Talking to your kids about drug use, abuse and addiction

[insert_username_here]

What do all the SWIM's out there say to their kids about drugs? Do they try to inform them, do they advocate it? I just thought it would be interesting to get a look at how people surrounded by drugs talked to their kids about it.

[sclady]

My doll always tells her son to just say no! There have been some bad experiences with my doll's husband doing drugs to no end and thinks her son will stay away! She hopes so anyway.

[The Doors]

Originally Posted by sclady

My doll always tells her son to just say no! There have been some bad experiences with my doll's husband doing drugs to no end and thinks her son will stay away! She hopes so anyway.

You are wrong. SWIM is in similar situation where his mother has been a cocaine addict ever since he's been a young child. He's seen and experienced first hand the repercutions from the bad usage of drugs due to an irresponsible, depressed mother. Sure, these events make that SWIM has been more responsible with his drug use, however, it is important to note that KNOWLEDGE and TRUTH are the best approach to take when it comes to informing a person about anything, don't use scare tactics; the government is already doing that and we all know how well that works.

[Exc_quetz]

SWIM doesn't have kids, but if he did he would definately inform them on the subject when they reached a certain age. He would tell them the truth, and let them make the decision for themselves. If they decided they wanted to try drugs, SWIM would be ok with that(as long as they were 14-16+, depending on the kid and the drug). He would want to know what his kid was doing, what he was taking, rather than hiding it from SWIM, like SWIM did when he was a kid.

[insert_username_here]

I am of a similar opinion.

I believe that kids should be well informed of the harms of the drugs before they take it and if they were going to take a drug they should consult me first or do it under my supervision.

Still, I reckon it'd be pretty hard to just let your kids dive into the world of drugs willingly, legal or not.

[~lostgurl~]

I’d like to be able to write something that will make a difference to kids/teens when deciding whether or not to try drugs, but as life goes most people have to learn from their own experiences and their own mistakes.

I wish I could explain to the young ones what it is like to live in addiction. They are taught drugs are wrong and bad, they are taught of the physical effects drugs have on the body but very rarely shown mental impacts they can have on ones life. They think they are invincible and that they can just "try something once" or “casually use" and they believe they would never lower their standards because of drugs, because of course they have common sense, they won’t let themselves become addicted, the idea is unfathomable.

They have an answer for everything, and just saying "it will do this and that" does not always hit home with them - because it does not seem real to them. My gurl doesn't remember giving the word “addiction” a second thought before she lived it. She knew what the word meant, but she thought it only happened to weak people.

Knowing that addiction exists did not scare this gurl off trying drugs for so long, when so many other reasons did scare her. And when she saw nice, normal people getting high, all her other reasoning failed her and the thought of her becoming addicted was not even considered.

If explained well, maybe they can be shown a glimpse into the mind of an addict, and maybe, if just for a moment, feel the emotions that addiction draws upon.

All I am offering is the truth, my gurl’s version of the truth anyway....... How addiction changed her personality, her outlook, her perceptions. How it controlled her thoughts, her reasoning, her actions. How all she’d ever dreamed for got lost in it, only to be replaced with guilt and fear and anguish. How she hurt and let down all those she cared about, and all the ones that cared about her, replacing them with people who would sell their soul for another bag and rip her off as soon as she turned her back.

The bitter truth behind life's most captivating lie.

As insulting as it may be, the only difference between you (or your children) and my gurl is a split second decision, a ‘yes’ amongst a hundred identical ‘no’s. A bad day, a misguided belief, a single lapse in judgement, just one time and their guard is down and they no longer have that black and white picture guiding their awareness.

You don't need to see the other side to confirm what you have always been told. If you look too close the clarity falls apart, the truth becomes deceptive and the need to test your understanding takes you on a journey where control is replaced by chance, understanding confused by emotion and decision making tainted with rationalisation, not confirmed by a reality.

Forget about ever falling in love, there is no true belief or security that the person you are in love with is truly in love with you when you don't even know if what you are feeling is real. And addiction will eventually outweigh your love for them, or their love for you, or it will get lost in the lies and the guilt.

And don't count on things getting easier with time, addiction very rarely goes away. You will have to live with it's consequences for the rest of your life, whether high, sick, or on a break and in recovery, you may never live another day free of the urge. Daily anguish. Always craving more than you can afford, always chasing a high you can't reach, wanting to quit but wanting to use more.

Knowing the bad, knowing the hurt and pain you may cause doesn't make you crave any less. You actually crave more, struggling to escape the guilt of still using. If my gurl had had any comprehension of addiction, or the reality of it happening to her, would she have still chosen to use? I don't think so, because before you use you don't know how good it is, you don't know what you are missing.

My gurl could have been stronger if she had a reason too… But at the time she didn't.

This is not to say that everyone who makes the decision to try drugs; or more specifically, makes the decision to try addictive drugs; will one day become an addict. Chances are you will be one of the lucky ones who can just use occasionally, but what if you are not?

No one plans on becoming an addict. No one believes it could happen to them. My gurl was the last person anyone expected would ever head down that path. She was strong willed, self assured, a high achiever. She had loving parents, a strong faith in God and high morals. She was given every opportunity in life to be anything and everything she wanted.

There were risk factors that drug use would lead to addiction for my gurl, but she didn’t know them to be risk factors at the time, she was 21 years old and had never been addicted to anything, surely if she was prone to addiction she would have had some sense of loss of control with her use of alcohol and marijuana, but these drugs she could take them or leave them, they were just something to do on occasion to be social.

But she had in the past suffered from severe depression and suicidal thoughts. There were times when she felt like she had everything she could possibly want in life yet none of it brought her happiness. She was an extremely emotional gurl who felt things deeper than most, sadness would overwhelm her, love overpowered her and desire could drive her to achieve anything she longed for.

It is these parts to her personality that she now realises were risk factors; warning signs; that drugs could also encompass her as totally as other emotions had shown to.

But at the end of the day, no matter how strong or weak you think you are or you think your child is, there is no way to determine whether the drugs or the person will come out on top. There is no way of knowing. It is a chance that some take and win, but many take and lose.

[bcubed]

When I have children, I'd probably try not to dwell on "scare tactics": both because of the whole "it can't happen to ME" factor and the fact that adolescents are innate BS detectors. I'd probably point out that drugs aren't like a saxophone one plays for the marching band and abandons after a few years; if one chooses to do drugs, one will quite likely have a life-long effect--be it positive OR negavite. Wether or not one ever becomes addicted, it's hard to imagine that getting high would have negligibale effect on one's worldview.

Given that, I'd counsel them to at least do their homework and be very deliberitive about what decisions they DO make: i.e. don't just go out and do it on a whim.

Beyond that, if my kid happens to be wired in such a way as to have an innate curiousity towards such things (and I think the odds are good s/he might), I doubt much I say could prevent them from doing whatever they were going to do anyway.

[opus]

Regarding the original question:

When I have children, should I be lucky enough to find a woman who will put up with me, I am going to use everything I ever learned as a child to my advantage. I'm only eighteen, but after my family life and childhood, I know how (not) to raise a child. I've always been a really bright guy, 99th percentile and all that, and during those lonely years, I would pick apart what my parents did wrong and analyze it, vowing never to act in ways that I knew firsthand to be so destructive. That on top of being an atheistic and rebellious motherfucker my whole life means that I know when kids are up to shit, and what parents can do about it.

1) Never lie to your kids past a certain age. Depending on how bright the child is, they're probably going to pick up on any lie, no matter how small, and store it in their memory as an excuse to never ever trust you worth a blood nickel. No trust just means problems; being honest with your teenage kid helps them self-actualize into adulthood, and it lets them know that they really can talk to you about anything.

2) Emphasize individuality, and the freedom of personal choice. Make sure that kids understand these concepts, as well as their repercussions (good and bad). Encourage kids to explore themselves and be open about who they are; never force your beliefs or ideals on anyone, and accept and respect the opinions and beliefs of your children regardless. Reminding kids, especially teens, that they are the only one in control of what they believe and their decisions frees them to be themselves and take pride in who they are.

3) Never blow up, and never freak out. Maintaining a calm and level head when dealing with kids and discipline is the smartest advice I can give anyone. Demonstrate a sense of control over the situation, and use that earned trust to talk things out with your kids. No rash punishments, no parental meltdowns; in these cases, they may well begin to hate you and lose all respect for you, both of which are very difficult to overcome. If you do all this right, you don't have to worry about the kid sneaking out; they'll come explain first, knowing that you're going to be rational in your discussion and decisions.

4) Be your kid's best friend. For all of the shrinks that say otherwise, go to hell shrinks. You can be the grownup and the confidante at the same time, but it means that you can't be power-tripping or dishonest or intolerant. One of my best friends openly calls his father his closest friend, because this is their relationship, and I have never seen a happier or more well-adjusted guy.

So, what does that mean in relation to the topic at hand? Quite a bit. It means that when my kid starts public school drug education around age twelve, I'll introduce the topic, and explain it with regards to both sides of the argument. Supervised (or later, notified) drug use will never be a problem, as long as I remain informed and my child remains responsible. That's what personal freedom is; it is also why reactive parenting beats proactive parenting: if kids never make decisions or mistakes, they will not become well-adjusted human beings, and will only make those mistakes later when you're not around to help them out of tight places.

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@ ~lostgurl~:

Look, I don't wanna come in here raging on anybody. But your post about addiction was so, hmm.... how shall I put it? Stereotypical? Abject? Ridiculous?

The concept of drug use free from the risk of addiction being "life's most captivating lie" is silly, no matter how you look at it. From one perspective, it is no lie at all, and I will go into this momentarily. From another, one could simply say that there are far more captivating lies in the world, perhaps even some we can agree on; for example, while I feel that an omniscient, omnipotent, and omnipresent being may be a more captivating lie, I bet we can both come to the conclusion that some other truism of society is just as, if not more, captivating than the "I can't get addicted" mentality you're referencing. (Please correct me if I have mistaken this reference.)

More pertinent still is the assertion that your "lie" is no lie at all. Take SWIM; bright guy, not bad looking. He's addicted to cigarettes, and he admits to having an addictive personality (in which dependence brings about a sort of comfort). Yet somehow SWIM has managed to be an occasional (5-6 times a year) user of meth and coke for years now, emerging from each experience free of cravings and desire.

"So what," you might say. "I already wrote up there that some occasional users get lucky, and never become addicted." Yes, yes you did. My problem stems from what you tacked onto the end there: "but what if you are not [one of the lucky ones]?"

This small statement, along with the rest of the story, implies that human will, human strength, human nerve, and the human mind have nothing to do with drug addiction. And personally, I think that's a load of bullshit. Over the years, I have seen a lot of seedy people use without addiction, and a lot of "upstanding" people crumble beneath it. Plain and simple, it is about weakness. If you are even halfway put together, with a strong will and rational mind, addiction is not a risk.

Your gurl, "she thought it only happened to weak people", and she was right; if your gurl became addicted, she was weak. She was weak because she failed to maintain control over her using and her life. It takes self-discipline, a strong will, and a powerful self-concept to avoid addiction, but possession of these traits is neither uncommon nor difficult to obtain.

I watched a close friend go on a three week smack binge once, and everyone knows that the best way to get addicted to smack is to go on an extended binge. We told him he was gonna be hooked, but he just kept using. Imagine my surprise when, three weeks to the day, he shows up at my house sober as a fish, no cravings, no mad bloodlust. He had that strength, and that strength is all it takes for me to openly laugh in the face of addiction and dependency.

Summary: Addiction IS for the weak. If you are weak, don't screw around with addictive drugs. Strength and determination and will are all it takes to avoid getting hooked, on drugs or on anything. Either someone has it, or they can develop it, or it's waiting for them to grow up; the point is that this strength is available to anyone who would exert the time and energy to earn it.

[MrG]

Harsh words there from the young chap, but there is an element of truth when it comes to some addicts.

SWIM's brother has been managing a 20 year heroin habit and SWIM respects how he doesn't make it the focal point of his personality. When round his house once, SWIM saw one of his brother's buddies giving it the whole Trainspotting routine simply because their dealer was late. SWIM was told that this particular character was well known to play up to the junkie stereotype and it would drive everybody nuts because he would be banging on about needing, having, using or trying to quit H at every given opportunity.

Addiction is a bitch, no doubt about it, but some people do their cause no favour when they appear to use it as an attempt to validate themselves. In fact one of the characters in Trainspotting is actually spoken about as someone who took up heroin simply because he thought it would make him appear more interesting. SWIM was addicted to cigarettes for many years but when it came time to quit he thought carefully about every aspect of how to successfully kick the habit and, with the help of a book, quit fairly easily. Other smokers seem to flap and gasp like a fish out of water when it comes to trying to quit and never give it proper consideration or thought. They usually spend the rest of their lives *trying* to quit.

Back on topic though:

Extremes of any argument are never going to be valid in respect of how to approach ones children about drugs.

My personal opinion is that the question is not answered by thinking "how do I encourage my children to think the right way about drugs"

The actual parenting rule, noticeable by its absence so far (maybe not enough parents have replied yet?), is this:

"How do I encourage my children to think?"

*That* is the be all and end all of parenting when it comes to any hot topic.

SWIM is a militant atheist (with a predilection for Pastafarianism of course) but he still feels that his children need more than to hear his side of the story. After all, it took him 36 years and a whole load of good and bad experiences to reach the level of understanding he has now, there is no way on earth one could simply tell a kid that they have to accept what you say simply because you yourself have reached a certain conclusion.

SWIM himself has skated on some dangerously thin ice when it comes to his recreational substance use, but he has developed an ingrained sense of life quality evaluation i.e. At fairly regular points in his life he like to take a moment to do a quick "system check" of introspection and, where needed, takes appropriate action to get back on track.

So what's the difference between this sort of a behaviour and a "habitual addict"? SWIM makes the effort to be aware of subtle changes and to ensure he is maintaining his desired quality of life. Like flying a jumbo jet, regular small adjustments avoid the need for emergency maneuvers.

Passing on these learned skills is what is important. As the title of the thread states, one needs to talk to kids *about* drug use, abuse and addiction. But in order to avoid them simply ignoring the warnings, one needs to encourage them to regularly evaluate what they hear, experience and actually know about what is happening to them and around them as they grow up in a world where drug use is both tightly controlled and widely prevalent.

[Micutzul]

Regarding Opus' post . Addiction is for the weak ...in bold letters .

First of all , you are still alive. As long as you are alive , there is a chance you might still become addicted even though you are so strong ( no pun intended , i will actually asume that you are as strong-willed as you state ) . No one started out as an addict , some became addicted after two weekes , others have played with fire for years until they finally got burnt . So just because you managed to stay un-hooked so far , it is not a guarantee that you will manage this all your life . Now i don't think you'll state that you're superhuman so you'll agree that even the strongest of humans will give up at times , they will go through some tough shit ,and everybody will be on the edge at a certain time in their lives . Maybe even real heavy shit . So , you being human , we can assume you will also go through this , and there you go ....a situation in which your strength will mean very little , a situation in which wether you become addicted or not is more a matter of chance than control , like Lostgurl stated . Just imagine this , things go sour . You get busted for meth or coke , both have a big prison sentence . Maybe you are extra careful , maybe you take every little precaution , but there is still a chance . Let's say you get 2 years ( i don't know about the laws in your country ,but let's say 2 years is not an exceptionally harsh time for schedule I drugs . ) Can you guarantee that won't crack you up ? That it won't break you down to the point that you might become an addict in prison ( drugs are present in many prison ) .

If you already passed through the corectional system , than just imagine another , even worse experience .

Now , another point . What about genetical predisposition to addictive behaviour in general , or a substance in particular ? Research shows the distinct possibily of the existance of nicotine-addiction enforcing genes . And if nicotine , why not others drugs ? Be as strong-willed as you want , but you can't change your genetics ( for the time being ). So , what might have been easier for you , might be a lot harder for someone else .


Oh , and in case you don't know , nicotine is most likely the MOST addictive substance for humans . ( look it up ) . So , you by being an addicted smoker , have already sucumbed to the greatest of challenges . That means you're not that strong . So maybe you should revise your atittude . Just a recommandation . Also , your opinion is appreciated and respected , but you should also appreciate and respect other's opinions . AND "Abject? Ridiculous?" is not respectful, considering Lostgurl posted a very deep , rational ,justified opinion , backed up by her personal experience. Think about it

[sweetsugar]

Originally Posted by opus

Addiction IS for the weak. If you are weak, don't screw around with addictive drugs. Strength and determination and will are all it takes to avoid getting hooked, on drugs or on anything. Either someone has it, or they can develop it, or it's waiting for them to grow up; the point is that this strength is available to anyone who would exert the time and energy to earn it.

Swiss would have to agree. Swiss has HAD an addiction, but only because she let it happen, in all truth. - this is for another thread!

Swiss would like her children to be honest with her about drugs etc, just how swiss would be honest - depending on the childs age. Also for first time experiences to be in the company of swiss, again depending on age & also drug. Lack of respect, trust, honesty etc will only result in a very rebelious teen..

[Micutzul]

I would seriously invest time and effort in finding a way to prevent my child from using any drugs until the age of 21 . The use of drugs in this period alters and impairs the natural development of the body , and specifically the brain .

But i admit , it would be very hard if not nearly damn impossible to do this and it might even result in exactly the opposite . But , personally , i don't think of myself as a potentially good father and so , i don't intend to have kids . Having a child is a very important matter , and you either do it right , or you don't do it all . My opinion .

[sweetsugar]

Originally Posted by Micutzul

I would seriously invest time and effort in finding a way to prevent my child from using any drugs until the age of 21 . The use of drugs in this period alters and impairs the natural development of the body , and specifically the brain .
.

Lol, DAMN swiss's brain must be pretty f**ked up then...