feels good, stims can mask the good chilled feeling of opiates, however. My friend, with no tolerance, took amphetamines and maybe 35mg hydrocodone. He didnt even notice the hydro kick in, until it was puke time. After puking, he resumed his compulsive cleaning. The hydro masked the pain (as do amphetamines, to a lesser extent), and my friend was in extreme pain the next day from being so sore from the intensity of the cleaning. He would rather just take the stims and opiates on seperate occasions, unless he had a wealth of opiates.

Stims + benzos: Dangerous, yet nice. My friend says it can be easy to overdo the benzos, but my friend will not even think about stimulants unless he has benzos for the crash. They seem to make it bearable for him. Without benzos (or any downer to soften the crash), my friends has had some pretty nasty self destructive depressing thoughts. He knew they were not really how he felt, though.

stims + cannabis (does this count as a downer?): awesome. My friend doesnt usually do stims w/o cannabis. It takes the high to a new level, removes confusion (kinda), clears up things, and lets my friend reallllly get into music. It also removes the social anxiety cannabis may cause for him, like when he is too baked to make good convo in public. The stims let him talk like a babbling idiot. Helps him with the stim crash, also, but not nearly as much as benzo.
  #22  
Old 20-02-2010, 21:16
MrG MrG is offline
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Re: First time GBL - never again!

Quote:
Originally Posted by incorrect View Post
However it is easy to find established websites with information about drug effects (such as Erowid and Palo Alto Medical Foundation, both of which I have already linked to) that indicate the combination is not advised and is "generally considered dangerous."
Nobody said that mixing uppers and downers was safe. If you read my post before furiously ranting about how wrong I am, you'd see that I said that there was a "high risk" of harm but that it was to do with excessive dosing. I did point out though that, contrary to commonly accepted and unfounded speculation, there is no more physiological harm in ingesting two substances that do not interact in-vivo at the same time, than there is from the harm in taking them separately. You know why? Because there isn't any reason why it would be more harmful.

You can bang your fist on the table and shout as loudly as you like that I "just don't get" your point, but the truth is I do get your point, in that you're simply regurgitating a, supposed, 'fact' that does not have any basis in human biology. Just because the, oft quoted, warnings of sending your brain "mixed signals" and pulling your body in two directions at once, sound like they make sense, it doesn't mean that they have any basis in truth.

Seriousy, please describe to me the actual and real additional harm inflicted on the human body simply from the ingestion of a stimulant drug and a CNS depressing one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by incorrect View Post
However given that such a source does not appear to exist, we are left with no choice but to speculate based on the information at hand. I speculated that it was a dangerous combination based on information that is located on extremely reputable websites (namely Erowid and Palo Alto Medical Foundation).
There is a good reason why there appears to be no medical literature that actually explains the, assumed, additional harm. Because there is no biological reason why it would be more harmful. A doctor at the PAMF using the same, regurgitated, myth is not actually providing an explanation to even clarify what this additional harm might actually constitute. EROWID may be a valuable repository of information but, it too, does not manage to provide anything that explains the, again assumed, additional harm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by incorrect View Post
I am further incensed at the reputation feature of this website where I get a negative reputation for bringing up commonly believed harm awareness information
I didn't neg rep you. I merely replied in the same way I do to anybody who posts "commonly believed" 'facts' that are entirely baseless, by pointing out that, as there is no actual reason why the combination would be more dangerous than taking the same dose of drugs separately, we would need to see some supporting evidence that would explain where the additional harm was manifesting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by incorrect View Post
Am I supposed to start giving them all negative reputation for not citing peer-reviewed articles to be fair?!
No because we haven't been trying to make baseless claims, we've been stating that, as there is no sensible explanation as to how this additional harm might manifest itself, you were the one who was required to provide valid data to support your post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by incorrect View Post
I would like a private message from a moderator telling me why they think I deserve this or providing an apology. It is unacceptable to be treated like this for trying to inform people so they do not hurt or kill themselves while mixing these classes of drugs.
Oh please, really? Revisit the posts in reply to yours. Sushi already apologised for coming across a bit too harshly and you certainly cannot claim that I have done anything other than to detail why your claims cannot blindly be accepted as fact simply because it is repeated by so many people.

Once again, and please pay attention to this, I have not, in any of my posts, claimed that combining 'uppers' and 'downers' is fine. It is extremely risky behaviour that has found many people suffering a fatal outcome.
  #23  
Old 21-02-2010, 21:04
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Re: First time GBL - never again!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrG View Post
Nobody said that mixing uppers and downers was safe. If you read my post before furiously ranting about how wrong I am, you'd see that I said that there was a "high risk" of harm but that it was to do with excessive dosing.
Are you kidding me? You're telling me that I need to go back and read your post because I missed the fact that you said there are dangers associated with excessive dosing?

Why don't we go back to the post that you're replying to:

Quote:
Originally Posted by incorrect
On the contrary, you all appear to be telling people there is no additional risk from mixing the drugs (aside from a tendency towards excessive dosing) based simply on the fact that there are no peer-reviewed studies showing it is harmful.
See how I said "aside from a tendency towards excessive dosing". I DID read your post. You scolded me for not reading your post and then showed that you actually hadn't read MY post. Quite ironic. I want to be civil but you have to see how it's frustrating to have someone change my words around like that. Argue against my ideas, don't change my words around to act like I said something I didn't.

You still haven't addressed why I need to find peer-reviewed articles to prove my point but you don't need any source whatsoever to prove yours. This isn't how science is supposed to be conducted. It would be one thing if you all had said "we aren't sure if it's dangerous to mix these things so don't say it is harmful to mix them" but it is ridiculous that the forum members give me negative reputation, tell me that I'm "wrong", and claim they absolutely know it is safe to mix these things.

You keep citing that these drugs can't have additional risks (once again, aside from excessive dosing tendencies) if they don't interact in-vivo. But where did you ever show that they don't interact in-vivo? You've told me that I don't have peer-reviewed studies and called the concerns that I expressed "baseless" but you haven't actually provided the basis for your claims.
  #24  
Old 21-02-2010, 23:37
malsat Gold member malsat is offline
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Re: First time GBL - never again!

Quote:
Originally Posted by incorrect View Post
it is generally unwise to mix a stimulant with a depressant
This is all that was said about combining stimulants and depressants in the thread that started this whole argument, no other claims were made.

Whatever about the direction the thread took from there onwards.....

It is "generally unwise" to mix a stimulant and a depressant, for the reasons provided by MrG, particularly when both substances tend to induce compulsive dosing in users.

There might not be any "inherent dangers" due to pharmacological interactions but people who aren't educated and aren't aware that there could be potential risks are less likely to dose with care.

So in situations where users who don't seem to be particularly educated about the substances they're using are talking about combining stimulants and depressants, this is sound advice.

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  #25  
Old 22-02-2010, 04:56
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Re: Combining Stimulants and Depressants, uppers and downers

I'd say that one could provide a false sense of feeling for the other. E.g. using cocaine and heroin may lessen the mental effects of heroin causing one to consume more, but the coke may not effect say, breathing rate so much - the effect being that the person's breathing becomes dangerously slow.

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drug combinations, drugs forum, gbl, gbl combinations, mephedrone, sedative combinations, stimulant combinations, stimulants and depressants, uppers and downers

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