Need help & recovery advice- difficulty with multiple drugs

[blackdb1]

Swim is very low down in life right now! He posted on here about going to a day program about a week ago. Well they bullshitted him and wouldn't let him attend because swim has been abusing too many drgs?No one will take swim in because of no insurance and they say it can be a health risk detoxing with no ins. but swim has already detoxed off of the opiates but has relapsed a few times bt not enough to put him back in W/d. Swim cannot function without drugs!!! When he is sober he breaks out in crying spells, angry outbursts, suicidal thoughts, etc. Swim is very concerned about himself and his well being. He thinks he's going to have to go to the methadone clinic because he cannot function without drugs!!!!
Swim is at a fuckin loss of what to do? He has nowhere to go get help, other than counselling or rehab in-patient which swim is way to far in to have these as feasible options.
Swims mother thinks swim has 'killed all his brain cells" from all the drug abuse? Swim CANNOT be happy without fuckin drugs!!!! Period! His mother didn't realise until the other day when swim was telling the assessment counselor what and how much he had used. Swim was asked about certain classes of drugs and sounded like he had a fuckin PHD in medicine when he said he had taken everything from tramadol to heroin with oxy being his favorite opiate. He said he had taken most of the benzos in what he's heard are VERY large doses. 20mg alprazolam, 200mg diazepam, etc. He had used hallucinogenics a LOT when 16-17 yrs old DXM 2500mg doses, acid, 3.5 gram shroom trips, recently been messing around with amphetamines. Meth, adderall, ritalin, focalin. He also was addicted to cocaine at 16 but beat that addiction cold turkey before he found his true love opiates. He has used all these drugs at 20 yrs old within the past month excluding acid.
Any help or advice as to what to do will be greatly appreciated. Swim loves his fam so much and is a christian so doesn't want to take the easy? way out.
Swim also needs info on if it will be alright to take 400-500mgs tramadol and take methadone later on tonight if he can score some. He isn't sure because of the agonist/antagonist properties of methadone and trams. He thinks he has done this in the past but can't remember for sure?
Someone PLEASE help!!!!!!!!!!!!

[blackdb1]

Swim really would appreciate some help!
Swim feels way better now but he took 1mg alprazolam, 400mg tramadol, and 3 grams gabapentin. It has him feeling a little past baseline (slightly euphoric).
His aunt is in town and told swim he could go live with her thousand or so miles away. Swim thinks this might be the best option for him. Swims aunt has a very nice car that swim could have to get to N/A meetings or a day program. Swim also would have no junkie friends and no way to get a fix, He knows you can score anywhere but will not be trying to do that. Another plus is that swims aunts ex-boyfriend is a doc and she still is in a good friendship with him so swim could get some anti-depressants or whatever swim needs and it wouldn't get on swims med records.
Swim is thinking right now that this is probably what he is going to do!
If anyone could give swim some ideas on what route they would take etc. he would greatly appreciate it!

[beentheredonethatagain]

depending on where you live, there are many recovery centers that have some beds that the county or state pay for the addicts who arent in a position to shell out the dough.

If you want to get clean , do the foot work, make phone calls , call a 12 step program, go to meetings.

This is all I can think of at the moment.

[TheBlackPope]

Honestly if I were in your position I would take up on the aunt's offer, but you really have to treat them nicely, get a job quickly etc. If you fuck up it will make them feel shitty.

[sweetsugar]

Moving in with swiy's aunt does sound like a pretty good offer is she lives far away, swiy have a good relationship with aunt, and is last option for swiy?

In swiss's situation, not many ppl knows she has/had a problem with H and thats the way its gotta stay. After a tiny relaspe, which left swiss feeling very angry, lead to a bigger relapse that put her right back to sq 1 ..w/d. But hope is still not lost as she is moving away in a few months (which she knows is going to feel like forever). Far away.. Shes really hopeing this will be the answer, a fresh start perhaps.

Keep us updated on what you decide

[blackdb1]

Swim is now settled in his aunts house and all is well so far but it has only been a couple days so far. Since leaving home swim hasn't had any urge to seek out pills which is something he has not experienced since this became a problem. Swim is already starting to come back to reality, it has bee so long since swim has felt clear headed and happy. Swim thinks this is definately the right decision. He has got a number for a local N/A hotline that he is going to call after the new year. Swims family was very supportive of his decision and friends also gave him great support.
Swim is thinking it will only get better from here on. He knows he will have those bad days but is very confident in staying clean. Swim brought about 7 grams of some reg pot with him for those very hard times. Swim has noticed since smoking significantly less he feels alot better. He has been taking a hit or 2 at night which doesn't get him high but takes the edge off things and helps him get better rest. He is going to knock the big problems out first and quit smoking everyday in a week or two. Swim is honestly just so happy that he is finally getting this problem sorted out!
Everyone wish swim luck in leading a happy successful life. He is just going to have to keep his guard up when arriving back home. Swims family has just been so great in helping him get through this. He is ready to give up his self absorbed ways and make family and friends proud and let them know how much he loves them and appreciates the support. Swim is just really starting to realize how much he wants to accomplish this goal. Swim will keep everyone posted on how he is doing. Thanks all of you swimmers out there.

[umbra1010]

Im glad that you are doing well. Be prepared becuase there will be times when you think you need it when you don't. Stay strong.

[AquafinaOrbit]

Glad you are doing well. Just remember that giving into your urges even once can reset all the hard work you have done to overcome your problem. A main issue with drug rehab is due to drug use your brain has become to dependent on false Dopamine (happy chemical) production and without you will seem extremely sad. Just continue to fight the urge and eventually your natural production will start back.

[blackdb1]

Ya swim convinced himself for the longest time that the pleasure center of his brain was never going to work again. Swim thinks this was subconcious telling him so he could avoid quitting and go on methadone maintenance. Then he had what he thinks was an epipheny would be like? He just realized that he should quit and wait patiently for the natural MU, dopamine, etc. to syart working naturally again. Swim just doesn't think methad... is the option for him because even if it takes a year he will regain indepency which is something swim can't do while using.
Again swim thanks all for the help!

[thewomaninagreenhat]

I will keep you in my thoughts, and hope that you will be strong enough to kick this. It is terribly hard to stop any habit, no matter what it is.

Good luck!

tobacco free here for just shy of one month!

[sweetsugar]

What great news! all the best for 2008!!

[Lisa J]

Good luck it's not an easy battle SWIY are about to fight but one SWIY can win and one should believe SWIY can win even if you loose the odd fight on the way. SWIM is opiate dependent and will always be that way due to health problems so she will never regain "normal" brain function but she accepts this, what SWIM has to do is stay clear of heroin which makes her feel so fucking good to start with until she gets into the cycle of chasing that high that she can't get anymore no matter how much she uses.
SWIM has to put up with fentanyl, methadone and gabapentin which gives her no pleasure at all but does control the pain.
SWIM thinks SWIY have made the right choice but be prepared for moments when SWIY doubts it and seriously think about heading back to SWIY'S home and SWIY'S old ways, these thoughts will come but they pass too so keep on fighting. SWIY has a good life ahead if thats what SWIY really wants, take all the help available, both from family and professionals, talking through the thoughts and feelings will be of great importance if SWIY is to succeed.
Well done for taking the first step

[blackdb1]

Ya today swim has had some thoughts of getting on a plane and going back home. He however knows this is not the right option. He is going to stay very strong through this process.
Swim is planning on heading home in about a month or so. However he wonders if this is too soon? He doesn't want to be sheltered from the real world (his home). He figures after time though he will run into people here who have connections too. He will have to stay strong during these times. He just doesn't want to be dependant on being away from everybody and his home just to stay clean because eventually he will be back home and have the option to use again and he is going to have to learn how to get through those times of wanting to use while having the option to do so.
Swim has a question about drinking alcohol on occasion. Should he completely steer away from alc to get thru this? He knows not to swap one addiction with another and knows what that is like because he did so one time quitting opiates and replaced them with benzos. He is just talking once or twice a week to relax on those very stressful days. He knows also looking back on that last statement not to fall into a pattern of drinking on occasion because he could slowly slip into another addiction.
Thank you everybody

[Colby]

methadone is awful, it can get you very high once you start it but most ppl take it to get off of oxy's . Basically all methadone does is prolong the addiction, I suggest taking benzos, but not for too long or you will have another addiction. And benadryl will help for sleep along with the benzos. Hope i was helpful.

[moda00]

Glad things are going better for you and that you have a safe place to recover. I know people who have moved away to escape addictions and their using peers, and it has often worked well- a new environment, a fresh start, an escape from bad influences- but be careful when you return to your hometown, as you likely will when visiting family or friends, at some point sooner or later, or even to permanently move back. From what I've seen, the "geography cure" works, but these individuals seem to associate the town they left with using, and have tended to relapse when returning. If/when you return to the place you left, be sure to have some support sources set up, and don't go till you're stabilized- it's good that you are resisting the urge at this point, IMO. A month may be long enough, but you'll have to wait and see, as it is really an individual thing- also, make sure that you have some support when you return, as going from a high-support, low-drugs environment back to the opposite is likely to trigger the same using behaviors. An option might be to transition more gradually- an occasional weekend visit to ease into it before permanently moving back, or even a halfway house to ease back into your community without falling back into old habits.. Just some thoughts.

Swim too has struggled with H addiction, and tried 12-steps, inpatients, outpatients, suboxone.. after about a year of all that and things getting better and then quickly worse, and exhausting all other options, she chose to get on the methadone maintenance program in her area. Buprenorphine (suboxone) is another great option, since it can be done on an outpatient basis, unlike methadone. I commend you for taking such big steps to change, and having the desire to improve your situation- many people are able to recover successfully through moving, family support, NA/AA, various treatment programs, etc. I wish you all the best. At the same time, I want to let you know that if something goes wrong at any point in your recovery, there are always options- don't feel like a failure if for example you find that AA/NA/12-steps doesn't work but say church/religious support does, or that an abstinence-based approach fails but maintenance therapy helps, etc. We are all unique, and there are so many choices. I'm not telling you you will relapse, or giving you license to do so, but just want to encourage you that it's just a matter of finding what works and remaining committed to getting and staying sober, no matter what happens. I feel your pain- physically and mentally, getting sober is shit for quite awhile, and they tell you it will get better and you don't believe them- but swim will testify that it actually does get better. The suicidal thoughts, the feeling of being constantly out of balance, the discomfort with daily existence will go away. Like I said, it took swim about a year of trying to get sober before she actually got significant clean time- then she stayed clean for a year, followed by now close to a year of responsible/occasional use of marijuana, psychedelics, and occasional various substances.

As for your question about alcohol- They tell you to stay away from all drugs and intoxicating substances to maximize your chances of recovery. That said, swim did choose to drink alcohol in moderation during much of her year of staying clean (only methadone as prescribed)- after some time totally sober she chose to resume drinking in moderation. She never drank to get drunk, as her stomach has outgrown its liking/tolerance for alcohol, but occasionally shared a glass of wine over dinner, or had a cocktail or two at most. Since she's never had problems with alcohol, she felt fine about it. But eventually "outgrew" that too and now doesn't drink at all out of simple preference. I think that there is statistically a higher risk of cross-addiction. So swim's personal recommendation would be to go without for awhile and feel what it is like to be completely sober- that period may be three weeks or three years- see how you feel, and decide based on that. For swim it was three or four months without anything at all, and then through one year with occasional coffee or wine with meals but no other substances.

Also, it 's good you are aware of the potential for abuse/cross-addiction, so if and when you do decide to imbibe again, just be on the look-out for signs of abuse or dependence, psychologically or physically. It sounds like you have a reasonable approach, but just be careful. As for the benzos, as long as you don't use them to get high, or on a daily/regular basis, they can be a good tool for overcoming some of the immediate affects of quitting opiates. Again, just be careful. I think any step towards conquering addictions is a positive one, and while total abstinence may be ideal, it is not always feasible. So, two words- harm reduction. If you feel that using benzos for anxiety is helping you overcome your addictions and worse problems, don't let anyone tell you otherwise- that one-size fits all attitude. If you choose that alcohol and/or pot can safely remain a part of your life, again, don't let one-size-fits-all propaganda get you down. But DO pay attention to those you trust, such as the aunt you are staying with, or your sponsor, and allow them to give you feedback if they see any negative consequences or habits developing. We addicts are used to being so independent, so caught up in ourselves and our drugs, but a big part of recovery, as hard as it can be to accept, is learning to let others into our heads and into our lives, and accept their feedback as valid, and their intentions as helpful- one of the most important things IMO, is to find numerous people- relatives, sponsors, sober peers, therapists, etc. who you can trust to be honest with, and who can support you in various ways- phone calls to check on you, rides to meetings or therapy appointments, etc. Well I could go on and on, but I don't mean to overwhelm you, so I'll leave it at that!

Also, one mentions being a Christian, so if one can find support in that it could be a good option.

Best of luck and keep us posted!!~

[moda00]

Also as for opiate maintenance- buprenorphine/naloxone (suboxone) is less "addictive" (due to lower doses, the fact it is a partial agonist/partial antagonist, and also because of the ceiling effect on dosing) and is often an effective way to taper patients who are unable to quit through non-opiate therapies, and where the benefits would seem to outweigh the potential risks.

As for methadone, it is a potent agonist, and so can be construed as more "addicting" and higher risk than suboxone. However, in cases like swims, it was used only as a last resort, when the physical and psychological impacts of use were going to cause lifelong health problems, death, and/or imprisonment. Swim had several people tell her they were prepared for her to die, including her own parents telling her they had gotten to a point where they had written her obituary and gotten over it because they saw it as imminent (several overdoses, s suicide attempt, some legal involvement). It was a last resort, and while not perfect for al, is a lifesaver for some.

I agree, Colby, that physiologically methadone does prolong the dependence on the opiate, but it drastically decreased all the negative consequences of that dependence- health problems, criminal involvement, unemployment, mental health problems, and growing debts. So while swim's body is still opiate dependent at this point in time, the hallmark negative spiral of her addiction has reversed in a positive direction. Again, methadone maintenance is a decision to be taken seriously, and not for all, but swim doesn't believe it should be condemned across the board.

In addition, yes it has the potential to get you high- like any drug- but for swim and most of the other swims she knows in the program, are not there to get high, but to function normally and reclaim their lives- if swim was high off the methadone and nodding out all the time she would not be able to function properly in social, educational, and occupational capacities. On the contrary, she feels normal/stable at all times, and does not experience the highs/lows associated with short-acting opiate addiction and abuse. So for swim and some others, the benefits outweigh the negatives. I think non-maintenance therapies should be tried thoroughly, and then less potent or partial agonists like bup, but when all else fails it has a pretty darm good success rate. In addition, urine tests, regular meetings with physicians and counselors, and occasional blood test to objectively monitor the appropriateness of the dose and the blood concentration and the body's metabolism (peak/trough) are used to ensure that the methadone is not being abused. That said, the clinic I attend does tolerate "lesser" plant-based drugs, such as marijuana and mushrooms, as long as the patient has a history of compliance, keeping appointments, etc. You can't have as many priveleges regarding take-homes, vacation dosing, etc. but they do tolerate it. Which, in swim's opinion, is a good thing. Sure, 100% abstinence is good and works for some, and in her opinion is preferable in e