View Full Version : Oral use - Sublingual Administration of Benzodiazepines
RealGanjaMan
09-06-2006, 03:59
Hi everyone,
I have a few Q's about Sublingual Administration, that I need answered before SWIM heads out tonight. SWIM has two 1mg lorazepam sublingual pills, and he wants to take them tonight. He has never used Sublingual Administration, and is not quite sure how to do it. He knows to put the pills under your tongue. He knows you let them dissolve. But do you have to let the dissolved powder/saliva absorb into your mouth before swallowing?
Also, does swallowing while the pills are dissolving cause any problems?
Thanks,
-RGM
IHrtHalucingens
09-06-2006, 18:43
Just pop em under your tongue, like you stated, wait for them to dissolve then swollow any extra saliva there may be. Itsa been SWIMs experience that benzos dissolve very quickly under the tongue and are absorbed almost intsantly. Just wait until its totally dissolved then swallow, it hits you hard and fast, pretty close to snorting (with water soluble substances).
RealGanjaMan
10-06-2006, 02:57
Thanks, SWIM did just what you mentioned. It worked fine.
K+
-RGM
csharpprogrammer
14-11-2006, 01:55
I keep reading that the best route of administration for benzodiazepine pills is by holding it under your tounge. I am completely new to this route of administration. For example SWIM wants a little clonazepam buzz... does swim put one 0.5mg tablet under his tounge until it disolves completely then put another until he reaches his desired effects? How long until effects are noticed?
Also does the pill have to be designated for sublingual use, and what is the duration and power of the effects as opposed to oral administration? Thanks.
Riconoen {UGC}
14-11-2006, 20:19
swim always puts a kpin under his tongue, he feels a rush of benzo calmness almost instantly. it takes about 1.5 mills for swim to feel high and not just calm though.
Heh, SWIY should try using Ambien sublingually sometime. Separates the men from the Godzillas... :D Anyone who can do it without puking deserves respect. It does take effect faster, but that taste could keep someone awake for a week...
csharpprogrammer
18-11-2006, 04:56
For sublingual administration, all you do is let the pill disolve under your tounge?
For sublingual administration, all you do is let the pill disolve under your tounge?
Yes... it won't always lead to the drug taking effect faster though, but often it will (at least with initial effects; typically you won't get the full effect until digested, unless the pill is specifically designed for sublingual admin).
Also, the flavor/consistency of many tablets makes them bad choices for sublingual use, but most benzodiazepines taste mildly sweet/chalky.
From the rules (http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/announcement.php?f=35&a=1):
• Use descriptive Topic Subject. This will help others find what they want to read. Topics with bad Topic subjects may be deleted! - there's nothing more annoying than looking at all those stupid "A stupid question" subject lines. I mean, I'm damn lazy, but how hard is it to type "A stupid question about (insert something here)"? As a rule of thumb, most thread titles should include the full name of the drug discussed.
A rule many tend to forget will cause a mass of warnings soon... (http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23289)
Thread title edited to include "Benzodiazepines"
Psych0naut
18-11-2006, 12:33
So SWIM is a gorrila then, Nicaine :D After a night on amphetamines, SWIM always takes some sleeping pills sublingually, which work great.
When SWIM takes 2 zolpidems sublingually, he's knocked out cold within 10 minutes, like he drank a whole bottle of whiskey.
SWIM always get's a good night sleep if he takes some zolpidems, it really makes a big difference the next morning, having had some sleep.
Though the metallic bitter taste of them is so awfull, SWIM found out last night that midazolam has the same nasty metallic taste as well, yuck!
Would this work well for Xanax?
Xanax is one of the quicker acting benzos anyway, but yes it would work (although possibly taste bad!)
Xanax is one of the quicker acting benzos anyway, but yes it would work (although possibly taste bad!)
Yeah, SWIM was too impatient for a response so he tried it himself. It definitely worked but it was an awful taste. It took SWIM about 30 minutes to get the taste out of his mouth after using plenty of fluids and a cough drop.
Riconoen {UGC}
30-11-2006, 07:28
kpins dont taste like anything and hit you fast. choose kpin!
lol i swear ric is the walking klonopin. like the marlboro man but sexier
radiometer
30-11-2006, 21:02
One can purchase banana-flavored sublingual clonazepam. I can hardly imagine how disgusting it would be to take alprazolam sublingually.
Psych0naut
30-11-2006, 21:41
The binders in the pill probaply make a difference in taste as well. SWIM recently took a Roche 7.5mg midazolam sublingually, which tasted very discustingly bitter, like zolpidem and zopiclone.
When he took several 10mg oxazepams he didn't taste a thing, except for the same binders he tasted when he took melatonine sublingually.
One can purchase banana-flavored sublingual clonazepam. I can hardly imagine how disgusting it would be to take alprazolam sublingually.having a presc to the 1mg alpazolam footballs i have to say it doesnt taste too bad or good. its salty and mildy sweet. banana flavored clonazepam sound just neat.
recently my alpazolam presc was changed to lorazepam 1mg and i tried that sublingually and it wasnt as bad tasting as alpazolam but the pills seemed more suited for sublingual use because when i pressed down on the pill it seemed to mold. so seems more soluable than alpazolam. and the taste was nowhere near as bad as alprazolam
Riconoen {UGC}
01-12-2006, 02:21
lol i swear ric is the walking klonopin. like the marlboro man but sexier
:beer hahaha that made my day.
SWIM got a hold of 2 10mg diazepams. SWIM will be taking 5mg sublingually with some MJ and 10mg when he gets home to sleep. :)
im glad to hear that ric haha
radiometer
01-12-2006, 03:22
Minor point: It seems to me that sublingual use of alprazolam is not very useful - when SWIM takes alprazolam orally, it takes less than 5 minutes for the effects to take hold.
thats true but it does hit you imo a minute or 2 i start feeling it. it could be just me but it takes much less than 5 min, a good dose would be whatever the SWIMs tolerance half the dose sublingually and half orally for an even nice effect.
AchaeaPerson
05-12-2006, 00:27
SWIA doesn't really get all the talk about bad taste with sublingual administration of pharms, he just puts the powder under his tongue, and if he doesn't move his tongue around much (keeping the powder UNDER his tongue) he doesn't taste it at all.
csharpprogrammer
07-12-2006, 19:16
SWIM notices that if he injests benzodiazepines too late at night, he will not get the desired effect. SWIM's theory is that his digestive system slows down late at night. SWIM would like to know if sublingual administration of benzodiazepines or other pharms would maybe be more efficiant for late night administrations. Could someone please explain the process of digestion and if a substance is completely absorbed in the mouth when taken sublingually?
csharpprogrammer
25-02-2007, 07:05
The binders in the pill probaply make a difference in taste as well. SWIM recently took a Roche 7.5mg midazolam sublingually, which tasted very discustingly bitter, like zolpidem and zopiclone.
When he took several 10mg oxazepams he didn't taste a thing, except for the same binders he tasted when he took melatonine sublingually.
How did SWIY feel with 7.5 mg sublingual? SWIM has 5mg in liquid form and wants to know what the effects would be.
csharpprogrammer
20-03-2007, 01:59
Could some SWIY please answer my last two posts?!?!?
longdistancerunner
13-05-2007, 04:21
Could some SWIY please answer my last two posts?!?!?
Well, swim took 6mg clonezepam intranasaly last night....just to see if it really did anything special or different than ingestion, and, in accordance with general opinion in the "snorting benzos" thread....it didnt....Tonight...or, more accurately, right now, swim is trying 7mg sublingually and if he doesn't feel anything interesting he'll report back later. Swim will also be taking 5mg oxycodone, and possibly, depending on how that treats him, 20mg amphetamine. One thing swim notices with both snorting, and sublingual administration of kpins is a distinct "cold" feeling....does swia know the reason for this?
EDIT: 7mg sublingually of clonezepam gave swim a much more pronounced, yet shorter lasting peak....after the one percocet swim took kicked in he passed out for about 4 hours....even after taking a 20mg adderol xr to avoid sleep. Overall, swim highly reccommends the sublingual route for clonezepam, for he has an extreme tolerance and takes up to 20mg oral and is still awake and functioning...
EDIT again after reading Benzeneringz post: Swim hadn't eaten anything for 7+ hours and this may be the reason he felt so much more from 7mg sublingual than he would normally.
Benzeneringz
13-05-2007, 05:51
Sublingual administration of benzodiazepine-derivatives is an excellent alternative to oral administration. There are many journal enteries that describe oral v. sublingual administration. I'm going to list portions of a few of them, with the benzodiazepine being discussed in parenthesis and the reference number at the end of the article.
(Clotiazepam) Compared with oral tablets the sublingual route gave a lower peak concentration and a delayed peak time, while drops gave a greater maximum concentration with a similar peak time. [1]
(Alprazolam) ...thus, alprazolam absorption following sublingual administration is as rapid as after oral dosage on an empty stomach, and completeness of absorption is comparable. In clinical terms, sublingual and oral dosages of alprazolam are likely to be therapeutically equivalent. [2]
(Triazolam) ...thus, the bioavailability of triazolam after sublingual administration is increased by an average of 28% compared with oral administration of the same dose, possibly because first-pass extraction is bypassed. Clinical effects of triazolam may likewise be enhanced by sublingual dosage. [3]
(Lorazepam) The time for the maximal plasma concentration (tmax) occurred 40 min after oral administration and 60 min after sublingual administration. No significant differences were found between the two treatments at any time. [4]
These abstracts suggest that sublingual administration v. oral administration should be investigated per benzodiazepine in question. It is accurate to say that sublingual administration is no LESS effective than oral administration. I think we all forget sometimes how important stomach content is when considering the time to peak plasma concentration. This is expecially true with benzodiazepines since they are as lipid-soluble as other drugs (i.e. amphetamine). What does this all mean? I think that sublingual administration of any benzodiazepine is a good idea, unless your stomach is and has been empty for 6+ hours. SWIM's personal experience with sublingual administration involves temazepam. Temazepam is found in capsules, not tablets. SWIM has always found that emptying the powder under his tongue brings effects in 5 minutes, approximately. Swallowing the capsule took over 20 minutes for him. Clonazepam, lorazepam, and diazepam have all been taken orally, but only clonazepam and lorazepam both sublingually and orally, with no differences in effects noted. Alprazolam has been tried both ways and SWIM prefers sublingual administration to oral administration. Hope this helps.
[1]. http://www.springerlink.com/content/v72413q7v4781472/
[2]. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=3680603&dopt=Abstract
[3]. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?itool=abstractplus&db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=abstractplus&list_uids=3958225
[4]. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=3410611&dopt=Abstract
^^^ Any chance SWIY could get hold of the articles and post them in the archive benzeneringz?
Benzeneringz
15-05-2007, 00:24
You bet. I'll track down some more reguarding other specific benzodiazepines and their sublingual bioavailability v. their oral bioavailability. This is a topic that should interest everyone since benzodiazepines are encountered very frequently in this day and age. One wants the best bang for their buck, if you know what I mean.
My zebra tells me that diazepam/valium hits fairly quickly with sublingual administration, and it doesn't really taste bad at all, especially compared to some of the other pills out there.
radiometer
23-06-2007, 06:34
It seems to me that sublingual use of alprazolam is not very useful - when SWIM takes alprazolam orally, it takes less than 5 minutes for the effects to take hold.
alprazolam absorption following sublingual administration is as rapid as after oral dosage on an empty stomach, and completeness of absorption is comparable
I'm glad to see my suspicions confirmed WRT alprazolam.
Pubmed on Sublingual vs. Oral Administration of Standard Alprazolam:
Thirteen healthy volunteers received 1 mg of alprazolam, as the commercially available oral tablet, by sublingual and oral routes on two occasions in random sequence. Plasma alprazolam concentrations during 48 hours after each dose were measured by electron-capture gas-liquid chromatography. The peak plasma concentration after sublingual dosage was higher than after oral administration (17.3 vs. 14.9 ng/ml), and the time of peak concentration following sublingual administration was reached (1.17 vs. 1.73 hours after dose). However, these differences did not reach statistical significance. The mean total area under the plasma concentration curve for sublingual administration was slightly but not significantly larger than that following oral dosage (203.7 vs. 194.4 hr.ng/ml) and no significant differences between sublingual and oral dosage were found for elimination half-life (11.7 vs. 11.8 hours) or for clearance (86.4 vs. 92.4 ml/min). Thus, alprazolam absorption following sublingual administration is as rapid as after oral dosage on an empty stomach, and completeness of absorption is comparable. In clinical terms, sublingual and oral dosages of alprazolam are likely to be therapeutically equivalent. The sublingual route may be a useful alternative for panic disorder patients who cannot swallow pills or for those who do not have access to a liquid at the time of dosing.
J. Clin. Psychopharm. 1987 Oct;7(5):332-4.
(http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&DbFrom=pubmed&Cmd=Link&LinkName=pubmed_pubmed&LinkReadableName=Related%20Articles&IdsFromResult=3680603&ordinalpos=1&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsP anel.Pubmed_RVAbstract)
Alprazolam kinetics following sublingual and oral administration.
Scavone J.M., Greenblatt, DJ Shader, RI.
Division of Clinical Pharmacology, Tufts University School of Medicine, Boston, Massachusetts.
Thirteen healthy volunteers received 1 mg of alprazolam, as the commercially available oral tablet, by sublingual and oral routes on two occasions in random sequence. Plasma alprazolam concentrations during 48 hours after each dose were measured by electron-capture gas-liquid chromatography. The peak plasma concentration after sublingual dosage was higher than after oral administration (17.3 vs. 14.9 ng/ml), and the time of peak concentration following sublingual administration was reached (1.17 vs. 1.73 hours after dose). However, these differences did not reach statistical significance. The mean total area under the plasma concentration curve for sublingual administration was slightly but not significantly larger than that following oral dosage (203.7 vs. 194.4 hr.ng/ml) and no significant differences between sublingual and oral dosage were found for elimination half-life (11.7 vs. 11.8 hours) or for clearance (86.4 vs. 92.4 ml/min). Thus, alprazolam absorption following sublingual administration is as rapid as after oral dosage on an empty stomach, and completeness of absorption is comparable. In clinical terms, sublingual and oral dosages of alprazolam are likely to be therapeutically equivalent. The sublingual route may be a useful alternative for panic disorder patients who cannot swallow pills or for those who do not have access to a liquid at the time of dosing.
Abstract from pubmed.com Don't have access to full text, sorry!
Heh, SWIY should try using Ambien sublingually sometime. Separates the men from the Godzillas... :D Anyone who can do it without puking deserves respect. It does take effect faster, but that taste could keep someone awake for a week...
heh swim just chewed two 2x 1mg alprazolam. then took 2 roche 10mg valium sublingually.. an hour has gone and swim isnt feeling too shabby after a night of speed and intensely draining activities... but hes got another 2x10 diazepam under his tongue right now. as soon as those are melted swims gonna be sure to brush his teeth!!! he did go for some sublingual n gum rubbing on the speed. might also be noteworthy that swim had shwinged on speed the past 2 days as well, but then had good alprazolam (xanax) access. he'd pop 2-4 mg at the end of a roll and felt more or less normal, seeing as he forcefed himself porridge a couple of days it was alright. its only annoying when you "Forget to eaT"... although swim has limited experience in all of these substances he noted the addiction potential and well.. right now there is no more alprazolam or speed (went through 5 grams last week and it was farily good..) although tonight it was REALLY good. Honest man swim knew, he said it was 87% because he'd get nosebleeds unless he mixed it.
Right now swim has only got 6x 10mg roche valiums left (pointing out that generic brands usually dont contain 10mg as stated but often 7mg)
Nicaine, SWIM is now godzilla. Last night he took zolpide sublingual.. although mayb eonly baby godzilla, perhaps the 100mg of valium and 2mg of xanax chewed and sublingual beforehand... not to mention the rubbing of speed on his gums n swallowed mixed in water had warmde him up.
SWIM isnt the type of guy who would do something just to be cool like.. Jackass/dirty sanchez... the qiuck come on felt necessary at that point.
Big Fella
10-09-2007, 21:55
SWIBF noticed that a 10mg Valium under his tongue has a far greater effect than if swallowed, so much so that SWIBF will no longer swallow a Valium again.
SWIBF needs to convince his doctor that the psychological improvments are vastly superior to Effexor, which he feels have done nothing but delay certain maritial functions.
SWIBF finds that he is more motivated and focused when he has taken Valium, and feels more himself, euphoria aside.
Laudaphun
03-02-2008, 02:50
SWIM notices that if he injests benzodiazepines too late at night, he will not get the desired effect. SWIM's theory is that his digestive system slows down late at night. SWIM would like to know if sublingual administration of benzodiazepines or other pharms would maybe be more efficiant for late night administrations. Could someone please explain the process of digestion and if a substance is completely absorbed in the mouth when taken sublingually?
SWIM notices the exact same thing. If SWIM takes benzos late at night as she usually does, there will be a noticable effect, however on occasion when SWIM requires a benzo earlier in the day, the effect seems much stronger. Not sure why this might be.
robo scat
08-04-2008, 05:32
My blind ferret has TWO yellow .5 mg clonazepam, and would like to get the best bang for his buck. He'd prefer to take them sublingually, but he's not sure if he should crush them first or let the whole pill dissolve under his tongue.
Can anybody help my poor blind ferret?? :s
darkbreed
04-05-2008, 10:56
Of the worst tasting benzos I can't think of any that tops Alprazolam. Lorazepam ain't exactly vanilla either.
The better tasting ones are flunitrazepam, clonazepam and temazepam (mm sugar). Bromazepam is sweet. Diazepam is alright too.
Midazolam is a bit too close the funky side of taste for me, but bareable compared to alprazolam and lorazepam.
UpAllNiteOCXTC
05-05-2008, 04:58
SWIM is kinda pissed. She had 20 0.25mg xanax, now she's got probably 6. And she got em yesterday. Last night's experience was fun, what she remembers of it (haha) but today she took about 6 of em, some subligual and nothing happened.
Swim does agree that snorting is stupid because of the binders and fillers, and nose damage, but Swim finds that the ONLY way to get high off xanax is to insufflate!
Is this a tolerance issue? Should swim parachute them? Swim has a few left and is wondering which route to take them. So hurry up and respond. lol
raven3davis
05-05-2008, 07:03
SWIM is kinda pissed. She had 20 0.25mg xanax, now she's got probably 6. And she got em yesterday. Last night's experience was fun, what she remembers of it (haha) but today she took about 6 of em, some subligual and nothing happened.
Swim does agree that snorting is stupid because of the binders and fillers, and nose damage, but Swim finds that the ONLY way to get high off xanax is to insufflate!
Is this a tolerance issue? Should swim parachute them? Swim has a few left and is wondering which route to take them. So hurry up and respond. lol
Just swallow them. Parachute isn't going to make too big of a difference. This is most likely a tolerance issue. Benzos aren't water soluble so insufflation isn't going to do anything special. No rush, no ringers, really no reason to snort benzos.
http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3372
SWIM has some experience taking various benzos sub lingually. In his experience, if the taste is bearable, there is no reason not to take it sub lingually. It certainly won't make the drug inactive, unless of course you are already intoxicated and most of the chemical escapes your mouth through the puddle of drool you leave behind.
UpAllNiteOCXTC
05-05-2008, 07:11
yeah, swim read that thread and got kind of sick of reading so much...
what dose does swiy usually take recreationally (if at all) ? Right now swim is up to 1.25mg. Thinkin of going up to either 1.75 or 2 but is reluctant cause she'll just fall asleep. no point.
darkbreed
05-05-2008, 08:57
SWIM gets 60 x 2mg alprazolam pills a month, a long with 60 x 2mg clonazepam, and currently 30 x 20mg diazepam and 30 x 15 mg midazolam.
2mg works fine for SWIM with the alprazolam, its nice for sleep and SWIM also gets pretty stoney and comfortable from one of those. 2mg of clonazepam doesnt do anything other than "normalizing" the head if on a cracker-jack day. Diazepam has better muscle relaxant and somewhat pleasent effect in 10-20mg. Midazolam is not much of interest so far, at least not staying up on. SWIM took 15 mg and went to bed with alarm clock on to wake up 1.5 hours later but slept so good alarm clock was not even heard. But when swim takes midazolam awake it gets him pretty relaxed but not much effects compared to the other benzos. SWIM just took 4mg clonazepam, 10mg diazepam and 45mg midazolam and feel pretty comfortably numb but not very stoned or drugged up, motor skills all fine, thinking clear, not feeling tired.
But SWIM DO have a hard head for most drugs, something proven through years, what seems to be enough for swim to barely feel it, can knock outters right out, and its always been that way so not about buildt up tolerance or anything. Maybe swims body chemistry is just buggered, or it doesnt absorb it properly.
Not sure of reduced GABA in the brain could have anything to do with it
Laudaphun
15-05-2008, 05:50
Of the worst tasting benzos I can't think of any that tops Alprazolam. Lorazepam ain't exactly vanilla either.
The better tasting ones are flunitrazepam, clonazepam and temazepam (mm sugar). Bromazepam is sweet. Diazepam is alright too.
Midazolam is a bit too close the funky side of taste for me, but bareable compared to alprazolam and lorazepam.
Agreed, alprazolam is too unpleasant tasting to try sublingual use... plus they take effect fairly quickly by swallowing them. However, if you want to find a benzo that's taste far exceeds the unpleasantness of alprazolam, just taste a chlordiazepoxide sometime. Probably not an experience you would be willing to repeat.
SWIM has to disagree on temazepam... while she has never found any benefit to using it subligually, she is very familiar with it's taste which seems to be null. At least the 2 generic brands she is accustomed to, seem to be devoid of any taste. Actually, from one or two trials, SWIM actually thinks it works better just swallowing it, as effects seem to develop very quickly.
No experience with midzolam, flunitrazepam or bromazepam. Can't remember what diazepam tastes like, it's been too long. Clonazepam on the otherhand tastes like a very mild breathe mint to SWIM. She actually finds it a very pleasant taste and is the only benzo she will take sublingually... that's assuming she has a full stomach.
Can't remember what diazepam tastes like, it's been too long. Clonazepam on the otherhand tastes like a very mild breathe mint to SWIM. She actually finds it a very pleasant taste and is the only benzo she will take sublingually... that's assuming she has a full stomach.
Swim would describe diazepam's taste as alprazolam-lite. It has a bit of a bitter aftertaste and chemical taste that reminds him of xanax, but not nearly so bad. If he has to chew up a bunch of it the taste gets bad enough that he needs to rinse his mouth with water, but its far better than alprazolam he feels.
Clonazepam is the best tasting benzo to take sublingually in swim's opinion. Depends on which one you get (brand / generic variety), some taste like they are sweetened while others are more neutral in taste, but still good compared to many other vile tasting benzos.
superwoman
15-05-2008, 15:39
Swim also notices a similar minty/cooling sensation when snorting kpins. It is odd... (and Swim has no idea why...)
But after seeing this post, Swim will likely use kpins sublingually...
Politicalchalk
31-05-2008, 19:47
SWIM has heard many people say that lorazepam and alprazoloam are able to ingested both by swallowing, or by holding under the tounge (sublingual). SWIM's dog takes Suboxone, a sunlingual form of buprenorphine, so he knows that products MUST be formulated to be taken one way vs. the other.
But many have said this is not the case, with lorazepam and alprazolam. Are we talking about the same thing? Or is the "hold it under your tounge method" just happen to work with these two. SWIM's yet to try it, because he does not pharmacologically believe it would work, ie: any effects would be from you gradually swallowing the substance. Even Pharamacist Jim agrees. Again, there are first-pass subingual products (Nivram, or Nirvam for alprazolam, as opposed to a Xanax tablet). Is this some freaky coincidence of serendipity? An unintended molocule shape which just fits the sublingual ports?
It is possible to absorb benzos sublingually. SWIM has done it with alprazolam, lorazepam, and clonazepam. The potential benefit in this situation is that the benzo avoids the first-pass effect (mainly the liver metabolizing some of the med) by introducing it right into the bloodstream.
Politicalchalk
01-06-2008, 19:08
GForce, do you have any information regarding the query? Again, sublingual preparations, according to pharmacists and manufacturers, must be made specifically to taken sublingually. For instance, if the dog swallows his sublingual product, he'll get sick and will likely lose most of the active chemical.
On experience, would say, 2mg lorazepam orally have the same effects as 2mg sublingually? If I understand it correctly, it'll be harder, faster, stronger, and likewise shorter (duration). But SWIM can find NOTHING in the PI sheet which claims anything about sublingual administration (unless "parenteral" falls into this category), just oral admin. and IV, IM. No Sub-L.
Also, sub-note: lorazepam does not get metabolized by the liver at all. Glucoridation only, Swibg thinks.
EndlessKnight
08-06-2008, 00:59
Check out this post.
http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showpost.php?p=259030&postcount=28
WashHeights187
16-07-2008, 23:05
Yes SWIM lets Kpins dissolve under tongue but cannot stand the taste of Xanax, so if he has Xanax he just swallows them whole. You should be very thankful that you have a scip for Kpins. Doctors are giving away Benzo scips like they use to.
What would swiy say the benefit of dissolving kpins are as opposed to swallowing them whole? Do they take effect faster that way? Swim agress, even when swallowing whole the bitterness and chalkiness of xanax stick are gross. Swim must say, however, that suboxone( which MUST be dissolved under the tongue ) is NASTY!!! Like a bitter, awful combination of rotten sunny delight with aspirin, if one can imagine that.
Does swiy mean doctors AREN'T giving out benzo scrips like they used to? It is actually funny cuz swim's doctor is also a drug counselor, as well as a psychologist, and knows swims addiction history. Luckily swim has a very good relationship with her, a complete trust which is rare nowadays. Swim gets the 1mg, 30 count, once a month. not too shabby I suppose, although swim would prefer the 2 mg
WhoreHouse
16-07-2008, 23:57
What would swiy say the benefit of dissolving kpins are as opposed to swallowing them whole? Do they take effect faster that way? Swim agress, even when swallowing whole the bitterness and chalkiness of xanax stick are gross. Swim must say, however, that suboxone( which MUST be dissolved under the tongue ) is NASTY!!! Like a bitter, awful combination of rotten sunny delight with aspirin, if one can imagine that.
Does swiy mean doctors AREN'T giving out benzo scrips like they used to? It is actually funny cuz swim's doctor is also a drug counselor, as well as a psychologist, and knows swims addiction history. Luckily swim has a very good relationship with her, a complete trust which is rare nowadays. Swim gets the 1mg, 30 count, once a month. not too shabby I suppose, although swim would prefer the 2 mg
Yes. SWIM believes taking benzos under the tongue take affect much more quickly than swallowing. Kpins dont taste bad at all. In fact swims mouth feels a little numb after taking kpins via under the tongue.
Swim said that doctors are not writing scrips for benzo's as much because 7-8 years ago swim would go to any doctor and say I'm having panic attacks and the doc would ask a few questions and then write a scrip. Today it seems docs want to put you on an SSRI and send you to a psych before they put you on a Benzo.
fiveleggedrat
14-08-2008, 05:15
Swim is currently conducting experiments with himself and alprazolam regarding sublingual, he just put .5mg under his tongue. He used all sublingual the over day but he does not remember it at all, it was high dose usage. He has a full stomach and it will take too long for it to hit, and he has to be sober in 12 hours exactly. His last oral usage took much longer to get out. He does not like snorting things anymore, especially pills.
Fuck the taste of this generic 2mg xanax though. Alprazolam tastes like shit. Smooth snorting though. Eww. So nasty.
He feels some effects so far from it. It's been 10 min, might be placebo. He'll post more conclusive results after the 1mg total is used. That's enough for him to get nice and calm.
WashHeights187
14-08-2008, 23:52
Swim is currently conducting experiments with himself and alprazolam regarding sublingual, he just put .5mg under his tongue. He used all sublingual the over day but he does not remember it at all, it was high dose usage. He has a full stomach and it will take too long for it to hit, and he has to be sober in 12 hours exactly. His last oral usage took much longer to get out. He does not like snorting things anymore, especially pills.
Fuck the taste of this generic 2mg xanax though. Alprazolam tastes like shit. Smooth snorting though. Eww. So nasty.
He feels some effects so far from it. It's been 10 min, might be placebo. He'll post more conclusive results after the 1mg total is used. That's enough for him to get nice and calm.
Swim also dislikes the chalky taste os xanax bars, but swim has never sublungually taken them....always go for down the hatch. Swim finds xanax as someone else had so cleverly referenced "the crack of benzos." Swim is tending to agree, although he still enjoys the xanax high. For instance yesterday, before going to the Mike Gordon show in NYC, Swim took 4 2mg bars. Get that woozy, dreamy good feeling ( the rush?) but swim can never manage to stay awake after about 2 hours in this state.
This is shy swim advocates for klonopin, which is what swim has a scrip for. I think swim would be a full on benzo junkie with a xanaxa scrip, klonopin gives the same effect( slightly less euphoric swim notes ) and last much longer, not to mention the ability to stay awake!~
Politicalchalk
15-08-2008, 04:16
Oh Man, you missed Mike because of some downers?!?! Drrrraaaaaggggg!
fiveleggedrat
15-08-2008, 06:07
Swim usually gets drunk off 1mg alprazolam orally.
1mg sublingually did just about nothing. Swim thinks the little he felt was most likely placebo. Weird?
Swim's friend reported getting more out of alprazolam eating it and opposed to sub as well, Swim told his friend to try it before he had a nonworking experience with it.
allyourbase
15-08-2008, 11:02
swim is a large man. 25 years of age, 220 pounds, athletic.
Swims experience for threshhold noticeable activity with xanax is:
.5 mg insufflated
1 Mg sublingual
2 mg oral
swim advises to swish some lemon juice about with the material if using sublingually. doesnt exactly improve the taste, but it seems to make the taste fade faster and the substance kick in more quickly.
WashHeights187
15-08-2008, 17:18
Oh Man, you missed Mike because of some downers?!?! Drrrraaaaaggggg!
Noooo way swim was in the house!!!! Just xanax'ed up was all
WashHeights187 added 10 Minutes and 35 Seconds later...
Oh Man, you missed Mike because of some downers?!?! Drrrraaaaaggggg!
missed the opening act, called the Bridge, never heard of them. They had a decent beatboxer, I know that, cuz he came out to jam with Mike and Co.
Politicalchalk
23-08-2008, 15:47
Swim should mention that he doesn't think sub-l administration is possible, but more, wouldn't the manufacturer have to design a tablet specifically for sub-l? Suboxone (buprenorphine) is case in point. If one takes it sub-l, fine, because that's how it's designed; however, swallowed will result in a drastic loss of active drug, not to mention an upset tummy!
Checking a few journal entries, Swim's found no mention about if the tablets were designed specially for the study or not. Swim's heard a lot of anecdotal evidence, but his instincts tell him that it's placebo and the benzo-mush that accumulates under the tounge is just gradually swallowed, intentionally or otherwise.
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PS - While on the topic, I actually got to meet Mike once. He just happened to stop his golf-cart in front of my tent @ Coventry! Phishead's dream! (...well, the real dream was to hear the boston symphony orchestra perform Gamehenge, but nooooooo, Trey pulls a fast one. Still upset about that!)
fiveleggedrat
17-09-2008, 05:04
Swim reports that attempting both alprazolam and lorazepam sublingual (regular oral pills, not special sub-l ones) failed.
Doses of up to 1.5mg alprazolam, pretty much wasted. Maybe a buzz.
Doses of up to 3mg lorazepam, likewise. Woulda felt 2x as much dropping orally.
One would assume they would cause at least effects consistent with oral, since at the least, all of the pills are going into the body.