psychedelic mindframe?

[bizz]

This is hard to explain. When using psychedelics in the past and occasionally when using ecstasy (seemsspecific pills)I get on these mind trips that have these very strange thoughts that nowI'd compareto stufflike aldous huxley's brave new world, or the island, or 1984 and even some so-called conspiracy theories to an extent (new world order, big brother, ect). my thoughts center around these hard to explain concepts... I mean, what's going on the world becomes more apparant to me, the good and the bad are all very present, war, suffering, trauma and pain sitting right next to my feelings of euphoria and contentment. I begin to think that all of our unconscious thoughts and emotions effect each other in a very dramatic and profound way and that we are all connected in a very serious way.it feels so strange and enlightening yet eerie and i could see it being frightening although it's not for me.These strange experiences are the times when I've truely discovered who i am, who we are as humans, and what this is about. it's very very trippy to say the least.


does this make any sense? can anyone elaborate on this, i can never describe or pinpoint these experiences well.

[bizz]

let me reiterate.. can someone elaborate on the strange aspect of psychedelia (i.e. thoughts similar to the books mentioned above or big brother-ish stuff), cuz i get thatwith trips and (sometimes) ecstasy.

[Hyperreal]

Psychedelics can cause existential self-questioning - why am I here? How should I conduct my life, towards what goal? What is my life for? Is my life immportant? How can I make it important? A pretty natural response to this is to direct oneself towards broad social issues. When you're on drugs and start thinking about your own issues, what you're doing in life, your emotional and psychological issues, it might seem to you that you're being self-centred, that you're missing the big picture. So you start thinking about society in general. What are its problems How can they best be addressed? What does the future hold for humanity?


This is the cause of social thought for me, though others may be motivated by the need to follow their moral principles. I'm not, of course, saying that the existential motivation is peculiar to a psychedelic mindframe; it can be seen in many intellectuals throughout history who moved from the personal/ psychological sphere to concern themselves with social issues. Aldous Huxley, who you mention, is an example.


Is that what you're getting at?

[bizz]

yes, that sheds some light. i realize that psychedelics and ecstasy cause me toponder more on life andmore on social issues and also make the state of the world more apparent. maybe this explains the sometimes eerie apocalyptic tone to my trips, because to me thats what the world is anyway. when i'm high i tend to think "this is why the government or powers that be don't want us using these drugs", i think the mindframe some people get from these drugs is very revolutionary and a threat to the establishment.


my thing is i'm trying to nail the omnious eerie tone to using pychedelics, and i suppose thats just me taking a good hard look at the state of the world, soceity, and my place in it.

[Solidly-here]

Hard-to-Explain Concepts ... they're pretty hard, aren't they?


Well, bizz has thrown out a lot of stuff, without specifics. I will attempt to give my perspective (but without actuallyresponding to specifics); I hope I grasp what you mean.


"what's going on in the world becomes more apparant to me, the good and the bad are all very present-- war, suffering, trauma and pain [happily] sitting right next to my feelings of euphoria and contentment."


It is OK for me to feel euphoric when I want to; I don't have to live in a constant state of pity, just because SOME people aren't happy (or have died, or have cancer, or are at war). I can live through my own perspective. SoIF my Perspective (at least for this minute) is that the World is a Fun place to be, then the World IS a Fun place to be. The way I see life, IS the way my life is. If a person reads the newspaper (or watches the news on TV), he can find a thousand reasons to be un-happy. All I need to do is to allow someone else's pain (someone I do not even know) to ruin MY Life (one minute at a time).

Be in the world, but not OF the world. The World was set-up as a place where people can live a good-enough life focused entirely on worldly things (having a roof over my head, making enough money to feed and clothe myself and my loved ones, having all of the Goodies that others have... cars, stereos, fancy clothes, ... , ...). Then, life can easily become one of: IF (or When) I get this New Car, THEN my life will be worth living. Time passes, I buy that New Car. It is Fun, but not completely transforming my life (as I thought). So, I will find another THING: Aha! IF(and only if) I get THIS thing, then my life will be worth living. I am placing my Life's happiness into someone else's hands.


In Spirituality, the way I can feel is: My life is going along well-enough, as it is. If I get this New Car, it will be a Fun toy, and I can have even MORE fun. The key to Spiritual Life (as I currently see it) is to be grateful for how my life is going already (with its joys and pains). Then, I am actually living through my existence ... Instead of, looking to the Future to start living my existence.


Spirituality is another existence. The world fits into Spirituality as a Training Ground. When bad (or annoying) things happen I can either face them as proof that life sucks, or I can overcome that particular emotional response (in some way). Take, for instance, Christianity. Jesus advises us to each lift up our Cross (our pain, our trials, our frustration) and face it directly with love. In Buddhism, each person can water their seeds of happiness, truth, and faith, so that our reaction to life is gratitude and compassion.


Most people have a regular-enough life. We do not live in a War-zone; and We DO have enough to eat, and people who like us. An example of self-created hassles: A Mother gives herSon a household chore to do each day: Make your bed. This activity will last for (at most) 2 minutes a day. Instead of facing this task (and doing it), Sonny boy will not do it. Mom gripes (and feels violated somehow that it is not being done); Sonny boy is angry (Why do I have to do ALL of this, every day? Well, I won't.)


So, instead of spending a minute-or-2 doing something to make Mom a happy person, this TINY incident can explode in apparent size, into a control-issue: Mom wants control (do it for me), he wants her not to have control, he won't do it without a lot of hassle. The Bottom Line is: everyone is injured, this makes Life suck. One possible Answer:Mom can spend that 2 minutes, makingSonny boy's bed.Then she is happy (the bed is made), and he is happy (no hassles about making it). Their lives could both improve.

"I begin to think that all of our unconscious thoughts and emotions affect each other in a very dramatic and profound way, and that we are all connected in a very serious way."


This Physical world is set up to be a negative experience (whether you want to say that Satan is that negative force, or Mara ... it doesn't matter). Pain, frustration, and the 7 Deadly Sins (envy, jealousy, ...) provide ample pressure for a person to look at life as a Bummer. The Negative power in the Universe wants people to feel Negative. So there is a big Tug-of-War going on all the time (behind the scenes). But, even if this is happening, I do not need to become a part of it.


The Spiritual World is set up to be a Positive experience. Euphoria and ecstacy are OK to feel. All of the Positive emotions are available for me to feel. As I exercise these ways of thinking and perceiving the World, this Positiveness can fill-in more areas of my life. There is no complete end to pain. Even the Dalai Lama has bad days. But Spiritual Practice helps create more happiness in each 24-hour period, so that (on balance) my day is pretty good.


If I am in a room, filled with 20 happy, laughing people ... we are creating a powerful force, a powerful Positive force. It's a party! I am having Fun. Life is light and airy.
Now, ONE person enters the room. He is angry. The door slams. Several people see that he has an angry look on his face. Oh oh, he is angry; therefore I shouldn't be happy in his presence (sort of like reading an awful story in the newspaper). The Magic Bubble of happiness in that room can easily pop. Since many of the happy people are no longer creating their energy of Fun, the pressure shifts to the remaining happy people to keep feeling happy, so that the aura of happiness stays in existence (a difficult thing to do).


"These strange experiences are the times when I've truely discovered who i am, who we are as humans, and what this [life we are given] is about. it's very very trippy, to say the least."


Christianity/Judaism: God created the World, and everyone in it. Therefore, every person is a part of God. All people are in God's image. Jesus came to earth and lived as a human being, so God is man. A piece of each person is God, so we can feel euphoria, compassion, love, because God does.Edited by: Solidly-here

[phenethylamine]

I always think about collective consciousness. Huxley talks about that, he calls it the mind-at-large. Especially when on a psychedelic drug this is apparent for me, though I hold that not to the psychedelic drug itself, but to my own abilities. I feel that we are all connected in a most deliberately blatant sort of way, as we are all of the same consciousness. My thoughts are yours, and yours are mine. Our 'thinking voice' must sound the same. I believe the reason for all the drama and contentment is because consciousness does exist, and it needs to constantly prove to itself that it does exist. This is where desires come in, and selflessness vs selfishness. Physics describes everything as it is, and selflessness, I believe, is how in tune with the energies and molecules around you that are you, you are, that physics talks about.When I do something to someone, good or bad, suddle or obvious, it definately affects them but it also definately affects me, because all in all thatperson isa perfect reflection of myself. This is why you are buddha jesus christ the third, this is why you can listen to aphex twin with the right ears and know richard d mother fuckin james better than you know yourself, no matter how much you go tohis website and read about him and talk abouthim.This is whyyou already know what I'm saying because it is not I that is saying it.This is why we can turn on the tv and watch a fucking war, and why we can smile and be happy to be.It is reflections of us, our consciousness, one in the same.

[bizz]

i think collective consiousness and social thinkingsort of describes what i was talking about, and thinking about self in relation to society. maybe thats it. i do this without drugs but psychedelics seem to really amplify that type of thinking. idefinitely get on somepeace love and godtype ish and some 'whats going on the world' type stuff when i'm off drugs. thanks hyperreal, solidlyhear & phenethylamine that made things a lil clearer.